Think future DIL is trying to separate us from our DS

[LifeAndThymes]

DS moved out from our home about 4 years ago, to set up home with his then girlfriend, which we were over the moon about. However she subsequently cheated on him, several times, and, understandably, they split up. Only 5 months later he started dating another young woman and she moved in with him after 8 months together which I thought was fast, especially as she had a daughter, 7 years old at the time, but she seemed very nice and sweet so I was happy for DS. Since then however I've started to see a different side of her and worry she's trying to take over DS's life and stop him being so close to his family, especially as DS is so gentle and will do anything for anyone so might be a 'soft touch' for her to control.

It's difficult to make clear what I mean as it's every day/week things but some major things are;

They moved 170 miles away 6 months ago when DS had always lived in the same town, with all his close family and friends and most of his extended family here, and he'd never before even hinted at wanting to move away.

They got engaged last month when I know DS wasn't at all keen before on marriage after the betrayal of his last girlfriend, so I'm assuming she instigated the idea. They're already talking about dates in a year or so, so it's not a long engagement type thing.

They came to us for Christmas last year but mentioned about having to alternate Christmas Day between our family and her parents as we're now too far away to do both in one day, which left me reeling as we've always spent Christmas together as a family, DD and her now DH have been happy to do the same (SonIL sees his mother in the evening but they live close to us). No idea what Christmas will be like without DS, and DIL-to-be hinted that they might have some Christmases for just the 3 of them so I don't know how many family ones we'll even have.

On a smaller but far more frequent scale I feel DIL constantly tries to control my DS's life and doesn't want any input from me or my DH (DS's father) to interrupt that. Often I'll suggest something to DS or give some (asked for) advice and he'll genuinely agree and then 9 times out of 10 he'll come back later having spoken to DIL and say 'oh we've decided something different' as she seems to run his life for him. She talks for him some times, seems to decide a lot for both of them even if it's something mainly concerning DS, and is very stubborn/strong willed,eg I was harmlessly ribbing DS one day about a silly mistake he'd made and she roundly told me off as if I was a child!

Really feel as though we're being pushed out, DIL regularly refers to DS, her and her daughter as 'our family' and we seem to be more and more like acquaintances. Worried that soon we'll be completely out of his life.

The Christmas thing actually sounds like my own mum! It's so unfair of parents to do this.

As for mil.....my dp had an ear infection and she told me to set my alarm for every 4 hours throughout the night to administer drops to him!! I already had a baby that would wake throughout the night and she knew I was struggling with sleep. It sounds like an April fools joke but people like this do exist

I think has been done to death now.

If people do rtft they will see that OP understandably has taken a step back now.

OP is still reading, just not posting unless necessary. Unless I have misreadTFT...

Blessed, if that comment was directed at me, I read 8 pages before commenting. It was too much to read all 14.

Aw OP, just wanted to say good luck to you. Changing family dynamics can be very difficult and I don't think anyone in the world deals with that 100% rationally.

Your son has decided to make his life in this new town with his fiancee. You shouldn't focus your energies on whether this is right or wrong (it's impossible to know what the 'right' decision is at any point in our lives!) but instead concentrate on adapting to this situation and building a relationship with your son and future daughter in law that works for you all.

How often do you talk on the phone? Establishing a regular time for a nice long chat with your son every week might make you feel a bit more connected with him. Men can be a bit rubbish about remembering life details to talk about on the phone (sorry to stereotype!) but if you explain to him that you're missing him and want to know about his life then I'm sure he'll manage to fill you in each week. If you both have computers with cameras I'd really recommend skype or a similar video chat programme - it really does feel more like you're really with the person than just telephone. You could arrange to skype him now and then when your daughter's around -- a nice family chat.

with regard to visiting him, is it possible that he can pay your coach fare so it can happen a little more often? Or that you can meet for lunch halfway?

But with both calls and visits I do think that 'less is more'. People can be very busy, that doesn't mean they love their family less but it might mean they see them less. I think it wouldn't be great to call him too often, have nothing really to say, and have him feeling like it's a bit of a chore. If there's an expectation on both sides of an indepth chat once a week say, that's less likely to happen.

I also think that working out a plan for how often you'll see/speak to him might make you feel a bit less anxious about the future. Maybe part of the anxiety you’re feeling comes from not really knowing what your future contact is going to be like. If you make that a bit more certain by talking it over with him (emphasizing that you’re not wanting quantity but quality) then that might make you feel better.

I would definitely avoid alienating the DIL or letting on in the slightest way that she makes you uncomfortable. He’s made it clear he’s picked her as a partner. It may be that she has some traits that rub you up the wrong way or even that she is a bit overbearing. But realistically there’s not much you can do about that! The DIL-MIL dramas of the world come about because there is a bit of a tension between a mother’s affection and a wife’s, so I think you have to look at the tension you’ve identified as a normal part of human interaction. It’s pretty normal to feel a bit resentful at times. But it’s not going to do any good for your happiness or your relationship with your son if you focus on this. So just try, as others have said, to let it go, and concentrate on the DIL’s good points (which are after all what attracted your son to her) and just be pleased that your son has found someone who makes him happy.

I think that doting on the little girl and taking an interest in her might make you feel a bit more warm towards the whole family. Because if you start feeling a fondness for her it’ll be harder to resent the family unit if you see what I mean. And also because it’s possible that your son and DIL will have children of their own pretty soon and then it sounds like they won’t want the little girl to feel like she’s not a real part of the family, so you’ll be expected to treat her like your biological grandchildren anyway.

Finally, I wonder if you have a lot of time on your hands. Maybe it is time to join a new group or take up a new hobby. If you are a bit busier then you might find that not seeing your son several times a week matters a bit less.

Good luck OP, you sound like a loving person with your heart in the right place.

God, it's been a while since I've read such a genuinely upsetting, self inflicted thread

Op I truly, truly hope that you take a lot of the excellent advice you've had on here. You are in significant danger of pushing ds and his new/future family away completely. Please, for your sake and ds's sake, you need to accept that he has grown up, things change and that life moves on. This doesn't mean for a moment that you will automatically be cut out, but you run the risk of being cut out if you carry on like this.

I'm sorry you're hurting, but please take steps to reduce the amount of hurt you will feel in the future.

You could be my own DM. I moved away 10 years ago and she still tries to control me. Getting all huffy if i dont take her unsolicited advice, my parenting is all wrong, and the 'gentle ribbing' dont get me started, she reminds me of every mistake i made since the age of 5, and i am just being oversensitive if react.

We used to alternate xmases but to be honest after the last one we put our foot down and said we would do xmas at home, our home with our family. She got so wound up at the last family xmas because we werent doing things 'her way' (she decided to tell DS in what order he could open his pressies - my DSis turned up half an hour late as she had visited her new IL's before hand - my DM got cross) she basically ruined it with her controlling behaviour.

Dont get me wrong i am still 'close' to DM but now on calmer terms as i have taken 50% of the control - ie i have made her see that i am a grown adult with my own family. She still tries to swoop in with the control though.

Also, her own MIL back in the 70s was just like you, DM was a single mum with me and her new MIL made no secret of the fact that she disapproved of her DS marrying a divorcee with a child. As a result i never had a close relationship with my GM. She adored my sisters though

Dont push your DS away.

I didn't suggest the OP go to Gransnet in order to have her skewed attitude validated, I suggested it because I think that she will get told the same thing (that she needs to learn to let go of her son, embrace his new family and compromise on her unreasonable expectations) but in a more compassionate way by women who understand how hard she's finding it to adjust.

She's had a massive kicking on here from a lot of people who just delight in putting the boot in and venting their frustrations about MILs. There's been some good advice too, but overall it's typical MN AIBU. Many of the posts have looked to me to be much more about projection and venting than genuine attempts to understand and support. Nasty.

You are pushing your DS and DIL away. You are very, very unreasonable. I am a single parent to one DS (5) i can not imagine treating him the way you are treating yours. Emotional blackmail over Christmas FFS! How awful of you to do that.

My DS will make decisions with his partner when he is older, his partner will sometimes make decisions for him (I expect as not everyone cares enough about some things to make joint decisions) and I expect there will be times he will make some decisions without his partner.

I do not expect my DS to be seeing me on a weekly basis when he is older, he will hopefully have an interesting life outside of me and I will be there waiting to hear all about it no matter where he is and certainly not blaming his partner. I certainly would not expect to see him every christmas and would be upset that he felt he had to and left his family see him at christmas. By family I mean his own little family that he has and the other side of that little family.

No wonder they moved away, you sound extremely controlling and overbearing.

Quite no73 i want my DS to have a more fulfilling life than visiting me 3 times a week and-i want my own life too, maybe on a loooong holiday with lots of sleep and relaxation!

Me and DH love our time with DS1 and DS2 but we accept that in 20 years time it will be back to the two of us - and we have planned our Xmas holidays abroad - in the sunshine!

And yes - if the OP met my DMIL (yes i did say DMIL - she is lovely) she would tell her in no uncertain terms she is BU - with all the reasons why.

While I agree that the OP is BU, it's also obvious that she's really sad that her DS has moved away and she doesn't see so much of him. And it perfectly reasonable to miss someone you love and wish you saw more of them. That's completely natural.

I hope you're OK OP - you've taken quite a bashing here. I hope in the coming weeks and days you can re read this and take something from it

You sound like my MIL. I tried and tried with her but now sadly, 8 years down the line I avoid seeing her but and the other inlaws as much as is humanly possible. They have always made it clear (passive aggressively of course) that they think I am trying to steal their son. I dread Christmas every year now whereas I useful to love it, because inevitably arguments ensue over which parents we are seeing...

Frankly it's exhausting and the only thing me and DH ever argue about. Don't be that woman. Please.

OP its your choice whether you have a lovely relationship with your DS and DIL or whether you push them both away. How about trying to fit in with their lives instead of bullying them into what you want.

When children grow up and form relationships its time to stand back and if you are lucky they will want you in their lives and you will have done a good job of bringing them up.

CrabbyTheCrabster, I agreed with your suggestion that OP post on Gransnet. Like you I think that she will be told the same thing; and being told so by people who have lived through similar situations will have more effect.

From Mumsnet, she can stick her fingers in her ears and sing la-la-la-not-listening-you're-just-a-bunch-of-DILs-la-la-la. And continue to drive her son away. From Gransnet, she will be able to take it on board (I hope).

I suggested not going to Gransnet because I have only heard of it in the context of "bugger off to Gransnet you mil-lover"......... Glad to hear it's not like that.

It can be really hard to adapt to new family dynamics. It can take some people longer than others to realise that their kids have grown up and that they are no longer THE most important person in their life.

I feel sad that my dd and her dh live at the other end of the country but the more I've accepted and embraced the fact that they're making a new life together and treat my son in law as another member of my family, the better it gets. And being on MN is something I've found useful because it helps me to see things from a different perspective.

I'm not saying I wasn't sad when they moved or the first Christmas I didn't see them, but as I've accepted and adapted, our relationship has grown. I can now see my dd and her dh as adults (far more competent ones that me in many many ways), and find a new way to live and be in their lives.

OP, give it time, maybe force yourself, no matter how hard it is, to take a back seat and to do little things that show you care about both your ds and his partner. A little gift in the post for them both, a card to cheer them up if they've had a rough week etc. Things can get better. And I really hope they do. Keep on going, and think of your ds not as moving away but as on a long piece of elastic that means he can twang in to your life and out again but never really go away.

I've just read the whole thread and can't believe I'm going to be the first one to say this...

They moved 170 miles to get away from your overbearing behaviour... You sound like a total martyr.
Carrying on like this is just reminding them they made the right decision

OP your son has grown up. Its as simple as that. As parents, our child grow and we are no longer the centre of their world that's how its meant to be.

Your relationship with your DD is not relevant, tbh. Your children are different people who have made different choices. Your sons wife to be and her dd SHOULD be his priority. He has made a new family, which is an extension of yours but it is his own family. Your dils relationship with her parents isn't relevant either. Tbh, I am not surprised she doesn't want to visit you much. If another poster has guessed who you are, dil is obviously aware of your feelings. I wouldn't visit someone that thought I was evil and controlling.

Christmas is a prime example. Most people would expect Christmas arrangements to change once their children meet someone. Its what happens. Its not for you decide who they go to, or why. Its their decision, its their Christmas.

You need to let your son make his own choices. There is no evidence she is controlling. Its your assumption that your son can not make a decision for himself. YABU and need to leave them alone and stop assuming your dil is ruining your life. You should be happy your son is making a life for himself.

OP I am going to try and be gentle because I think you are reacting to a lot of change that you didn't see coming.

You say he wasn't keen on marriage so you probably thought you would have him around, without any other considerations, for longer than you have.

YANBU to be sad that you will see less of your son, but have you considered that this woman makes your son happy? Doesn't it give you comfort that, day to day, he has company, someone to share evenings with, to chat about work with, someone who will be with him long after you are gone?

YABU to say or act on any of your feelings, that way loneliness lies. I wouldn't worry about any of this getting back to your DIL as she is probably crystal clear on how you feel about her and you will need to work at loving her and her daughter, as a pp said, fake it til you make it.

You say that her parents will see more of her as they moved but you can't because all your family are near you now. Well if your son is family then they are not all near you, and you make the decision who to live near. Many of us live some distance from parents, siblings, children and have to plan, organise and even save up to see them. People make allowances for circumstances and understand that most people have lots of important people in their lives who they are trying to do the best by.

So have a moan to your DH sometimes about seeing your son less, but don't do it to your DD or anyone else and if you want to see them badly enough, make arrangements, have a New Year's Day dinner instead and invite all the family, or Skype them Christmas Day and appreciate that, in the same way you want special occasions surrounded by immediate family, so do they and that will include her family too.

That was me being super nice!

DontForget I actually spat out my tea at the ear drop alarm. That's bloody hilarious.

Erm no pirate.
Calm down love.

Your pain is palpable ,OP,because the focus of your world has changed so suddenly.This is normal life and nobody's fault.

Try not to blame a very nice sounding young woman(lucky young man) and hand on the baton with grace.

Fill your world with new lovely things...you are lucky that there is already a little girl to consider...there is so much you can do for her.Give them space,though.

The' Christmas thing' is a dreadful,unrealistic, false media construction of the world playing happy families. Try to not huddle with your daughter about the change.

The sore heart will ease,once you look at everything from the outside,and you see your son as a happy family man.

goth spot on post.

i have a couple of teens & we were talking recently about when they move out & that I'd probably like to see them once a week.

Once a week they chorused, but we'll be working & won't want to give up half of every weekend!

If we have a partner whose mum wants the same, we'll never have any time to ourselves!

Well, that told me, but of course they are right.

I remember myself trying to cram stuff into a weekend.

I doubt that she is trying to separate you, just that he wants to spend his time with her as a priority.

Wonderful post Goth

Believe me Thymes I sympathise ...I am very much of your generation, but you do have to let go. What puzzles me slightly though is that you do seem to have outed your DiL in RL to someone here Msgrinch...if that were me I would be MORTIFIED, but this doesn't seem to be bothering you all that much. Is there a part of you that WANTS DiL to know how you feel about her? If that's the case, this really isn't going to help.

She is NOT the enemy, and the idea that they should split up for Christmas to keep both sets of parents happy is just not on imho.

You will keep him far closer by letting him go! (and rise with the break of dawn.....)