To not bother trying to ensure DDs have regular contact with in laws?

[MyballsareSandy]

DDs are 14. In laws were quite involved in childcare when they were small which tailed off when they started secondary school. During school hols I still encourage them to spend a day round theirs to keep in touch.

So I dropped them off this morning and went to work. DD2 has text to say that her nan got into a rage when DD told her she didn't fancy going shopping with her. She's confiscsted her iPad and gone out with DD1.

It's as though MIL doesn't have a clue about teens. She's lucky they still visit and spend time with her on a regular basis.

I really wish I'd just left them in bed this morning instead of waking them up early like a school day to spend time with their grandparents and I'm tempted to just let them decide in future, at their age which would mean they see very little of them.

14 year olds are a different "species" from 16 year olds?!

Do they pupate at 15 and then emerge into the world as fully formed adults?

These are the 14 year olds who in a decade's time are going to get a nasty shock when they are in the workplace and discover they're not special snowflakes and that their wishes are not primary in all things.

Oh that old load of guff.

I guess if your aspiration for your children is how to take orders from crap, overbearing bosses, then yeah, teaching them to submit to status is the way to go.

Most of the successful people I know were not raised that way. But sometimes need to employ people who were.

if a 14 year old wants to be treated as an equal / an adult, they should perhaps consider behaving like one...

She is behaving like one - her grandmother!

Actually, developmentally at 14 they are really undergoing a huge amount of change that makes their behaviour often irrational and the choices they make are not always in their own best interests. I think the fact this girl is calling her nan smelly, is embarrassed to be seen in public with her etc is testament to that. This is not adult like behaviour, no matter how you try to make this grandmother into some oppressive force for expecting a bit of social interaction with her grandchild.

How do you know how people were raised, in all honesty? So no one EVER asked you to do something you might not have wanted to do as a young teen? I call bollocks to that!

Eh, most of my employees think we're fab emoters - flexible, interesting work, value our staff, some of the best staff feedback scores in the organisation for our managers and leaders.

There's a huge difference between 'taking orders' and 'being willing to be flexible, compromise and put yourself out w bit for the good of the team/another person'. Being able to put an individual's priority or preference to one side to help deliver a broader priority is a good thing in a workplace - not complaints and strops about not always getting the glory/glamour projects/not getting to do the thing they want exactly the way they want to do it.

I get the most complaints about the special snowflakes from their colleagues at the same level, who find them unbearable, rather than their managers. Behaviour is just as important in the workplace as talent.

But yeah, tell yourself whatever makes you feel warm and fuzzy about your choices. I'm happy with mine - and even more happy with my parents' choices.

She is behaving like one - her grandmother

I rather got the impression that wasn't a model the OP wanted her daughter to follow. But you're right, we've seen no evidence that the OP wants to raise her children to be kind or thoughtful adults. Massive assumption on my part.

However, given her grandmother seems to have put herself out for her granddaughters for years, when it was convenient for OP, your statement is not really accurate, is it?

It really is 'granny's done lots for you over the years, but you find her boring now, so fuck her and her interests and wants. Making sure you, the 14 year old, is never bored or put out is far more important.'

Feck it. Emoters = employers. I emote sometimes, but not when autocorrect wants me to.

It's hardly the DD's fault that the OP used her for free childcare for years, and it's unfair of her to expect her to see it as a debt that needs to be re-paid.

Spending time with relatives should be a pleasure, not a chore.

*OP used her MIL

Of course teenagers can be irrational and act against their own best interests.

But they still need to be treated with respect and to have their growing independence recognised by the adults in their lives.

All this "she's a child, get her told!" attitude is horrible.

It's horrible to treat children that way, and inexplicably short-sighted to take that attitude to teenagers.

This isn't the "circle of life" stuff.

Circle of life obligation is when you continue to visit your senile grandfather years after he forgot who you are, because you want to honour the relationship you had when he was capable of having relationships.

A fit woman in her 70s spending the day with teenagers could and should be enjoyable for all of them.

I tend to find things are more enjoyable for all concerned if there's give and take.

For those struggling, that means sometimes doing things you don't particularly feel like doing, and the other person ditto. Quite useful skills for teenagers to be encouraged in.

Why did she have her ipad again? To me, that sends a pretty rude message: 'I expect to find you boring'.

given her grandmother seems to have put herself out for her granddaughters for years

Did she?

Providing childcare is a favour to parents, surely?

This reminds me of when my aunt, who was 10 when I was born, used to say how much babysitting I owed her when she had kids, to pay back a the times she babysat me!

Luckily she was joking, because she's not actually a dick. She babysat because she was obsessed with the baby I was and she adored her big sister. It was nothing to do with me.

I did do a fair bit of babysitting for her, as it happens. Because I love her and I was happy to help her out and I also love my cousins.

But I was never expected by anybody to pay her back favours she did for my mother.

Maybe if you're used to a family where people are nice to each other (even children and teenagers!) you don't have to get into this nonsense of learning to be miserable to please people you basically can't stand.

Children who are raised to think only of their own pleasure are always horrible to be around. Sometimes you just have to think of the the other person, even when it's not much fun for you.

So you play the tedious game with your toddler, you provide the sympathetic shoulder for your hopeless at relationships friend, you carry all the burden while your partner is seriously ill.

And if you are lucky, it is paid back to you.

And if you have been raised to be a selfish brat, then you have a cold and lonely future ahead.

My family are lovely, ta. Also kind and thoughtful. And no, it's not an obligation or a debt - how hyperbolic - but recognising the input of others to your lives, and being encouraged to give back a little.

Maybe we're all making assumptions about how the grandmother provided childcare. Because I had several lovely grandparents, I'm imagining the grandparents went out of their way to give the kids a nice time, rather than just leaving them to their own devices while they were in the same house.

My grandparents were lovely to me when I was a child. I'm sure they often had better or more interesting things to do with their time, but they went out of their way to enhance my life. So it was quite right that, when I was a self-centred teenager, I was encouraged to put myself out for them on the rare occasion.

As an adult, and having just said goodbye to my last living grandparent, I'm glady parents played the long game with me. I wasn't always the nicest, but I was encouraged to be, even if there wasn't immediate payback.

To be honest, it's OP's attitude to her MIL that I think stinks. Her kids as really only modelling the same behaviour.

Children who are raised to think only of their own pleasure are always horrible to be around. The same goes for Grandmothers.

and users.

Even with the loveliest of GPs, over time the relationship 'rules' need to be rewritten as DCs & GPs get older.

I remember the OP's earlier thread. Again I think that there is fault on both sides. The relationship between GM & DD2 is clearly not working so I would be tempted to call 'time' on it.

The relationship between GM & DD2 is clearly not working so I would be tempted to call 'time' on it.

Really? Just like that?

So teenagers are some kind of glorious beings that everyone is supposed to be grateful to just for showing up? They have no further responsibilities, meanwhile everyone else is supposed to act like holiday reps around them? Yep, great preparation for adult life. And it won't produce brilliant future leaders nearly so often as it produces plain old self-obsessed adults.

I think the OP is getting a bit of a hard time here.

My DDs (18 and nearly 16) adore my DM and always have done; but she is totally aware that they have grown up and understands the ebb and flow of the relationship over time. DM is 84, not very well, and the girls have been a rock for her (and me) over the past year. But, given their ages, and their life pressures blah blah, their attention span is pretty short...

With my ILs, who have always preferred their other GC - well, they're polite, but any suggestion they go and spend time there would be met with complete horror.

So GPs get what they sow, IMO

It really just sounds like there's a lot of tension amongst everyone. A lot of obligations, and resentment bbecause of it.

I had hardcore, old school European grandparents and we were there everyday as kids and twice a week as teens, until I was 18. I did as told, always.

I hated it.

But I never said anything because it didn't matter to anyone. There was a lot of resentment and anger over the years because of never speaking up.

I haven't read the other thread, but does you DD and MIL usually argue? I bet isn't enjoyable for anyone.

Teens tend to absorb their parents' attitudes. I don't get on so well with my mum but she treats my DDs well enough...I don't get over-involved and into battlemode with their relationship, just because I don't get on with her doesn't mean I have to drag them into it. Their relationship is theirs.

GM confiscated IPad & had a bit of a moan as 14 year old didn't fancy going out shopping? There really must be enough going on in life not to take that to heart..Im sorry, it simply isn't a big deal enough to get worked up about. Beyond precious. Perhaps you could instruct GM, give her guidelines on how to show proper reverence and have no opinion? The controlling aspect of this is GM is going to be punished in some way for this, I suspect. But I bet she wouldn't be if the DCs were younger and childcare/babysitting duties were needed. Thats usually how it goes and fair enough, I guess..its just a bit rich to pretend the "no longer needed" I put up with you before but cba now thing isnt part of the family equasion.

Ok thanks all, interesting to read different views/angles on it all. I had forgotten I had put that other thread on about the fart. To be honest there are so many 'incidents' with MIL that I forget what I share on here.

I think it is true to say that sometimes my DDs over hear negative comments about MIL as DH has little time for her. Combination of reasons, partly when growing up and partly now. Obviously that is wrong and we try not to do it, but they're not babies any more and they will pick up on things they hear. She is exceptionally hard work and it has affected my relationship with her.

Their help when DDs were small was very much appreciated and wasn't taken for granted. DH wanted to pay for childcare, he didn't want his mother to look after them, but she very much wanted to and it kind of drifted on.

But, as I said in my last thread, she def has a soft spot for DD1 and finds fault with DD2 rather a lot. DD1 would probably have been allowed to stay behind on her ipad without any aggro.

Anyway, it's made me realise, yet again, that her relationship with DD2 isn't healthy and I won't be encouraging/forcing them to go there for a whole day during every school hols. They're 14, they can decide.

They are basically great kids, they may come across as self centered and self absorbed on this and the other thread but they're really not, no more than most other teens anyway, they have their moments but they're basically pretty kind and thoughtful most of the time.

DH wanted to pay for childcare, he didn't want his mother to look after them, but she very much wanted to and it kind of drifted on.

your DH did not want his own mother to care for his children.

Telling.

She bouldered on and did it anyway.

hmm

You said she treated DH the same way as she is treating your DD2.

You MUST protect your children and follow your DH lead on this. he suffered at that woman's hands and now your little girl is.

Good for you for seeing that you have to back off and allow your DC som distance from this damaged woman.

I don't think you dd was rude at all. She's 14 abd has a say in what she does. Ideally teens should want to spend time with gps but they are terns fgs.