To not be the least bit suprised by this ( Jihadi schoolgirls )

[ginghamcricketbox]

Talk about taking the piss.

www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-3013703/Father-jihadi-bride-schoolgirl-attended-2012-Islamist-rally-attended-Lee-Rigby-s-killer-led-preacher-Anjem-Choudary.html

That makes sense nubia to them I suppose it's something they live and breathe and the purpose of their life is to please Allah he created them to do his bidding type thing. It's a shame they seem to be interpreting their religious scriptures in such a horrendous manner

I read something years ago that likened religious texts to basically a handy housewife manual for the Middle ages. Wipe your bum with one hand and eat with the other - basic food hygiene for instance. Circumcision was a basic hygiene issue for living in the desert.

Can't remember the article but it was fascinating and made me look at religion in a new light

I wonder why they are turning to more conservatism ?

Because the tenets of Islam itself is very conservative, bordering on fascism. They chastise their parents as having a very loose understanding of 'true Islam', which is true as most of the older generation (or the younger liberal ones) haven't really studied it at all, they simply practice the rituals.

From Aqsa Mahmood's blog:
fa-tubalilghuraba.tumblr.com/post/87676810144/diary-of-a-muhajirah-2
How does a parent who has little Islamic knowledge and understanding comprehend why their son or daughter has left their well off life, education and a bright future behind to go live in a war torn country. Most likely they will blame themselves, they will think they have done something. But until they truly understand from the bottom of their heart that you have done this action sincerely for Allah’s sake they will live in hope that you will return.

You could say that about the ten commandments too. Don't lie, be jealous, kill, have an affair and so on.

Thats what this article was saying poison

Also the stories are the bible or Qurans way of explaining natural disasters, plagues etc. they're just a book of 'how to' mixed with newspaper articles explaining what can now be explained by modern science

I often wonder too, if it is a social thing for the older generation of Muslims like the Irish , rather than religion. Where as the younger Muslims are being encouraged to study and are interpreting scripture not sure if that is the correct term in a certain way. The radicalised feel they have a superior love of their God.

They also seem to be of the opinion their God approves of their behaviour even though all major religions actually preach peace

This is what happens when only small proportions of a population are 'permitted' to read study and interpret a text.

If you've got a swathe of poorly educated individuals or lazy teens who aren't going to question you when you say 'it's written that...' I can imagine it's easy for a charismatic individual to convince them to do his or her bidding

It's all a bit European dark ages, when a victory in battle meant God was on your side.

I was suspicious of the father from the start and said so on another thread where I got a bit of an ear-bashing for it so when I saw the article in the paper it didn't surprise me in the least.

And I agree with this entirely

For me the main point is that he tried to say there were never any discussions in the house about Isis etc. Tbh he tried to make out he was just a simple humble immigrant. I never bought it.

Have to say I saw this coming a mile off. The police probably knew and apologised as a PR exercise. I believe this rally was also calling for sharia law to be imposed in the UK too. So its very relevant.

I am not sure if it was this man, or another of the fathers, that said he just thought his dd was going to Turkey to wedding. My thoughts at the time, were that a 15 year old girl from a conservative muslim family would bot be allowed to travel abroad, to an unknown persons wedding alone. At that moment, I believed all the parents knew. When they blamed everyone else but themselves, I knew they knew.

I spent much of my early childhood in northern Ireland and can saw fundamentalism. People knew which family's would have children involved. No one was ever shocked when when someone was unmasked. I believe its the same in the muslim community too. People know which of their neighbours and friends are more likely to do something like this. My family were not and did not associate with these families, but everyone was very aware and kept their children away.

Imo the family and school need a detailed investigation. Something is going on at that school and likely backed by the parents if my child attended there, I would remove them asap, to stop an possible radicalisation. I wonder if any parents have actually done this?

An insistence that a terrorist threat "can come from anywhere" misses the point and displays ignorance.
Of course it can come from anywhere. But if you're aiming to try and prevent it there is some sense in recognising where it's currently coming from.

All those people on the other thread pushing that the parents were innocent and anyone who disagreed was a moron - right back at you! I'll say it again - the parents are lying scum. They should go to Syria with the kids and stay there. Passports please!

The "terrorists can come from anywhere" rhetoric ignores the fact that th vast amount of aggression in the world today is being done in thname of Islam. But we are not allowed to explore why because if anyone points this out they are nasty racists or islamaphobic.

I have been accused of being a pearl clutching islamaphobe on threads before despite the fact I come from a Muslim country and all my family are Muslims .

I truly believe that left wing nonsense is the biggest threat to women in the UK at the moment. Want to have a discussion about misogyny in Islam, you're racist. Object to penises in rape crisis centres, you're a hideous transphobic bigot. Express concerns about trafficked women in prositution = whore phobic frigid prude.

I do wonder how the dad feels now? Wanting, what, muslimification of the entire world?

But now his daughter has, fuelled by his wharped mind, has done what he hadn't the balls to do - bugger off to the 'Islamic Paradise on earth' and live the life of the righteous.

Playing the 'poor wee me, just an immigrant, just want to work hard and look after my family (and condemn you all to hell, you western bastards, I hate you all) card. What the hell has this done for race relations? Stupid bastard.

Sadly, it is possible that she egged on the others. The other parents would have met him surely - and its not hard to spot a raving religious nut. Why did they not warn their girls to keep the hell away from her? I know I would. Too busy telling them not to become shitty western girl trash no doubt.

I really don't understand why people move to a country where they think the culture, religion, politics, food etc is so shit they just can't bear it, and want it changed to their own world view. Why not go to another Muslim country to settle? If religion is that important to them...

At what point will the apologists realise there is a problem? We've had bombings, public threats to western society;beheadings;British muslims joining isis; the list goes on. How much does it take for reality to set in?

It's time for some open discussions about culture and the UK. For example, if you have been raised in a dictatorship, war torn or fundamentalist culture that believes in strict roles for men and women, how are you going to understand a liberal, democratic system in another country that attempts to equalise everyone? Culture can have a very big influence on how you live your daily life and your views etc. Having been an immigrant myself, I know how it feels to live in another country in a sort of cultural bubble where you have trouble assimilating due to language barriers and seek out others from your country. We need an open, honest debate and discuss what we are all going to do about it together for a more peaceful, harmonious world.

Also, I believe we should stop calling people who stir up violence and aggression religious fanantics or fundamentalists, because I think this is a separate issue more to do with psychological issues like psycho or socio pathic tendencies or mental health problems due to exposure to and desensitisation from violence. Call a spade a spade. Jihadi John is mentally ill, possibly psychopathic, who is consumed by a need for powere. Not a religious fundamentalist.

I'll say it again - the parents are lying scum. They should go to Syria with the kids and stay there. Passports please!

I actually do agree with this. Also the girls who have a travel ban… let them go. If they want to live in IS, let them. They are a danger to other people if they stay, let them go.

We don't really want more IS people joining in the mayhem though do we?

I watched the unreported world last might on channel 4 and wonder how they can ever find peace in that part of the world.

Someone up thread has made a very good point. When you come from a background of dictatorship you will find the UK very different. In your favour. You will be allowed free speech, everyone will bend over backwards to help, you will be given money, support and shelter. You won't need to learn English, you don't need really need to work and no one will blame you because after all you are just a poor humble immigrant. You will be given a British passport.

And this is how to repay those who have helped you........

Extremism happens in all religions. All faiths have had their crazy people. Look at Northern ireland, look at the basque region in Spain, look at Sri lanka look at America even! They're everywhere.

And, looking back to history how far back do you want to go and is it relevant to todays threat?

Did the Basques want world domination and to kill all non Basques and chop their heads off? NO.

Did the IRA want kill ALL of the opposition and chop their heads off, NO.

Stupid and infantile comparisons.

I guess you will be bringing up a small small group of right wing Christians now in America and telling us we arn't afraid of them either!

We have been scared for too long, scared to speak out in case we are called racist. Its time to wake up and realise that not all these people are here for a better life for themselves and for their families, their true aim is to turn this country and many others into a muslim state. By whatever means.

I don't think my friend at work is a terrorist, never mind your mate down the road. I don't think anyone if this thread thinks that all Muslims are terrorists either?

I am surrounded by Muslims here, and I don't feel under threat in the slightest.

I do however think something very very fishy is going on In tower hamlets, they had a dogy Mayer, people stopping people in streets as they were not dressed properly, the radicals, the schools etc. Would I be afraid of a Muslim walking down the street in Tower Hamletts? NO. no

DO I think somewhere there extremism is being preached and incited YES.

It seems a weak argument to state stop picking on the Muslims, others have done it in the pas. On a previous thread someone mentioned the Normans to try and deflect.

The thread is with one group of people NOW. Of course there are others but fgs - one school with all these pupils running off and bring stopped travelling to ISIS. What on earth is going on in there!!!

So taking their passports is going to stop what. Save them from themselves or allow them to spread their hate of us. In some countries often the ones they themselves praise - they would be taken away in the middle of the night never to be seen again.

Who is stopping people in the street and saying that they are not dressed properly. It gets worse. If the UK is such a terrible place and you hate our culture bugger off. Find a country that is more to your liking.

hermione I don't think your the only one that feels like that. Its only on MN where some posters take a blasè attitude or twist themselves in knots to defend excuse the actions of the extremists/fundamentalists or try to dismiss it as random acts.

Thankfully not every one thinks like them plus I think there is only a handful sockpuppets

On a previous thread someone mentioned the Normans to try and deflect.

The Normans ! FFS, I despair…