Active discussions

Meet the Other Phone. Child-safe in minutes.

Meet the Other Phone.
Child-safe in minutes.

Buy now

Please or to access all these features

Talk
AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

A child is not a 'basic human right'

139 replies

aibuyes · 06/03/2015 20:34

www.dailymail.co.uk/femail/article-2982669/Young-woman-children-denied-IVF-NHS-s-taking-case-Strasbourg-having-child-basic-human-right.html

Warning; DAILYFAIL LINK

But really, would anyone think a child is a basic human right? I sympathise for the woman that she is unable to have a baby, but I really disagree her that she wants NHS funding to have a child, even though her partner has a daughter that by their own admission, never stays over (so, I tend to think he is not being an active father role in her life, but that is reading between the lines).

She is a barmaid, he left his job as a supermarket manager (currently unemployed) so are unable to afford private treatment.

I can think of so many other things the NHS can better spend their money on!

OP posts:
Middlerose · 06/03/2015 20:41

Why can't they adopt?

FuckItBucket · 06/03/2015 20:44

You can't just adopt. You don't go to a supermarket and just pick a child bring it home with you.

There's a lot of thinking and talking about it before you even start the process.

Some people just don't want to adopt. Some women want to experience pregnancy.

Saying 'just adopt' is minimising how others feel.

I can't imagine the pain the people who trouble to conceive go through. It can damage them mentally and emotionally.

If the NHS can find boob jobs it can find the chance for a couple to have a child.

llamallamaredpyjama · 06/03/2015 20:46

Two threads about the same story running simultaneously - now that's unreasonable Wink

LostInWales · 06/03/2015 20:51

"Why can't they adopt?" Middlerose it really really isn't that easy!

Not sure where I stand on the opinion of a right to IVF though, I do think that it can be mentally and physically destructive if you are desperate for a child when you cannot conceive yourself. We shouldn't judge what we don't understand IMHO and as the adopted child of people who couldn't conceive I don't have the answers.

EmptySoulKindHeart · 06/03/2015 20:55

totally agree with you and they can adopt

WayfaringStranger · 06/03/2015 20:57

YANBU. It's laughable that they're claiming it's a human right and it offensive to those who have truly had their human rights breached.

eurochick · 06/03/2015 20:58

To those of you proposing adoption, I assume you adopted rather than choosing to have biological children.

Miltonmaid · 06/03/2015 21:01

Those who are suggesting adoption, do you have any clue about adoption? There are not thousands of babies waiting for homes in the UK.

26Point2Miles · 06/03/2015 21:04

How much does the whole thing cost? Presuming it works!

TheFairyCaravan · 06/03/2015 21:05

I think unless you have been in that situation you haven't really got a clue.

derailleurdePan · 06/03/2015 21:05

I'd think as an immediate response is "of course having a child isn't a basic human right" but on the grounds of 'what cost?' the argument falls down. We are a massively rich nation...we spend silly money on silly stuff (Trident?, tax favours to private companies? I.T. contracts that cost millions that don't work? etc)
The possible 'patriarchy' argument doesn't stand up either, on the basis of a child being a joint venture. If someone wanted to argue the case for it being a 'human right', then this isn't the one to take. The probs as to why she never sees her partners child is to do with their (his) family dynamics, not a HR issue.

derailleurdePan · 06/03/2015 21:07

Adoption? Really? It's a massively complex issue. There is NOT a simple supply of babies looking for homes. Lordy.

morethanpotatoprints · 06/03/2015 21:07

Do you ave children OP?

FuckItBucket · 06/03/2015 21:13

It took my dad 8 years roughly to finally adopt me. He was with my mum when I was two, married when I was 4.

Yet still that time to decide, to go through the process etc and I was still with one bio parent.

EmptySoulKindHeart · 06/03/2015 21:13

it isnt that hard to adopt and the planet is overpopulated

crackerjack00 · 06/03/2015 21:13

Adoption is MASSIVELY a different to having birth children.

The two are not remotely comparable and to suggest they are is bordering on offensive.

crackerjack00 · 06/03/2015 21:14

it isn't that hard to adopt

Tell me more...

FuckItBucket · 06/03/2015 21:16

it isn't that hard to adopt

Hmm
hopingforamiracle · 06/03/2015 21:20

The people who always say this crap about NHS funding IVF are always people who have had children and not had problems conceiving. Pisses me off. It's easy for them to criticise and be self-righteous about it when they have no idea about the far reaching affects of not being able to have a biological child.

DirtyDancing · 06/03/2015 21:21

Unless you have been in a situation where you have been told you may never have a baby- then you have no right to judge.

I have. It's deverstating.

IVF may be her only hope of ever having a baby. I do not agree just because he has had a child she shouldn't be given a round of IVF.

I sincerely hope she wins the case & one days has a baby of her own

26Point2Miles · 06/03/2015 21:22

So how many 'go's' should everyone get?

Original poster
aibuyes · 06/03/2015 21:22

well.. is it harder to go through the European courts of human rights or adopt?

As a reasonably wealthy nation, it would still concern me that for some people they do not choose to pay for their own children and with a small wage coming in, from the mothers side only, then I feel this couple would be relying too heavily on outside support to help raise their family.

I prefer a system in place to help those who need it, to support the families with children who have fallen onto harden times, rather than having it as a means for people to have children who would otherwise not be able to afford them. That being said, the man could be out tomorrow and getting a well paid job, but to me I feel they need their situation stable before attempting to bring a child into it.

Apologies for creating a thread with an identical one already existing ON THE SAME BOARD. My OCD side is going crazy with unnecessary clutter. (I did look before making this one, but I must have missed the other one)

OP posts:
Bilberry · 06/03/2015 21:23

The fact his child doesn't stay over is relevant as criteria for funding IVF is often that there are no other children living in the home. Presumably she perusing the 'right to a family life' argument?

Adoption is a whole different ball game. You go through months of intensive and very personal and intrusive screening. You don't then just get given a baby either; you have to be matched very carefully. All childen in the care system have been damaged in some way so they all have issues and some have very major issues. Not everyone can deal with this. Not everyone wants to.

People who want but can't have children have to go through a grieving process every bit as real and difficult as losing someone close to you such as your husband or child.

turquoiseamethyst · 06/03/2015 21:24

I feel really sorry for the woman and I think she should be entitled to treatment at least part-funded.