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Original poster

Drinking in pregnancy. The message still isn't registering

335 replies

kissmethere · 03/03/2015 13:38

Just read an article about the effects of alcohol in pregnancy. Children left with lasting effects of their mothers drinking habits and the mothers are saying they had no idea this would happen. Seriously?
I drank Guinness during my first pregnancy 18 years ago, very small amount at the end, adhering to the old wives tale that it was full of iron and malt. I knew back then that there was no way spirits or beer or loads of Guinness or much more should be consumed as it was bad for the baby. That was 18 years ago! I knew a woman when I was growing up who's son had permanent bone and facial damage as his mum was an alcoholic and fell over when she was pregnant with him, they had to operate on him while in the womb.
My point is how is it that some women still think alcohol in pregnancy is ok or claim they didn't know what damage it can do to the baby. What help are they getting if they truly know they have an addiction?

OP posts:
MooMaid · 03/03/2015 18:29

Just to clarify I don't believe the one spritzer I had whilst pregnant will have affected baby my post wasn't very clear and I'm having autocorrect issues!

SgtBlousey · 03/03/2015 18:56

A couple of Qs...

  1. How can the most harm be done in the first 12 weeks when the embryo is nourished by its yolk sac for 5(?) weeks after conception ? I can see weeks 9 (?) up being an issue, it's just the first bit that I'm unsure about.
  1. Is there a maximum amount of anything that's been proven 100% safe?

Genuine questions, these. I'm not pregnant and it's unlikely I ever will be again. Just curious as to why booze causes such righteous indignation, whereas a bit of unpasteurized cheese gets described as 'cheeky' Confused

Gemzybelle · 03/03/2015 19:01

I'm currently expecting DD 2. Not sure about other trusts but where I live aside from obvious advice from the midwife its pretty hard to avoid the risks. My antenatal clinic at the hospital has posters about not smoking/drinking, tv screens with various advice popping up every five minutes in the waiting room etc I find it hard to believe anyone simply doesn't know.

I don't smoke and the thought of alcohol at the moment makes me boak so I'm not about to get all judgey as I don't have to make those choices.

I do think the vast majority of women are intelligent enough to assess the risks themselves. Anyone who drinks enough to cause FAS in their unborn child probably has a major problem that they are struggling with. Its not because they didn't know.

SgtBlousey · 03/03/2015 19:01

I really ought to have rtft Blush

I'm still interested though. Genuinely.

BMO · 03/03/2015 19:01

There's a good few weeks between 5 and 13.

Alibabsandthe40Musketeers · 03/03/2015 19:07

Sgt - the cheese is much more of a risk than the alcohol. Listeria will cause awful damage to a pregnancy.

SgtBlousey · 03/03/2015 19:13

There are three between the placenta taking over and the magical 12 week mark though, BMO. It worries me that women might be beating themselves up unnecessarily for having drunk like fish better realising they were pregnant.

Ali that's my point. One snaffle of pâté or brie or bagged salad could have a catastrophic effect on a pregnancy. A large glass of wine every night seems less risky in comparison. I'm genuinely Confused about this.

SgtBlousey · 03/03/2015 19:15

before realising. And apols for not bolding you, BMO

sykadelic · 03/03/2015 19:15

Alcohol is not a necessity to life. Even with a minute risk, the known risk is there.

FAS doesn't occur at a set amount of alcohol. It varies from person to person / baby to baby and their sensitivity to it. It's not like you're fine at 5 units and then at 5.1 bam FAS.

You are taking an unnecessary risk because of your own selfish needs. Whether that need is to prove someone wrong, prove how forward thinking you are, or because you need a glass to get through your day (which is sad in itself).

If this is the first test of putting your kids first, you're failing.

Alibabsandthe40Musketeers · 03/03/2015 19:18

If this is the first test of putting your kids first, you're failing

Oh do piss off with that syk. Having an occasional glass of wine while you are pregnant is not failing your kids. Hmm

Dysdiadochokinesia · 03/03/2015 19:20

The problem with alcohol in pregnancy is that there is no safe limit. What does seem to be more clear is that harm is related to the regularity with which alcohol is drunk. For example I know of a young woman who drank half a pint of Guinness (yes that old wives tale has a lot to answer for!!) daily in pregnancy and had a child with FAS. So not drinking above the weekly limit but drinking daily. You can see where all the confusion comes from when there are cases like this. So in some ways it is safest to say no alcohol in pregnancy at all. Not to make people feel guilty but to give clear unambiguous advice.

Alibabsandthe40Musketeers · 03/03/2015 19:25

So not drinking above the weekly limit but drinking daily.

That is way above the weekly limit recommended in pregnancy. Way above. There is 1.2 units in half a pint of Guinness, so that should be all someone has in a week, not a day.

There is no confusion, that young woman drank seven times the recommended safe amount That is a not a borderline case.

Dysdiadochokinesia · 03/03/2015 19:30

I meant the weekly limit generally, not in pregnancy - mainly in response to those who associated FAS with 'problem drinkers' or alcoholics. Clearly it's over the recommended limit for pregnancy. But it's only 8.4 units a week.

professornangnang · 03/03/2015 19:32

I had a glass of wine a week when I was pregnant and it did my baby no harm. There's a huge difference between that and a problem drinker drinking every day. I think people who are judgemental about people drinking at all during pregnancy are usually nosy, self - righteous pricks. An occasional glass of wine is fine. It's hardly drinking a bottle of vodka a day.

birobenny · 03/03/2015 19:33

.5 pint Guinness per day resulted in FAS? Really?? And this is someone 'you know of' ?Hmm

Dysdiadochokinesia · 03/03/2015 19:35

Yes. I'm a professional who happens to work in the field. Nothing to prove so take it or leave it.

Alibabsandthe40Musketeers · 03/03/2015 19:35

Dys the weekly limit generally has nothing to do with pregnancy though does it?

Anyone who has a baby who suffers from FAS is going to minimise the amount they drank in an attempt to lessen the guilt. This is a perfectly understandable thing.
What is does mean though is that these anecdotal 'oh I only drank X' stories must be taken with a huge pinch of salt.

OneFlewOverTheDodosNest · 03/03/2015 19:37

I reckon there is more damage done to foetuses through mothers' stress levels than can ever be caused by a glass of wine. So this excessive policing of pregnant women as if they were public property probably causes far more issues than the infinitesimal chance of problems caused by Brie or a single glass of wine...

BMO · 03/03/2015 19:38

There must have been great interest in this woman's case if such low levels of alcohol consumption could be shown to cause FAS.

PacificDogwood · 03/03/2015 19:39

See, here we are discussing 'safe' amounts - it is Not Known.
And the multiple of anecdote does not data make - we will all have different levels of comfort living with uncertainty.

Much that I agree that the British drinking culture is in places quite shocking (I was aghast when I arrived in the UK, aged 27 at the level of binge drinking of my peers), I really don't think that we 'fail our children' when not avoiding alcohol like the plague in pregnancy. Sweeping statement, much? Hmm
Fwiw, I enjoy the taste of dry white wine. I know, v boring. I drink v v little and drank next to nothing for about 10 years because I was always either pregnant or BFing or up several times during the night and could just not face having to do that even with a little alcohol on board.
If I ever were pregnant again (SO not gonna happen!! Grin), I'd do the same again.

And really, the 'stress' of stopping smoking is NOT worse than smoking for the fetus. I wish that particular myth would die a death fast.

SgtBlousey · 03/03/2015 19:42

I find it really hard to believe that she only drank one half of Guinness a day. I'm doubting her version of events btw, not yours Dys

sky an occasional drink cannot cause the same damage that a rogue Mr Whippy can. It just can't. The chances of getting listeria from a sandwich are slim in the extreme, but the consequences don't bear thinking about. Do you judge a pregnant woman who eats a prepacked sarnie as being a parenting failure?

stinkingbishop · 03/03/2015 19:42

Yes, I'd be very interested in any studies done on the case of 1/2 pint Guinness a day leading to FAS. Would be worthy of a Lancet article, that.

As someone said upthread about cheese, I had a friend (a medical one) who must have had some unpasteurised cheese in something, she can't remember consciously doing that for the life of her, fastforward to baby in ICU with listeria and ensuing complications, touch and go, for 3 months. Bacteria and other nasties are far more of a threat, IMHO.

OrangeMochaFrappucino · 03/03/2015 19:50

This thread seems to have inspired another in AIBU which seems a little more on the goady side. I'm not getting sucked in. But it looks like several people on there could really do with a good solid high five.

birobenny · 03/03/2015 19:55

Dys
if you ' work in the field' as you say I do hope you are not going around telling all and sundry about the young lady that you 'know of' who had a baby with FAS because she drank 1/2 a pint of beer a day. If you do then one can only wonder what field you work in - the scaremongering field? Daily express reporter perhaps?

As it happens I 'know of' an old lady who swallowed a spider. It wriggled and tiggled and tiggled inside her. It was awful, truely awful.

FirstWeTakeManhattan · 03/03/2015 19:56

During my first pregnancy, I had to ditch my birth board as it was crawling with the type who bragged about how they've only eaten Big Macs and chicken nuggets since they got pregnant, won't touch fresh food, frequently dye their hair with noxious stuff, had put on three stone in the first trimester etc. but were slinging insults at anyone who admitted to having a tiny glass of wine.

I've yet to read a 'yooooouuuu selfish mother for imbibing a small glass of wine' post which I have much respect for.