...to ask MN-ers NOT to join in this glorification of domestic abuse? (contains spoilers)

[Floundering]

Fifty Shades of Shite

Can't believe the naivety and abuse deniers on here and amongst my friends.

DV campaigners such as Womens Aid & National Centre for Domestic Violence are urging people not to see this film.

It is not "just a piece of fun" it normalises abusive, controlling relationships as sexy, and it really bothers me so many women are colluding in supporting such crap that could hurt other more vulnerable women.

The BDSM community are frothing too as if done properly between 2 consenting adults with lots of planning, mutual respect and lots of affection and downtime after it can, for some, apparently be mindblowing. ( doesn't lift my skirt but respect those who do enjoy) this is not portrayed safely in this film.

Definitely not going to see this film. For all the good reasons others have posted. To me it seems to (and yes I have read most of book 1) romanticise what IS an abusive relationship and imply that if you love someone enough you can change an abuser. It has the potential to normalise abuse and violence in relationships particularly for younger and/or vulnerable women. Girls are already submitting to sex acts (anal sex is just one example) that they don't want and that their "boyfriends" know they don't want. This film simply disempowers them further and shouldn't, in my opinion be marketed as a love story on Valentines day.

Floundering I'd be interested in hearing where you got your original image from - very powerful and worth sharing I think...

No I would not say he is abusive she willingly consents and if you read all the books you will see that it is her controlling him in the end

Right I'm signing off for the night as am exhausted so enjoy your debate and I would suggest just don't watch the film lol goodnight

Jane Eyre was utter drivel. About as good as the 50 Shades hogwash. I have tried and failed to read these books I found them so boring and the characters infuriating.

But yanbu op although it does provide a good talking point for relationships and I know at least one friend leave her controlling ex as a result of our discussions. This type of thing also opens up debate which is a good thing. Although I do take your point too. Let's not glamorise Mr Grey's behaviour.

I got told off for derailing earlier, but I really would like to see some evidence that watching a film about bdsm or even abuse makes you more susceptible to being abused. Many people are assuming the connection is there, but I just know if that is a fair assumption. Is there any evidence at all? Personally, I think that it is incredibly important to educate young people not to abuse (and not to put up with abuse). But that's a totally different thing from whether women who fantasise about abuse get to talk about their fantasies openly.

*don't know

100% agree with you OP. I cannot understand how anyone could want to read such utter crap glorifying abusive behaviour.

middle arch

Could not get through Middlemarch...took my A level using Cliffs notes (did not end well)

Can't even spell Middlemarch...stupid autocorrect...and alcohol

Jane Eyre was beautifully written. "Drivel"? Not the word at all, even if you couldn't get into it.

And Middlemarch is the greatest novel in the English language. (My username stems from a description of the Brooke sisters.)

I feel quite put out at all the.. all the... PALESTINES on this thread. retreats with nose in air

mildly

Couldn't stand Dorothea

At no point in these books does she have any control in their relationship. He is a controlling, abusive, manipulative wanker the whole way through all three books. She doesn't get to do anything without his say so and approval.
There is nothing in this relationship that resembles a healthy bdsm relationship.
The books give the impression that if you love your man enough, then you can change him. Total bullocks.

I was a virgin til 21.
I knew what I liked sexually and in no way could I have been exploited . You don't need to have had intercourse to develop your own mind!

Yep, Tizwailer, I totally accept the judgment of others that this book depicts emotional and physical abuse and rape. I also accept the evidence of 100 million copies sold that many, many women are turned on by these depictions. who are we to tell these women that they are wrong for being turned on by this? and more to the point, what do you expect them to do about it?

"Women wringing their hands, sighing and wishing that their partners were more like this, send out green light to misogynists. We can't have it all ways."

This is precisely the attitude I have a problem with!

Would you also say that women going out in short skirts and make up, wishing that men would pay them attention, send out green light to misogynists? Do women who stay in abusive relationships send out green light to misogynists too? Think about what you're saying!

Flimmy Read the book and you'll see what I mean.

I've read lots of fantasy books about BDSM and found pain, love, consent, kink, consensual non-consent, roleplay, trust, communication, respect, filth, sex and loads more. I've never read a BDSM book where the Dom actually abuses the sub without her consent.

I've also read lots of fantasy books about abuse or rape, take The Sleeping Beauty Trilogy, or Kushiels Dart, The Wolf and the Dove where the female is raped by the man she eventually falls in love with or Stormfire where shes beaten by her soon to be soulmate. I've found "real" non-consent, real "abuse", real "headfuck" situations. None of these books try to portray themselves as a BDSM relationship.

50 shades crosses the line because it fits into neither of these and both of these at the same time. Because essentially what it does is take the examples in the last category I mentioned, and gives itself the "BDSM" category.

Yes its a fantasy, and yes most women know how to differentiate between fantasy and real life, and yes its brilliant that women's actual fantasies who many would think should be suppressed are given some screentime.

But- dress it up as a film which indulges women with abusive fantasies. Don't release it on valentines day as some sort of love story and say its BDSM because its not. And what that does is blur the lines between Kink, and real abuse. If it was kink, he would make sure everything was sane, safe and consensual. If it was abuse, it would be marketed that way.

Marketing abuse as a sane safe consensual BDSM relationship is wrong and completely irresponsible in my opinion.

Personally I think this campaign (or whatever it is) along with the other more high profile ones are missing the point.

The books have been around now for a good few years and although millions of copies have been sold worldwide, you can probably count the number of men who've read it on one hand.

The number of men who will willingly go to see this film will be of a similar order. Therefore, if there is a possibility of it normalising abusive relationships then men will know nothing about it.

Additionally, ask any man what his biggest put off is, when in a relationship, and he'll tell you it's a woman that thinks they can, or wants to change you. If the story really is of a woman who changes a man with love then men are instantly going to switch off.

If men want visual kicks they'll watch porn on the Internet. If they want a love story then I've no doubt there is better elsewhere. Ultimately I very much doubt mysogynists are going to learn a lot from this as they're bastards anyway.

Marketing abuse as a sane safe consensual BDSM relationship is wrong and completely irresponsible in my opinion.

I fully agree with this.

The danger here is not so much that men (who won't read it, or will watch it as they would porn, probably) will think it's normal, but rather that women may think it's normal and even desirable. Women who may be wooed by abusers, because they push their fantasy buttons, rather than boring, run of the mill men who will actually respect them sexually and will actually love them.

not be sent the message that it is ok for a man to dominate and abuse them.

In the spirit of the thread I must say, surely its ok for a man to dominate and abuse the woman if they are both consenting adults

Thats the message I wish 50 shades would have sent out. That taking control of your own sexual desires is empowering for a woman. And being submissive(typically female) isn't always about the dominants(typically male) sexual desires.

So if women think this is normal (I'm thinking low numbers here) and men know nothing about it, then what are these women going to do exactly? Seek out billionaire abusers to sweep them off their feet?

I personally think they'll be looking for a long time before they realise that regular non abusive men are the norm.

Strictly, abuse means lack of consent. If you consent, it's not abuse.