to move DD from her nice independent school where she has a scholarship because her brother didn't get offered one?

[middleschoolmuddle]

We are not rich but nor are we poor. The school have offered us a 16% bursary for DS - it's not enough.

Would it be mean to move DD to a state school at this stage (Y9)? Has anyone done this?

I can't think straight, my mind is whirring so I'd love some perspective from those of you that have managed to use the local 'good' state schools and pass up the rather nice (best in County) independent one.

Your finances sound pretty crazy to me but who am. To judge I'm about to take on an enormous mortgage on a tiny central london flat....

However, I was that child who moved in y9 in my case because my Mother decided she HAD to live near her Mother And deluded my father into thinking my Gran was going to do childcare so she could RTW.

Parents increased their mortgage massively, I went to a "good" school but it in no way compared with my top 10state school list previous school and I was bullied massively. Mortgage interest rates went up and my parents were massively financially stretched. I still remember the awful rows about cars breaking down etc.

Part of me thinks keep your daughter where she is as you owe it to her to honour your previous plan, put your other kids in good state school and shield the whole damn lot of them from financial angst. I have had a lot of trouble reconciling the idea of a. mother who would do anything for you with the reality of my Mother who was prepared to totally screw up her children's education to improve her own happiness marginally, create a financial shitstorm and then refuse to look for any kind of job to get back out of it.

I don't mean never mention money to children just try to shield them from the worst of it- kids need to get some sense of money/budgets (ie. My godchildren, whose parents never really have financial constraints, wanted yo sushi for lunch when out with me whereas I had a budget and voucher for Pizza - so we compromised and had takeaway sushi). I thought it was a good lesson in budgeting despite being unbelievably precocious a discussion to be having with an 8year old.

This is tablet typed and is full of mistakes.

When you say my eldest 2 know what they like in a school you are again putting them in the position of adults.

They only know the school they have been to and the conversations you have had about what is good in a school (likely private, academic, selective etc). They have no idea what a good comp is really like as it's outside their experience. Most kids given the choice will prefer what they already have or what adults around them are valuing.

They are children and you are giving them the job of adults. It's your job, not theirs to decide a) what sort of school suits them as individuals and b) what you can afford.

the more you write, the quicker I'd be pulling DD out of her school. There is going to be so much resentment amongst your children if only DD gets to go to 'the good' school.

Oh and I'm sure Saturday drama group is a lot cheaper than school fees?

One note on this OP. You clearly are in thrall to the private school experience - and I can understand that - but this is where you come in. All those parents who went to private schools themselves, but can't afford it for their DC (most of my school friends, in fact, and my two brothers), are still instilling those values in their DC. The values of hard work, the world is your oyster, aim high, go for the best university, the best job you can, travel, expand your horizons, join teams, play a musical instrument, practice, don't give up, read books, keep up to date with current affairs - all those things that make succeeding in life more likely.

Exactly. One of my friends is an interpreter. She went to a good state school. With the cash free-ed up, her parents sent her to a French language school (in France) every year for 6 years for 4 weeks in the summer. She was a lot better at French than me despite my private school education.

The little one hasn't experienced any private education bar nursery but he wants something more than his current offering. - sorry, but this just made me giggle. He sounds like a mini ofsted inspector. Are you sure he's not perhaps picking up on attitudes around him? Perhaps.....parental.....attitudes. Obviously, I am just wildly surmising.

"but he wants something more than his current offering."

I know this is a naff phrase but his French lessons are seriously a joke and he dislikes the fact that his teachers are not fluent good spellers and are always asking the TA/other teacher how to spell certain words.

I will add here that I am nothing but supportive of his current school.

Actually, I'm beginning to think a spell in a salt mine would do these kids a power of good.................

We have been on this private/state hamster wheel for the last 10 years or so. My eldest 2 know what they like in a school and unfortunately it costs money. The little one hasn't experienced any private education bar nursery but he wants something more than his current offering.

OP can you not see that this attitude, that your DC have clearly picked up from you, is what has got you into this mess?

Gobbolino's example of the language school was kind of what I meant but put badly.

If you downsized and moved to crap town with good school, with the money released from the house sale and mortgage you could buy as many drama clubs, residential holidays, music lessons, orchestra trips etc as you liked.

OP, it seems you have bigged up your DD's school to your DS and now that he's unable to go there, he cannot see the positives in any alternative.

As kundry says, it's your job to present the real world to them and help them understand that most of the time, you get out of school what you put in.

If you continue to share your "Woe is me, private school is not for the likes of us" viewpoint, they will stop being the well-adjusted DCs you describe them as being, and will never develop the skills they need to cope with life's ups and downs.

When you say my eldest 2 know what they like in a school you are again putting them in the position of adults.

Well exactly. My two year old certainly knows what he likes for lunch Ham, mummmeeeeee. Ham. Ham. Only ham. Haaaaaaammmmmmm but he's certainly not having it all the time

You sound hideously maudlin OP. If it wasn't for the time, I'd wonder if you had been on the gin. But seriously, I have visions of your DC huddling round you and your DH's heaving shoulders, having to console both of you about the fact that you can't afford to send them all to private schools.

It's about the school experience, the school day, the civilised eating of lunch, , playing I capture the castle on the green, house dinners with fabulously talented 6th formers singing as the entertainment, high quality music/drama/singing etc etc. Why do people think that these things don't matter to kids. Is it only my kids that recognise quality?

I will add here that I am nothing but supportive of his current school.

So I wonder where he got the idea at the age of 7 that it's a good idea to denigrate his teachers to you?

Yes, OP, it IS only your kids who recognise quality!

Who would have thought the solution could be SO simple?

Yep- my kids wouldn't recognise quality if they tripped over til.

In fact, they go/ went to state school. If you gave them quality they'd keep coal in it.

I am slightly confused. National Offers Day for secondaries is 2nd March. Struggling to get my head round the statement that there is an offer on the table for a state school that is far enough away for you to considering moving. You also say he narrowly missed the cut for the super selective; round my way people know if they have passed/failed before they have to submit the application form, but typically only 50% of those who have made the cut get offers - so maybe that suggests it wasn't the right environment and a comprehensive would give him room to shine. I would leave DD where she is, and send DS to whichever state school you get offered. Stay on the waiting list for other state schools though if you don't get your preference, or you change your mind about the location of your preferred school.

"Woe is me, private school is not for the likes of us"

DH feels like this ^^ I don't feel like this but if we walk away from it all now I might as well.

I have not bigged up DD's school to DS, he can see it for himself when he goes there. He's hungrier for it than she is which just adds another layer of shit to this whole situation.

I may have put the kids off our catchment school as I worked there for a spell and they can't have failed to notice my rants.

The 2 boys are currently in the 'best' state schools in the area and they and we are happy enough with them (just not ecstatic).

I'm a great believer in aspiring to have it all but long ago accepted you cant always have it all at once.If private education is important to you, sell your nice house in a nice part of the country(query:are schools local to a house like that really bad?) ,downsize and pay.If all three are bright you'll likely be contributing to Uni education too
Retrain. Get a decently paid job .And suck it up .
And don't put the onus on you children .Mi d you they could proably do with the reality check you obviously never had ,despite your beginnings
Sorry if this sounds harsh but it's a typical First world problem isn't it

the civilised eating of lunch,

Is it only my kids that recognise quality?

Oh FFS. This has GOT to be a wind up. Or that Shona chick again...

I may have put the kids off our catchment school as I worked there for a spell and they can't have failed to notice my rants.

I'd say you need to learn a bit of self control. For your finances and your discussions around your children.

merlottime, DS is at a middle school and can stay there until the end of Y7 (it used to be Y8 but we are phasing in 2 tier). He is bright and motivated but not hothoused. He 'passed' the 11+ with a good margin but sadly not enough for our superselective (next county) based on previous year's scores.

His current school is a comprehensive middle school so a good size and he is in the top 5% ability wise (guessing a bit here). He's bright but not a genius.

If you're not working, why don't you home educate?

Can you sing? You could make sumptuous dinners and DH could serenade them

OP, I think you said you went to private school but felt you hadn't made the most of your opportunities? So that's one piece of anecdotal evidence from your own experience suggesting that the school is not the important thing - it's the attitude. I also think that it may mean you are more likely to be dismissive of the opportunities available to state schooled kids.

To take one example - you talk about the drama provision at your DD's school which would suit your DS, who is keen on drama. My brother and I both went to a state comprehensive and he is now an actor (not a famous one but he makes enough money to live on). He was encouraged by his drama teacher but also took advantage of the various out of school opportunities available such as local and national youth theatres. With no school fees you would be able to spend more money on extra curricular activities like these. Incidentally, he also plays the violin beyond grade 8 standard following a combination of school and private lessons.

I'm not saying you should or shouldn't take your daughter out of her school - I would have hated to move schools in Y9. But I do think you have to think carefully about the attitude towards state schooling you are inculcating on your kids. It sounds like your local state school is really good. Going to state school should not be viewed as something only failures do, but from what you've said maybe that's the impression you've given your children? Which in turn is going to make them feel pretty rubbish when they have to go there.

In the interests of full disclosure of my own prejudices, I have never been to private school so may be underestimating the advantages. I went to a comp (as I said above) and then to Oxford. I never had any private tuition outside school.

My DS moved to a little comp of 400+ pupils, true there weren't ace musicians (though the school has produced a couple of now famous girl singers(there is a lot of folk singing etc in this area)) but he had such laughs with his still lovely friends. Hilarious camping trips. Totally mixed in take as it is a country area.
You value the civilized lunches, the sixth formers singing because that is what you rate, and your DD will always feel privileged as she believes what you tell her and what the school encourages her to believe.
I value what my DS had, and what he still has in long term friends and an understanding of how everyone ticks, not the chosen few.
I'm sure he values it too.

It's obviously just a step too far to hope that we can privately educate our kids

But it's not a step too far to hope to be the parents who support their children's education enthusiastically, with empathy, time, effort and engagement during the ups and downs. You sound both willing and caperble of doing that by the bucketload.

Nor is it a step too far to hope to be the parents who prioritise the children's need for sustainability of home, education and family unity, over a personal want to stamp themselves a sucess, based on the measuring stick of the past, with the label "provided a private education". It takes letting go of ghosts and self imposed unreasonable expectations connected to a sense of self worth. Which is not easy, but doable when the other side of the equation is given at least equal weight.

And when all is said and done, having been at both private and bog standard comp, it was the children who had the sort of sustainable, consistent, "kids' needs before adults' wants" centred planning and support who had the non shitty end of the stick. In both fee paying and non fee paying environments.

You don't live in your parents' world. You live in this one. The way it is, not the way you (and a great many other people) wish it were. That is not your fault. And there is bugger all you can do about it. Perhaps playing roulette with your children's education as the chip isn't the best way to honor your parents' sacrifices and efforts to get you the education they felt you needed ?

Maybe wanting to emulate your parents is better served by focusing on the essence, rather than the form, of what they did. Which ultimately was being prepared to make the effort required to provide the most sustainable, and supported education experience they could afford.