to think giving bus passes and winter fuel payment to JSA cliaments by taking it away from wealthy pensioners is not "punishing pensioners"

[dhdjdbrjrkbr]

I live in a very marginal constituency, lib dem won by narrow margin.

Anyway I wrote a long letter to all the parties I'm thinking of voting for.

Mostly they ignored the points I raised and pointed to useless policys like help to buy (that just exasperates the problem).

However the Tory guy said re bus passes and winter fuel payments he called it "punishing pensioners" to not give them universally.

The rest of the letter was bland crap, but this point really annoyed me. When I was on JSA luckily I had support from my family to get through, but I really needed them and it was very grating when I was often spending more than I got on JSA On buses to hear pensioners talking about their cruises or extensions.

That's the thing pensioners are killing off some bus routes. They company used to receive 100% of the fare, then 70%, now its 50-60% with talk of it going down to 40%.

A blank cheque for buses does no one any favours.

Its sad to see on buses that largely the only people that pay are the ones that can afford it least (young).

But the bus companies are subsidised for the pensioners using the service.

And the bus companies can only stop a non profitable route if they can prove no one uses it.

If they discount pensioners then a number of routes will suddenly become 'unused'.

What then? Well, rural homes will lose even more of their public transport routes.

THAT is why bus companies are telling you that OAP passes are crippling them. They aren't. Really!

How do I know? Well where I used to live the bus company was successful in stopping the route that picked up in the various hamlets and hams along a main road. They argued that a bus on the main road was sufficient - despite the minimum walk to that road from the nearest ham houses being 3 miles.

Initially the community bus ran people to the main road bus stop. But now they run a duplicate service... and make money at it as they now get the subsidy and allow non pensioners to use the service...

So YABVU, again!

(And to think, I promised myself I wouldn't join in again)

Pensioner passes don't pay the full fare rate, they are killing off some routes here

Ho hum. If you say so. But at least I have a modicum of proof that it need not be so!

No mama but those routes will only be during times when everybody else is at work anyway.

OAP bus passes for those not poor simply can't be justified.

If we can't afford CB for "rich" families on £50 k and above we can't afford bus passes for the same "rich" pensioners who will have enjoyed never having their CB touched and fees,grants for their kids at uni.

Sick of the grey vote coming before all else with the Tories.

And pensioners who can afford new cars every other year can get out and damn well drive them particularly when you consider the vast maj of families are nursing old bangers to get them to work every day.

My dh cycles several miles a day to avoid paying the exorbitant £7 a day fee for a 20 min journey.

Nobody is talking about poor pensioners but wealthier.We've all had to tighten our belts, why should one section of society be exempt?

Yes... I do understand the application of Twirly passes (Uncle is a bus driver...).

But I'll pop off again, cos this sort of circular logic that insists all OAPs can be targetted as some of them are rich is, for me, one of the more repugnant parts of the MN oeuvre.

Again nobody is talking about all pensioners but the wealthier ones who don't need it and we can ill afford to chuck away money on.We were told wasting money on richer people in the form of benefits has to stop.

Tories need to actually follow their own rhetoric through.

Its so hard. I know pensioners that dont have a mortgage, two or three holidays a year, 2 cars. My neighbour worked hard for his retirement but if you get on the subject of his free bus pass he argues he worked 40 plus years and deserves it! My dad and my inlaws still pay council rents but they are still better off than people in their 20s. They would argue that they worked all their lives too (and they did)
The govenment wont bring in too many changes as they know older folk will vote.. Im sure by the time Im in my 60s there wont be any perks at all, my guess is some benefits will be fased out slowly. Its a tough call all round, i really can see both sides of this argument. Not sure what the answers are and how any government would solve it. Building more social housing might help,but thats another thread.

We've always worked hard too.

They're lucky they had 18 years of CB per child,uni fees,grants,WFA. We won't have any of that but will be working as equally as hard.Pensioners don't have the monopoly on working hard,my mil never worked a day in her life.

I know. I really can see both sides. My dad is 92 and fought in WW2. He worked from age 15 to 66. His generation were told ' care for you all from cradle to grave' and although he is aware of social problems, he still believes ( as an ex veteran) this should be the case. I think that the younger generation also needs some help. As im not in govenment i do not have any answers.

I object to Pensioner bashing as some sort of panacea that will improve the situation for the poor/ disabled/ less advantaged in this country. The idea that if the Pensioners gave up their so called freebies it would redress the economic balance, is ludicrous.

The solution lies in the hands of the Politicians.

The people who actually run this country are a privileged bunch. They are so well off that they can't be classed as pensioners and you may not even find them in Parliment or elected.

I would identify a Pensioner as someone living on a fixed income. The very rich have access and influence and they will not be living on a fixed income. They have a powerful Media Presence and they can control what they want us to know. You saw recently how morally bankrupt the likes of the Press Barons were. Not one of the owners faced a prison term over the disgusting phone tapping. They can also pay for Tax avoidance. They often went to school together and have a long history of not giving anyone, less advantaged than themselves ANYTHING without a huge struggle.....

Education for Women, Votes for Women, , Education for all, Universal Health Care, Occupational Pensions, sick pay, Holiday, and Maternity Pay, Job Security. etc, has all been fought for by the people who did the actual the work.
This country is a rich country and no one should be living in poverty. It is certainly not the majority of pensioners fault and it is naive to think so. The post needs to direct her angst towards the politicians and the very priveledged people who control them.

It would not make a scrap of difference if all the pensioners gave up their bus passes and their Winter fuel payments. It would just go towards feathering some Politicians/ unelected super rich persons nest.

If rich pensioners gave up their free bus passes so they could be given to JSA people it would make a world of difference!

Baby boomers will probably go down in history as the generation that worked the least IMO.

Haven't even bothered getting my bus pass OP and quite willing for someone more needy to have it-but will you please cut it with the generalisations about baby boomers.
Your first post had a point but you seem almost phobic about older people.

-and holeinmyheart is quite right.

you seem almost phobic about older people

I think that's a polite understatement. She seethes with resentment at every opportunity.

Oh, and I happen to think that people on JSA should get free or heavily discounted transport.

And I agree with holeinmyheart too.

Am I the only one who's noticed that we have a repeat offending name changer who joins and posts obsessively about older people and "healthy" food?!

No, you're not, Ed.

Bit weird, eh?

No Ed

You aren't the only one.

Hole I don't agree at all, your just blaming the MPs for everything. They are voted in by people who vote for the person that will help feather their own nest the most. People should take responsibility for the people the vote to represent them.

Over 90% of over 60s are registered to vote apparently and progressively fewer in each age band the younger you go (it was on the Welsh news today due to a drive in Cardiff to encourage people to register).
Therefore solution is for people to become engaged politically.
OP you cannot blame older people if some younger people don't bother to go on the electoral register.

(People should take responsibility for the people they vote to represent them )

I have no time for people who moan, take from the state, and don't vote because they cannot bothered. Says it all really.

I wouldnt dream of not voting