Active discussions

Meet the Other Phone. Only the apps you allow.

Meet the Other Phone.
Only the apps you allow.

Buy now

Please or to access all these features

Talk
AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

to think giving bus passes and winter fuel payment to JSA cliaments by taking it away from wealthy pensioners is not "punishing pensioners"

183 replies

dhdjdbrjrkbr · 03/02/2015 17:37

I live in a very marginal constituency, lib dem won by narrow margin.

Anyway I wrote a long letter to all the parties I'm thinking of voting for.

Mostly they ignored the points I raised and pointed to useless policys like help to buy (that just exasperates the problem).

However the Tory guy said re bus passes and winter fuel payments he called it "punishing pensioners" to not give them universally.

The rest of the letter was bland crap, but this point really annoyed me. When I was on JSA luckily I had support from my family to get through, but I really needed them and it was very grating when I was often spending more than I got on JSA On buses to hear pensioners talking about their cruises or extensions.

OP posts:
ilovesooty · 03/02/2015 20:20

I wasn't calling ageism suboptimal
I was commenting on my general impression of the OP's posts.

Horseradishes · 03/02/2015 20:26

Yabu.

  1. I don't think wealthy pensioners use their bus passes, they likely use taxis or limos

  2. The cost of administration for means testing fuel allowance would mean little or no saving overall.

MythicalKings · 03/02/2015 20:30

The OP has recently started 2 threads having a go at pensioners. Hmm

suboptimal · 03/02/2015 20:30

Sorry sooty I was referring to MythicalKings with that comment.

suboptimal · 03/02/2015 20:31

But this thread isn't having a go at pensioners, so why the sadface?

keepitsimple0 · 03/02/2015 20:35

2) The cost of administration for means testing fuel allowance would mean little or no saving overall.

I don't understand why pensioners get special consideration for WFA. so, if you are not a pensioner and can't afford fuel, tough luck?

your either too poor to afford fuel or not.

LePetitMarseillais · 03/02/2015 20:43

Horse so how can they afford to means test CB?

MythicalKings · 03/02/2015 20:44

It's a hmm face. Two threads complaining about pensioners in as many days.

If wanting to take bus passes away from the isn't having a go at pensioners I'm not sure what would be.

Original poster
dhdjdbrjrkbr · 03/02/2015 20:47

I'm ageist for wanting to take away tax payer funded bus passes from wealthy pensioners? Lol no wonder the PM's are scared of you loons.

OP posts:
suboptimal · 03/02/2015 20:48

I'm not sure whether the old "costs more to means test than to give the benefit" isn't just an urban myth.

I can't find anything concrete on Google, in fact I came across an interesting discussion which included the fact that only 12% of recipients of wfa are in fuel poverty.

I don't know why wfa couldn't just be given to anyone in receipt of pension credit. While they're at it they could give out my leaflet detailing what help pensioners are entitled to, to encourage them to actually claim.

suboptimal · 03/02/2015 20:49

MythicalKings you are reading very selectively.

Op doesn't want to take away every pensioners bus pass. She's talking about it being means tested - given only if you need it.

ilovesooty · 03/02/2015 20:51

My pensionable age will be 66 and I hope and expect still to be working and on no need of a bus pass.
My issue is more with the OP's general attitude towards pensioners than with this particular thread.
I can see a case for some form of means testing but think it might cost more than the savings would justify.

MythicalKings · 03/02/2015 20:53

You also seem to want pensioners off the roads from your other thread. And now you're name calling.

Nice.

As it happens I'm working, not retired. I just don't want to steal from old people.

suboptimal · 03/02/2015 20:54

Apparently the over 65s have seen a marginal rise in household income since 2008. By comparison average household income of the under 35s has dropped by 8%.

Original poster
dhdjdbrjrkbr · 03/02/2015 20:54

I'm not sure whether the old "costs more to means test than to give the benefit" isn't just an urban myth.

Its totally a myth. Would cost nothing to give wfa just to people on pension credits. Its the typical lowest common daily mail reader argument against it.

OP posts:
suboptimal · 03/02/2015 20:55

Hardly stealing

ilovesooty · 03/02/2015 20:56

How many times do I have to say I don't read the Daily Mail?

And your name calling and insults really don't help your argument.

Original poster
dhdjdbrjrkbr · 03/02/2015 21:01

*MoanCollins

We're in an odd situation now. 20 years ago the vast majority of pensioners would have been people who grew up in the 20s and 30s who had very hard lives to begin with, faced hardship during the war and depended on their state pension and also faced a great deal of hardship in their old age.

But times have changed. People hold onto an idea of pensioners being little old ladies eking out a meagre pension. In reality they're likely to be members of one of the most privileged generations that we've ever had. People who had access to cheap housing, free education, massively higher levels of social mobility, good pensions and high levels of disposable income.

They won't give it up and there's nothing we can do about it because there's more of them and they vote. I know a lot of that generation like to think of themselves as left wing, and I think the only way it could change is if a political party stood up and asked them to make a sacrifice to help the younger generation. Accept policies which meant their house was worth less, lose their benefits, agree to give more up to fund their care in their old age. But they won't.

It frustrates me. My parents get it, they go on holiday 5 or 6 times a year including to the Carribbean. To some extent it's understandable as my Dad is disabled and has a health condition which means he feels better if he spends time in a warm environment. But I do find it hard to swallow sometimes when I'm struggling to pay for the childminder and buy school uniform and I wonder why they get help that I don't.*

Post of the thread, I agree 100% Smile

OP posts:
Dressingdown1 · 03/02/2015 21:21

Wfa is only £100 a year for pensioners under 80, or £200 if they live alone.

Even if it was taken away from wealthy pensioners it wouldn't go very far after allowing for administrative costs.

Original poster
dhdjdbrjrkbr · 03/02/2015 21:31

200 would go along way to someone on JSA!

OP posts:
Oldsu · 03/02/2015 21:37

Its totally a myth. Would cost nothing to give wfa just to people on pension credits. Its the typical lowest common daily mail reader argument against it.

But pensioners need to KNOW they can claim pension credit.

Sorry it makes me angry that my Dad who paid NI for 51 years and tax for 70 years was left assuming his pension was all he was going to get, have you ever seen your Dad cry? it broke my heart when he broke down at Christmas, that's the disgrace not the pensioners who get more then some people feel they are entitled to, but the 1000s of pensioners who live in poverty and don't know they can get help

Leaflets to all pensioner would help, so would putting something on the state pension award letter, but until every pensioner is in this country has the opportunity and help to claim every benefit thy are entitled to then I stand by what I have said, I would rather a 1000 pensioners get pensioner benefits that they may not need then ONE pensioner who need it lose out because they dont know they are entitled to it

MythicalKings · 03/02/2015 21:38

Lots of pensioners were on JSA before they went on to state pension. Most pensioners aren't rich. You can froth at the mouth all you like about rich pensioners but it won't make it true.

You also want to take their driving licences away. Why not go the whole hog and bump them off when they hit 65 and then you can take the houses they worked to pay for?

Oldsu · 03/02/2015 21:47

Oh please don't say that MythicalKings my DH was 65 last year and I am rather fond of him

keepitsimple0 · 03/02/2015 22:13

Even if it was taken away from wealthy pensioners it wouldn't go very far after allowing for administrative costs.

take it away from everyone, and add it to welfare.

either heat is necessary or it isn't. if it is, the poor, old and young need it.

Hillingdon · 03/02/2015 22:28

My DM house is small but we call it Barbados! She has a small private pension and has little spare money but knows that keeping warm is a priority. However my elderly neighbour in a rather large house with a fair income and pension (she told me what it was) insists on just heating one room. The rest of the house is musty and damp. I have suggested she down size but she won't.

Sometimes it isn't always down to money. It people's views on what they choose to spend it on. How we can change that God only knows!