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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

To think that your children should come before God?

116 replies

lbsjob87 · 25/01/2015 07:13

Before I start, I just want to say that while I'm not religious myself, I totally respect those who are, and am not criticising 99% of churchgoers (or equivalent).
But in the last week I have heard of two separate families where I just feel really sorry for the kids involved.

The first is an old school friend, married to a vicar, always been heavily involved with the church, as you may expect. She has 3 DC, 14, 12 and 5. Her DS1 (12yo) is very high functioning ASD. Her DS2 is in Reception year.

Until recently they lived and worked in a suburban parish in a medium sized city in the South. DS1 had various problems at primary school, exclusions, etc due to his later diagnosed ASD, and my friend ended up giving up her job at a local charity to be there for him as much as poss.

He eventually settled down in Year 7, as his new school was very geared up to help SEN kids, and started to make progress, and my friend was looking at going back to work p/t.
DS2 started school in Spetember, and apparently was loving it.

Then in November she put on Facebook that her husband had "had the calling" to basically up sticks and move to Manchester to continue God's work. So two weeks before Christmas, they moved to their new church, which is in a similar kind of neighbourhood as the last one, but obviously 300 miles away.

I sent her a note asking how they were settling in, she said her DD was upset at leaving her friends, but she'll "make more". She's Yr 10, so just starting Term 2 of her GCSEs, DS1 is trying hard to settle but has regressed into himself a lot, and DS2 was just upset because he couldn't do the school nativity because they pulled him out the week before, but was getting over it. She was very upbeat about it all, but also said she was a bit down at the mo.

So I had this conversation, then a few days later, my brother said his kids were going to a leaving party at their church for some friends. The parents have "had the calling" to give up their jobs and go and do missionary type work in Africa. They don't think it's a good idea to take their 7yo DD, because she is at school, so she's going to stay here with her GPs, but they are taking their 3yo and 14mo.

Just seriously, what is wrong with these people? That is 6 kids I know about who seem to be having their lives flipped upside down, due to their parents "calling". Surely their duty is to their own children above their beliefs? I can totally understand being heavily involved with church life, but it's the uprooting the entire family to do it - in both cases giving up existing jobs, so it's not to find work as such.

I should add that my judgement is clouded by the fact I had an ultra religious uncle who it later emerged abused two of my cousins because "God wanted them to make their dad happy." We didn't find out for years because they became more and more isolated from the family and move away every couple of years.

Not obviously suggesting that is the case here, but it does make me ultra aware of how children can sometimes be affected by the itinerant nature of this sort of lifestyle.

Also, for entirely different reasons, I moved around a lot as a kid and know how unsettling it is.

AIBU to feel sorry for these kids, or do I just not get it? It's none of my business, obviously, but I can still feel for them, can't I?

OP posts:
JoanHickson · 25/01/2015 07:18

This isn't about God. It's about odd parenting choices. You may want to think about who you let into your life.

Sirzy · 25/01/2015 07:19

So the first person you are judging got a new job so has to leave to move somewhere else with his family? That's hardly an unusual thing and whilst it is a tough situation at first sometimes needs must and if that is where the work is they have to take it really.

FarFromAnyRoad · 25/01/2015 07:25

I agree - this is not about God. It might be about odd parenting choices but children of the military also move about at short notice. I have a friend who went to 8 different schools between primary and leaving - she's perfectly ok about her past and is completely undamaged. Children are resilient and they may complain at first but they'll survive. I was uprooted at GSCE time to emigrate - I bitched like crazy but within 2 months it was as if it had never been any other way.
I think your post is probably about something else - is it the abuse angle?

EbonyIck · 25/01/2015 07:25

I believe (please someone correct me if I'm wrong), that in your first example the vicar's 'calling' is being asked/told to move by the church. I'm not sure how much say they have or if it massively affects career progression to say no.

But I knew a vicar's child growing up who had moved to our area because they were assigned to the local church having been elsewhere.

Also I guess if you truly believe the move IS a calling, eg God wants you to do it, I'd imagine that puts a different complexion on things.

I'm not a believer myself but I can imagine how hard it is to balance family and sincere belief especially when it's your career as well.

In your second example, well, I kinda agree with you but again it's impossible to understand without faith I guess? Hope the DC are alright living with the GP.

lbsjob87 · 25/01/2015 07:25

Fair enough, Sirzy but he had a job already. It was only in August she was saying how they were all feeling more settled now that DS1 seemed to be happy at school and DS2 was looking forward to starting school, so AFAIK there was no threat of redundancy or anything like that. Obviously the cost of living in cheaper in the North, but as they live in a vicarage anyway, I imagine that's not as big an issue for them.

OP posts:
headinhands · 25/01/2015 07:25

The thing that concerns me is labelling a choice as a 'calling from god' so that it can't be criticised by those it affects. But then that's religion all over really isn't it.

austenozzy · 25/01/2015 07:26

I agree, op. Having a personal calling is all well and good, when you don't have small children who are completely dependent upon you. Or older children who need stability at a very important time.

These callings to do selfless things for others also seem selfish when it affects their own children so much at the same time. I don't think I'd be able to sacrifice so much of my child's happiness and stability in that way.

26Point2Miles · 25/01/2015 07:29

Gosh you are very judgy! Moving home a few times is part of life!

austenozzy · 25/01/2015 07:32

Moving home is - leaving a 7 year old daughter behind (while taking siblings) to help people in Africa is a slightly different thing!

Sirzy · 25/01/2015 07:33

Vicars are very rarely given long term placements in a parish. It is usual for them to have to move elsewhere and they generally don't get a lot of choice in the fact they will have to move.

lbsjob87 · 25/01/2015 07:35

I think that's kind if what I was trying to say headinhands (but not as succinctly as you!)
Do vicars not apply for jobs like everyone else?
From 300 miles away, how else would the new church even know he existed, let alone was perfect for the job?

I hadn't considered the military angle, FarFrom..... Maybe it's the same sort of thing....

OP posts:
FarFromAnyRoad · 25/01/2015 07:35

Yes, austenozzy you're right - that is a different thing and not right on any planet I'd want to live on. That is damaging for the child and the siblings and I'd imagine will change things forever. And what will happen when the 3 yo needs schooling? Will they send that one back? Obviously they've not thought it through and even a foolish rush of blood to the head a calling from God will want thinking through.

Petallic · 25/01/2015 07:35

My understanding is churches can choose to move their ministry around, it's not always the minister who wants to move, and as others have said, you are massively judging someone for changing jobs anyway. My friends dad was/is a minister, his preaching style didn't suit the congregation he was given, so they moved him across the country. I'm sure if you asked him, he would also say it was gods calling to move him.

saoirse31 · 25/01/2015 07:37

Would you be as critical if their job moves had been non religion related- maybe first one due to reqts of job and second for career advancement? I'm not sure what abuse example has to do with your point tbh.

Skatingfastonthinice · 25/01/2015 07:45

I instantly thought of the military, as that's how I lived my life as a child. I loved it.
Then I thought of the thousands more children that I know who have been moved away from their area and familiar places and people because of family break-ups and decisions by adults.
Feel sorry for whomsoever you wish, but do they need your pity? Is it helpful or constructive? Could you support them in a more effective way?
Bit like praying for them really, nice thought and comforting for the one doing it, sod all use to the recipient. (IMO)

MaryWestmacott · 25/01/2015 07:59

The vicar at our church got the calling and moved to Italy with his 4 dcs, 3 school aged (Protestant vicar going to a v industrial part of Italy, tough gig). They've been a year and came back early December to see friends/family, oldest are in international schools, youngest 2 have picked up Italian. They have had some struggles adjusting, but before becoming a vicar, he was in the army - if he'd never has the calling to the church the family probably would have spent a lot of time moving round following dad's career anyway.

It's very rare for a vicar to spend his/her career in just one parish, it's a lifestyle you sign up to.

Leaving the 7 year old behind is an unusual choice, most would take them and home ed for a year or two. I guess as a family they have their reasons. It seems hard to me, but then I know people who at 7 were sent to boarding school, staying with grandparents doesn't seem that bad in comparison...

Pancakeflipper · 25/01/2015 08:09

I think you have put in too much info for the first family situation.They could be identified.

Some like Methodist preachers get 4 yrs at a placement. It might be extended it might not. So it's not easy for families to put down roots

Koalafications · 25/01/2015 08:11

I have quite a few family members and friends who are vicars and they haven't had much of a say in whether they stay or leave their parish. So I think YABU for judging someone for moving when it isn't their choice.

Also, I don't think your point about the sexual abuse is relevant to your thread and makes it seems that despite your protesting in your OP this is just another religion bashing thread. And let's be fair, Christian denominations seem to be fair game on MN for that.

coolaschmoola · 25/01/2015 08:15

Sounds just like a forces lifestyle.... I loved it.

Charlotte3333 · 25/01/2015 08:16

I don't think you are being unreasonable. You had an unsettled childhood and are simply looking at this situation through the eyes of someone who understands how difficult it can be to up sticks. And as someone who also moved home a fair few times as a child, I get that. I've moved house once since DS was born 9 years ago, and wouldn't contemplate moving again unless it was absolutely unavoidable. Friends of ours have moved a few times in a very short space of time and I've watched and thought to myself how hard that must be, not just for the children. But it's not my place to judge.

You have to accept that other people make lifestyle choices you wouldn't. Doesn't mean you have to agree with them though.

TeacupDrama · 25/01/2015 08:22

In many denominations regular moves are encouraged so if he had not moved this year it would have been next which may have been more disruptive to eldest child. Also moves are rarely if ever local to discourage congregation moving to favourite minister 4 miles away. The Methodists work on circuits with a move every 4-5 years, in C of E regular moves are common when younger if you don't' move regularly you may be stuck in same parish for ever.

Missionaries in churches I know take children with them and home school if no suitable school or some use the same type of correspondence schools like in very remote parts of Australia and USA though now internet based, they may use boarding schools for teenagers

diddl · 25/01/2015 08:26

Well as others have said, with the first one it's probably a move for employment such as many people have to make.

With the 2nd, splitting a family! That's just awful imo.

Chunderella · 25/01/2015 08:28

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

Skatingfastonthinice · 25/01/2015 08:30

Because of my unsettled childhood, I used to feel very sorry for those who had only lived in one place all their lives. Smile
Not only had I seen and done things they had no concept of (This was the 60s and 70s), many of their relationships seemed stale and small and unexciting. To know everyone in the area, to have had the same squabbles with the same people for a decade? To only have the limited resources of a small town or villiage (we were never based in a city, so I had a warped idea of how non-forces lives worked)
I started to understand the benefits of being in one place for a long time well into my 30s, and I've now been static for 15 years, but I do get itchy feet. Even now.

bakingaddict · 25/01/2015 08:31

Totally agree with Charlotte3333's last statement. My childminder hasn't seen her own children for 3 years because she is in this country doing god's work as a missionary. Nothing is above my children and I couldn't imagine leaving them for this length of time but for some people this obviously isn't the case

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