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To be totally baffled (Ched Evans related)

828 replies

soapboxqueen · 19/10/2014 12:45

Just reading in the guardian that Ched Evans has applied to the Criminal Cases Review Commission to review his case. That's fine because it is part of our due process and legal system.

However, in the article it points out that his girlfriend's father is paying for appeal barristers, private detectives and even offering a reward for information in order to help his appeal. Why would you do that? Why would you put up so much money to protect a person who at best (from their perspective at least) cheated on your daughter in a rather deplorable fashion and at worst a rapist? Why would got want your daughter to be with such a person?

I really don't understand.

I'll see if I can get the link to work.

OP posts:
Everyotherfreckle · 23/10/2014 17:19

But Clayton left (having not ejaculated) and then Ched and the girl continued to have sex. So at least one of them wasn't interrupted by her being sick? It mentions nothing about her being sick actually (apart from Clayton telling the porter about the 'ill girl).

And then apparently, despite having so calculating lt made his way to that hotel room to have sex with this girl he had never met, mid sex (which the girl was apparently an enthusiastic participant in) he suddenly had a crisis of consciousness and gets worried about his girlfriend ringing him, so he abandons this apparently enthusiastic 'shag' that he had put so much effort into meeting and leaves.

In fact on the website it says In his evidence, Ched stated that when his friend had left the room he had suddenly become nervous that his girlfriend may ring him. He spoke to Clayton on the phone who was by now outside of the hotel. He said he stopped having sex with the complainant and decided to join his friend outside. What, so he spoke to Clayton on the phone and then stopped having sex with her? That seems odd if apparently the sex was so enthusiastic?

No, I am building an altogether different picture here - which is that once Ched arrived, Clayton Macdonald decided that this was pretty shit sex as she was so drunk (and had possibly been sick or something) and so left without bothering to finish. Ched carried on for a bit and also came to a similar conclusion, also decided this really wasn't worth it and so rang his mate to meet him outside.

I feel quite sullied writing that, but the more I read about this, particularly on the very website which we are supposed to read and have the epiphany that it wasn't rape, the more I think it's blindingly obvious that it was.

MyEmpireOfDirt · 23/10/2014 17:22

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

Amethyst24 · 23/10/2014 17:29

It does say in one of those reports that neither of them used contraception (which is niiiiice for Natasha to know) so that probs explains why they didn't ejaculate, yes.

I also love the fact that he planned to lie to his insurance company about losing his phone. That went well, didn't it?

BrokenButNotFinished · 23/10/2014 17:32

Everyotherfreckle: you could partially enter a room if you weren't sure what was going on... but then surely most people would turn around and leave again if what was going on was sex...

DuellingFango: CM certainly seemed to behave in a less guilty manner, by going out the fromt way, speaking to reception etc. As opposed to sneaking out the back way...

BrokenButNotFinished · 23/10/2014 17:35

Amethyst: Surely they wouldn't be bothered about that? Failure to ejaculate could be down to drink, drugs, tiredness - or a lack of stimulation from an unresponsive partner...

Mumraathenoisylion · 23/10/2014 17:38

I would say being a footballer with a girlfriend and trying to keep up that front in public would lead the sociopath rapist ched evans to not want any problems such as unwanted pregnancies.

Itsfab · 23/10/2014 17:53

I read the police are investigating the harassment the rapist's friends are doing on the victim. Has anything come of that yet?

pamish · 23/10/2014 17:58

I don't know why these blokes bother involving women in their bonding rituals. From a particularly gruelling account of a 'typical' post-match party in Manchester, organised by the club, the whole point is for as many of the blokes as possible to pile in at once. Look up the term spit roasting. Can't they just bypass the middle woman?

Everyotherfreckle · 23/10/2014 18:03

Yes but if you had gone to the effort of going back to a hotel with a girl for a shag/entered the room uninvited with the sole purpose of having sex with her, and it was good consensual sex, but you were worried about getting her pregnant, wouldn't you ummmm, at least finish off even if it were somewhere else in the vicinity?

I will admit that I am not au fait with the etiquette of these sorts of sordid encounters, but if its the norm to avoid pregnancy/your girlfriend findin out by not coming at all (despite a willing and enthusiastic partner) then it seems even more ridiculous and pointless!

Mumraathenoisylion · 23/10/2014 18:20

I think in this case though the rapist was more interested in 'having a laugh' with his friends by degrading the poor woman rather than gaining his own pleasure. That's just my interpretation though and I have some quite solid insider knowledge of the mainframe of footballers like this...in fact something very similar happened to a friend of mine in a hotel room with a footballer but she was actually drugged.

Mumraathenoisylion · 23/10/2014 18:21

That sounded a bit odd reading it back...insider knowledge was by no means a brag btw, I feel physically disgusted when I have to be in the same room as these people.

YonicScrewdriver · 23/10/2014 18:55

I think you may have a point, mumraa.

It's not clear why the two friends were outside the window except for such "having a laugh" purposes...

AskBasil · 23/10/2014 19:00

Just as an aside, this stood out from that report:

"It’s not uncommon for us to pick up girls. We’re footballers, we’re rich and we’ve got money, that’s what girls like."

No qualifier such as "before I had a steady girlfriend"

She's got a right one there hasn't she? How full of denial and cognitive dissonance must she be? Imagine the therapist's bills in 20 years time.

YonicScrewdriver · 23/10/2014 19:04

Basil, I do wonder if the rapist Ched Evans has, in the past, put his penis inside Ms Massey when she was at a similar level of drunkeness.

purplefeathers · 23/10/2014 19:04

Ah, but maybe she's one of the 'girls' that he refers to. Maybe she just likes him because he's a footballer, is rich and has money Hmm

I hate that statement.

Everyotherfreckle · 23/10/2014 19:15

Yes, you could be right mumraa. I guess the idea of a man putting 'having a laugh' ahead of his own pleasure is a bit weird to me! But as yonic says, the fact that his brother and co were outside filming it certainly contributes to this. In fact on the website it's mentioned but completely glossed over, as of its just part and parcel of any sexual encounter.

I don't know, I guess I always thought that the reason that CE maintains his innocence is because in a way he truly believes that he did not rape her. Because he ascribes to the (seemingly quite popular) view that unless you are holding a knife to her throat and she is screaming 'no' its not rape. That in his mind, the worst that happened was he got a 'shit shag' because she was really drunk.

I don't necessarily believe he opened that hotel room door thinking 'right, I am going to rape whoever is in this room'. But I do think that, possibly unless she was pushing him off and shouting 'no', he was always going to put it in whatever female was behind the door, regardless of the state she was in. And that is what makes him a rapist and a dangerous man.

YonicScrewdriver · 23/10/2014 19:21

Yy. But when everyone close to him is telling him he's not a rapist, just an adulterer, then he's hardly likely to reach a different conclusion.

purplefeathers · 23/10/2014 19:25

I agree Freckle. I think the common misconception is that if no force is used then its not rape. But just because CE doesn't understand this doesn't mean he should be acquitted of the crime.

Unfortunately instead of having people around him to explain this to him he seems be surrounded by people who are as ignorant as he is. Therefore he hasn't learnt anything and therefore he is still a danger to women.

purplefeathers · 23/10/2014 19:25

Cross-post with Yonic Smile

HexBramble · 23/10/2014 20:02

Pamish, what do you mean, 'typical' after match party organised by the club?

I'm wondering how deep this misogyny runs and am slightly dreading your response

GetMe · 23/10/2014 20:15

Sorry if this has already been covered but when does this sorry circus end in regards to him trying to get the conviction overturned?

He's had his appeal refused and now wants a review by the criminal cases review commission. If they say his conviction is sound, is that it? I'm so sick of this continued legal fight fuelling this. When does the legal system get to say, enough is enough a jury found you guilty.

Also in regards to the discussion on CM, why couldn't the jury find him guilty of conspiracy to rape or similar or did they not have this option? Can he not be tried again for this offence?

Again sorry if this has all been said, I'm not very au fait with the legal system and there are some very knowledgeable and insightful people on this thread.

YonicScrewdriver · 23/10/2014 20:19

I don't think the jury can find guilty on a charge that's not presented in court. I actually doubt there was enough evidence anyway (CM would've just said he was texting CE for info, that he was surprised when he arrived etc)

If the CCRC says no it would make no sense for CE's legal team to try again with them unless they genuinely had other evidence, and it's hard to think what that might be at this stage.

purplefeathers · 23/10/2014 20:32

If they don't have the evidence then need after offering a £10,000 incentive, I doubt the evidence exists...

deadduck · 23/10/2014 21:16

Newpencilcase, like you in your blog, I met a Norman, too. I was a little older, somewhere near Soho, drunk, incapable, girl from abroad with little knowledge of London and genuinely lost. He took me all the way home on the tube where he understood from my drunken ramblings that my boyfriend was waiting for me and handed me over to him. Scottish guy from the navy, left me a passport photograph with his name on and a number "in case I had any questions" the next day. I think his name was Colin. Awesome guy.

GetMe · 23/10/2014 21:21

Thanks for the info, I wonder how much the money the gf father is willing to continue to pour into this nonsense. All these legal challenges must be costing a fortune. I hope it comes to end soon with the CCRC ruling.