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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

To ask all Scottish MNrs to work together 2

999 replies

siiiiiiiiigh · 21/09/2014 14:09

Sorry, filled the last thread with this, thought I'd better be part of Team Scottish MN and work together for those of us on the old thread...

Here's Armando's thoughts. I vote him in for everything.

www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2014/sep/21/scottish-referendum-massive-voter-turnout-means-politics-changed-for-ever

OP posts:
SirChenjin · 24/09/2014 15:16

I think when you have a party in party in power who go by the name of the Scottish Nationalist Party then it can hardly be a word we stop using. Are you suggesting they rename themselves?

There has never been any Nationalist party associated with No voters - British Nationalists? Confused

Numanoid · 24/09/2014 15:17

This will be in the same vein as Alex Salmond was painted. Many no voters I spoke to said they 'hated' him but when asked couldn't articulate why. At least now he can defend himself...

When you think about it, Salmond was the only one who kept his word to the letter. We have no idea when further devolved powers are coming, nor do we have a definite date on which we can expect them to come into place.
Salmond said he would step down after the referendum - people say it's a ploy to get votes - he steps down, people say he's doing it because he lost and is a sore loser. Confused

I didn't like him much before the referendum. I always respected him, but didn't like him. I have to say I've warmed to him now. I read about his life and career, and whether you agree with his methods or not, the man has always had Scotland's best interests at heart. Just as we voted Yes or No because we thought it was best for the country, I believe he did everything he could for the country, too.

DaughterDilemma · 24/09/2014 15:17

flippinada we all want peace and love and harmony but where there is injustice or even just perceived injustice it will fail to thrive. The thing to deal with is that injustice, not telling everyone to just move on and get over it - not that you are particularly saying that but it seems to be the stock response to any complaints.

I admit I am coming to this debate late in the day as I felt it wasn't much my business before. It is my business now because this is affecting the UK massively. Scotland leaving really didn't - argue that as you will but I think in time both would have survived alongside each other and moved forward to becoming different but successful nations. The Scottish people wouldn't have let it all go to the dogs I can't believe that. The way they have managed things via Holyrood so far has been a great success.

They don't need us, they don't need the Queen, they don't need our handouts. It's only 8M people - they have massive resources,natural and skills based - how hard can it be?

The only thing they have going against them is the weather but hey, the milk doesn't go off as quick when your fridge breaks down...

wigglybeezer · 24/09/2014 15:23

This explains a few things:

www.scotsman.com/.../scottish-independence...

Numanoid · 24/09/2014 15:25

I think when you have a party in party in power who go by the name of the Scottish Nationalist Party then it can hardly be a word we stop using. Are you suggesting they rename themselves?

No, I'm suggesting that people don't use Nationalist as an insult. It seems to be something which has been tagged on to every supporter of independence. Every Yes rally was broadly referred to as the Nationalists protesting. It has become a word with negative connotations, when really, it isn't a negative thing.

DaughterDilemma · 24/09/2014 15:30

I think Nationalist has indelible connotations, always will have and rightly so as it usually involves xenophobes. It is unfortunate that the SNP used it. Scottish Independence Party would probably have been better, but independence was probably a mere twinkle in Alex's eye when they named the SNP.

Numanoid · 24/09/2014 15:30

It's just frustrating that people (not on MN!) can't express their views in a constructive way. I had stickers up for the campaign I was supporting (as in the simple 'Yes' and 'No Thanks' style - no other slogans) and part of my property (not my house though) was seriously damaged (luckily covered by insurance) after the result was announced!
I don't want to have to hide my views for fear of having my things trashed, and I don't want that for anyone else.

Numanoid · 24/09/2014 15:33

I know, Daughter, but I find it odd when I read it being used that way, when the people I know who identify as Scottish Nationalists wouldn't lift a finger to anyone and are perhaps amongst the shyest people I know. Grin
I suppose you get bad eggs in every movement.

DaughterDilemma · 24/09/2014 15:39

Well most people just say SNP and don't think about what the letter stand for, the image that conjures up in my mind is a kind of socialist party, a group of people that don't like the mainstream parties and want more power for Scotland. I certainly don't think of them (and I don't think others do) as anything remotely like the BNP or the German one.

I think any aggression is just pure anger, not justified but a manifestation of the frustration people feel.

There was a great article in the Times yesterday by Robert Peston comparing it to a domestic divorce with a change of heart. Simple but effective analogy.

Numanoid · 24/09/2014 15:45

I think any aggression is just pure anger, not justified but a manifestation of the frustration people feel.

I was confused as they got the result they wanted yet they still did it. Hmm It has been reported, but people need to think before vandalising people's property... although I guess the problem is that they don't think about it!

I've heard the divorce analogy mentioned a few times, it does ring true.

Numanoid · 24/09/2014 15:46

We can be glad that so many people have turned up to events promoting unity between Yes and No supporters, it hopefully sends out a clear message to the violent minority that they do not represent the rest of us.

SDTGisAnEvilWolefGenius · 24/09/2014 15:51

DaughterDilemma - I am the only person who commented on what tabulahrasa said, before you posted saying, "...To those of you who want to nitpick at a genuine sentiment like this, shame on you..." - so I can only assume that was aimed at me.

When I said I should do the same as tabulah is doing, and that hers were wise words, I was being entirely genuine, so I am offended at you calling this nitpicking.

OOAOML · 24/09/2014 16:07

Can I just clarify that SNP stands for Scottish National Party not Nationalist.

DaughterDilemma · 24/09/2014 16:07

Apologies SGDT I read that completely wrong, thought you were sniping.

area52 · 24/09/2014 16:16

SNP = Scottish NATIONAL Party... NOT NationalIST btw...

flippinada · 24/09/2014 16:20

Numanoid I'm really sorry that happened to you. It's disgusting behaviour and there's no excuse for it.

Daughter fair play to you, that post was a bit mawkish, I even rolled my eyes a bit reading it back.

Have been watching the continuation of the parliamentary debate. I am singularly unimpressed - one MSP got up the regale the chamber with a vomit inducing tale about his neice waking up to ask the question "independence Mummy?"

Numanoid · 24/09/2014 16:23

It could have been a lot worse flippinada, I'll only have to pay out a few £s myself and the rest is covered. :)

flippinada · 24/09/2014 16:26

Ah, that's good news Smile . Still not nice having your home attacked though.

Behoove · 24/09/2014 16:27

16:13: 'Therapy session' Labour MSP Hugh Henry, who represents Renfrewshire South, says: "It feels as though I am sitting in a therapy session for a support group for people who are really suffering."
It is "only natural" for SNP members to feel disappointed, he says: "It will take some time for some of that to work through."

flippinada · 24/09/2014 16:32

I think even the most passionate supporter of independence would find some of these speeches a bit much, to be honest.

SDTGisAnEvilWolefGenius · 24/09/2014 16:36

Thank-you, Daughter.

grovel · 24/09/2014 16:36

My nephew had a Maths lesson today. The teacher is a Scot and they were allowed a 5 minute chat about the referendum. One boy said that Alec Salmond had had no answers about currency and Euro entry. The teacher corrected him:

"He had the answers but he didn't show his workings. Let that be a lesson to you all".

ItsAllGoingToBeFine · 24/09/2014 16:42

I realise that the parties were a little late with the first step, but I'm sure it was sorted the very next day.

It wasn't. It can't go before parliament until parliament is out of recess (mid Oct). Kind of squeezes the rest of the time table. (Happy to be corrected BTW)

Behoove · 24/09/2014 16:43

Love that grovel Grin

squoosh · 24/09/2014 16:47

David Greig who was a big Yes supporter has published a good piece today

I especially agree with this

'A country can lose an independence referendum once and still, just, consider itself a country. But lose an independence referendum twice? For the SNP to hold another referendum without a near certain guarantee of a positive outcome would be, to my mind, almost criminally irresponsible with the nation’s sovereignty.'