To be incredibly pissed off at male sperm donors..

[LexiVexiBear]

Who only offer their 'services' if it's through natural insemination (I.e having sex with the woman) or the woman performing a sex act on them!

I more than likely am but just need a rant! A dear friend of mine and her girlfriend have decided that they would like nothing more than to start a family but since they cannot afford IVF they have went down the route of sperm donation and artificial insemination. The thing is most of the 'donors' they have found that are in the same location (or close) and contacted more or less demand NI which really isn't an option for these two ladies!

I'm sorry I know people have preference and some women pick NI, nothing wrong with that as it can be more affective that artificial insemination but honestly in my opinion these men are completely sleazy and are preying on desperate women for sex! They claim to be offering their services because they want to help and make a difference yet they only want sex?!

Yes, there are numerous sperm donors but unless the women picks NI I don't think men like this should be allowed to take advantage of women or couples who are desperate for a baby!

Velvet that all makes sense and I can fully understand how it could be seen as the easier route, after all it's the end product that matters.
I don't think I could live with myself if I had harmed my DC by avoiding the medical intervention method.

I agree that what suits one won't suit all. We've used the same example but I suppose overall being impregnated by your DH is lower risk than a stranger but nobody can be 100% sure.

I wouldn't judge anyone who chose to avoid a clinic, it's none of my business how people conceive their DCs but I personally would rather pay for peace of mind.

I don't necessarily peachy, and objectively certainly you are right.

Less objectively, it is hard to explain but if most people who conceived a child through a ONS had checked if their partner had an STI first I suspect the rates would be lower. Not abolished completely but much lower.

Re clinics, all I can say again is that in a clinic environment you are given hair and eye colour, heigh, occupation and a few lines. Compare that to meeting somebody in the flesh - photos, including of their family as well - well. You can't really, can you :)

If someone starts a thread on sperm donation on here it is not long before the 'won't somebody think of the children / have you not got a gay friend to donate' (it is a truth universally acknowledged that ALL lesbians and single women have a mate who is gay and is happy to donate his sperm. What, you don't know a random gay man you could ask? Funny I don't either) brigade come along, and it isn't for me to say whether they are right or wrong.

But it is a bit nicer to say your dad is called Richard, lives near Edinburgh and there's a picture of him in the album in the spare room, than, well I don't know love but he's got brown hair. You can find out more at 18.

For some. What others do is their lookout. As with most things.

I can see your points about having a known donor Velvet, and of course it's up to the two biological parents in those cases to decide the method of conception. I do feel uncomfortable with men only offering their sperm through sex though. I don't mean that to sound patronising to the recipients or to suggest they can't make a decision to consent but the desire for a DC does put women in a vulnerable position and whilst I don't judge the women who decide to go down that route I do judge the men who would make this a condition of their acting as donor.

I don't think it sounds patronising, I agree with you, but I think the problem we run up against is that women - well, people generally, have the right to make what others might deem unwise or even eccentric decisions.

I did come to the realisation that desperation had made me foolish but that was a realisation I had to come to alone. I really would not have thanked anybody trying to steer me towards reason!

Velvet, thank you for explaining.

With a clinic the sperm is tested, who is say that these men only want sex but no able to produce any sperm.

For example DH has had the snip, he could meet women and have sex for the purpose of sperm donations when in fact he isn't even producing sperm

I think the implications have to be carefully considered.

In NI there is none of the screening that a HFEA clinic will do - STIs, medical history, risk of congenital conditions.

The 'donor' is legally the father. Irrespective if the recipient is married or civil partnered.

The donor's information is not held on the HFEA register for the child to access once they reach 18. Similarly the child cannot access the donor conceived sibling register... as there is no official record kept in private donation. Therefore the child may find it very difficult to access half siblings in the future if they wish to do so.

HFEA set a limit of donors donating to up to ten families if donating via a licensed clinic. This does not apply to donors donating via private arrangements. So you do not know just how many genetic half siblings your child may potentially have.

Can be a recipe for disaster imo and so needs to be considered very very carefully. Oh, and single women seeing a specialist fertility lawyer to draw up a pre-conception agreement with any potential known donor is highly recommended.

www.nataliegambleassociates.co.uk/

To be honest, NOBODY in this scenario sounds exactly lovely.

The men offering their services via intercourse sound unpleasant, however, your friends sounds a bit crap too.

Financially unstable yet wanting a child. Totally irresponsible for not doing it the proper way which could lead to all sorts of complications down the line.

Not to mention, of course, the deliberate act of omitting a father from their child's lives from the very start and not through separation or widowhood.

And, no, not homophobia because I think straight single women who do this are awful, too.

Scummy people all around-the donors and your dear friends.

Financially unstable for not having thousands of pounds in savings. If only that was a prerequisite for having a child!!!

What is the proper way pray tell as you say the act of omitting a father from a child's life, surely those who go to a clinic do this too?!

Actually, re-reading the opening post. None of this makes sense to me.

The opening poster is outraged about these men-but I don't believe any woman would actually PAY £500 to have sex with a man.

Moreover, what man is stupid enough to say, 'you can have sex with me for £500 to get pregnant' Surely it is simple enough for a woman to have sex with a man?

Sorry, but my b.s. radar is going off.

My friend got her sperm from the donor from a clinic. Not sure i put that in my post. She has brief details about the donor but this little boy is surrounded by love and a huge extended family including lots of aunts, uncles and cousins.

My friend also has her own house, a good flexible job and family back up. She was let down by men and reaching an age where it was now or ever for a baby. Why cant she have her beautiful little boy who will be loved and supported. He a lucky little boy.

Oh come off it, juneybean, if this couple can't afford 500 quid they should not be PLANNING to have a kid.

Naturally, I think it is wrong to Deliberately omit a child's father from its life from the outset as opposed to divorce/separation, but at least those that do should make sure the paperwork's all tidy at the very least.

Anyway, I've already said that I think the opening post is b.s.

Guys saying, 'you can sleep with me for 500 quid' What a load of cock.

I don't think its bullshit I've browsed these forums in the past but I certainly wouldn't pay it either.

But I stand by what I said plenty of planned children come into this world with less than £500 in the family purse.

Well, adults can choose who they have sex with, and whether they pay for it.

Using a clinic is preferable when the intent is to conceive because the semen is properly (repeat) tested for STIs. Also the donor cannot claim PR for any resulting child (yes, this has happened, when the friend decided he wanted to be in his DC's life).

Also it is safer for the donor, as he cannot be pursued for CM.

I don't deny that it happens juneybean just that it is irresponsible that is all.

But look at this logically:

A woman gay/straight/whatever wants to get pregnant and sexual intercourse ONLY option to do so and is told that she has the option of PAYING a guy to have sex with her OR sleep with a man for nothing.

To be honest, I think I would be SAFER with a random guy I met in the pub than a guy who wanted me to PAY him for it, anyway, the pub guy's less likely to be a creep!!

I mean, come on, these guys are really really chancing their luck and they surely don't think anybody is going to respond.

Well yes of course in that instance you'd sleep with a guy for free. None of the guys on this forum are altruistic and most are downright scummy. One guy had "helped" at least twenty women. The idea of these children unknowingly meeting in the future is grim to say the least.

One would hope if you went with a "sperm donor" who had blood tests to show you you'd feel more at ease. I know I'm CMV negative so sleeping with a random guy isn't an option (or in any way appealing actually )

Iui isnt expensive? My dsis payed a £1000 for it and that wasnt including the tests and injections before hand.

I've paid out approximately £3000 so far for two failed attempts. Sticks in the craw a wee bit.

Well that's it, isn't it juneybean.

Firstly, if sex was only option, it would be less worse NOT to pay for it than pay.

Secondly, at least a random guy in the pub/club is after a one-night stand and straight sex. Somebody who demands payment? Well god knows what they are like, but you DO know they are a creep from the start whereas the guy in the pub/club is probably just a normal guy wanting sex.

This is why I find the opening post to be b.s.

Adults can choose who they have sex with - quite.

If meeting half-siblings is a genuine concern, may I point out that the offspring of lesbian and single women are not really the main issue here. It's possible, I suppose, that men are distributing their sperm en masse up and down the country but I would be more concerned about the women who do 'go to the pub' as described.

Especially as this keeps it in a very local field as it were. Think about it - a man sleeping with more than one woman on a housing estate will mean there's a very good chance the children will meet in the future at school or in the pub.

But for some reason, that's okay and it's also okay if they're on benefits and it's still okay if the child is born into a less than ideal situation because any hint that contraception is used leads to:

Who are you to decide who has kids;
You are a Nazi
Should only the rich have children

But if you're a lesbian - fuck off.

I've seen it on here a thousand times and it's depressing, frankly. If you don't have the requisite gay mate willing to donate his sperm (and endless well meaning posts will brightly ask you this) you are either a dirty slag who should go down to the pub, or you are unfair and denying the child a chance to know his dad.

You just can't win!

Juditz it is possible it's bs.

It's also possible the money provides many of the things some of you have 'concerns' about - STI tests for one. Travel expenses. Contract between you both. Identity checks. I don't know, any more than anyone else, it's just speculation.

To be crude, artificial insemination is messy and doesn't have high rates of success. Hurrr turkey baster is often hee-hawed about but of course the reality is a syringe and without wishing to be crude, it is difficult to get it at the right angle yourself.

Really, it comes down to - there is sperm, use a penis, or use a syringe. In my case, I eventually opted for a penis. And it worked, in the early stage at least.

I will be the first to confess my desperation for a child got in the way of common sense, but it wish people would at least appreciate that that desperation at least meant the child was wanted which in all honesty, is a start. And that in 'knowing' the donor I was at least trying to do right by him which again, is another start.

Are there really not people on these boards who had children with men who are: violent, abusive, unpleasant, lazy, fickle, skint?

Do people really not accept that sex, as it is, is up to the individuals do decide. I repeat: people have the right to make decisions you might deem eccentric or bizarre.

Perhaps people feel they do not have the right When There Is A Child Involved, but short of sterilising lesbian women, I don't think that's fair at all - do you?

velvet, Your posts make total sense and I, for one, can see nothing wrong with a situation in which a single woman/lesbian is willing to try intercourse to TTC.

What I found objectonable in the OP was the idea that some men offer only NI, which surely reveals a huge ulterior motive?!

It's not even an ulterior motive. It's men saying 'you can have my sperm if I can have sex with you, and you pay me for it'.