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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

To think my niece should be allowed to wear makeup to school.

337 replies

PiperIsOrange · 16/09/2014 19:47

DN came home rather upset today after being told makeup is banned in school. She doesn't wear a lot just some foundation and clear lipgloss.

The reason she likes to wear it is because it covers all her spots, in the summer holiday she didn't wear any. My sister has taken her to the doctors and tried every OTC lotions and potions but nothing works.

It really boost her confidence and now she is dreading school because of these spots.

I have been to her school to collect school reports as dsis due to work commitments and have seen many teachers wearing makeup, so I assume it's a policy for pupils only.

OP posts:
capsium · 20/09/2014 08:04

Teenagers can express their 'unsophistication' in ways other than looks, though...

hazeyjane · 20/09/2014 08:10

Limited, we live in between a very large private boarding school and a very large state secondary, hordes of teenagers walk past our door every day - I can honestly say that the majority of them look perfectly normal (boys and girls, not outlandish or clownish just normal) and a lot of them have a natural sophistication, well groomed, well dressed, lovely hair, bare faced or made up, a kind of effortless good looks.

BathshebaDarkstone · 20/09/2014 08:18

Haven't experienced this yet as a mum. As a teen, my school banned make up but I hated it anyway and still don't use it. YABU. Confused

westcountrywoman · 20/09/2014 08:26

School is not a place for make-up and fashion trends so I'm afraid I agree with the school. Greasy foundation will make acne much worse anyway. Encourage her to go back to the GP to try a different treatment. It's a lot of trial and error with acne meds and different things will work for different people.

Using makeup to hide spots is just an excuse. Boys can't do this, so why should girls and the lip gloss can't possibly be because of the spots.

lordnoobson · 20/09/2014 08:27

OP

you need proper spot pill sfrom the DR = of course they work

hazeyjane · 20/09/2014 08:30

Jeez, have you two read the thread?!

Make up makes eff all difference to acne, wearing make up to cover up canes that can lead to bullying and low self esteem is not the same as a 'fashion parade'. Boys have been known to use cover up to conceal spots.

You may have not liked make up, but I wonder if you had skin that was so bad that you were called names and you could barely look in a mirror, whether you might have used a bit of concealer to help you feel better about yourself.

hazeyjane · 20/09/2014 08:31

I took every pill going as a teen, and beyond, they don't always work.

capsium · 20/09/2014 08:38

westcountry not all foundation is greasy. I use mineral foundation which is a loose powder. As I said upthread, my teenage spots did not get worse from wearing make up, they got better. Probably because the concealment of spots alleviated stress and I could forget about them. I wore concealer (applied with brush and dabbed to blend, as per Jackie Magazine's advise) set with translucent powder, as a teen. Learning this trick was life altering. A university friend was amazed I even had any spots, until I showed her how to conceal a nasty break out of her own. She felt so bad about the break out she had not wanted to go out.

I was not told off by school for make up. It does not have to be a fashion statement.

StarlightMcKenzie · 20/09/2014 09:03

What's TOWIE?

StarlightMcKenzie · 20/09/2014 09:05

Make up isn't greasy. It doesn't make acne worse.

I used to dig out my spots to create a wound and fill the hole with concealer making a skin coloured scab. It wasn't removable.

mathanxiety · 20/09/2014 09:26

I looked clownish and wore stupid clothes, because that's normal for a young girl.

It takes time to learn what suits you. What isn't normal is looking like a sophisticated woman from day one, it's also not what the joy of being a teenager is about.

I disagree with your notion of what is 'normal' for a young girl. What you described clownish and wearing stupid clothes is normal for a young clown.

Moreover, it was your individual experience. It was not and is not necessarily the experience of anyone else.

It does not necessarily take time to learn what suits you. It does not necessarily take years to learn that orange makeup isn't your bag. Some teens have a very well developed sense of what is going to suit them, perhaps because of some artistic or visual sense being heightened. Or perhaps they have red hair and have learned very well over the years what does and does not suit them, colour wise, when it comes to clothing or makeup. Or maybe it's just a matter of some people being blessed with an instinct in that area and some not. You can in fact look like a 'sophisticated' teenager or young woman from day one. A teenager who looks 'sophisticated' does not necessarily look like a woman of any kind. And if she does, how is that a problem?

Teenage girls do not have to look like clowns. You apparently did. I did not, and neither did (or do) any of my DDs. I cannot imagine any of them feeling any joy in going around looking like a clown either, and it seems to me they are successful in their efforts not to, and that they do not have to spend much time avoiding the clown look, as it is second nature to them to look un-clownlike. I would not feel any joy in that experience, nor would I have expected it as part of my teenage experience. You did, it seems. But please do not try to assert that your experience is what can be termed 'normal' or that there is any such thing as 'normal' for teenagers, and that what was good for one (you) should be perfectly fine for all others and any other way of doing things is suspect.

There really is such a thing as a sophisticated-looking and perfectly happy teenage girl who excels in a very good school and goes to a very good university and graduates with honours in a mathematics-oriented subject, secures a great job before graduation, moves into her own apartment, buys the same sort of nice clothes she always bought that suit her and are perfectly appropriate for her great job, and isn't tied up in knots wondering if she looks like a clown heading off to her first day of work but instead does her normal sophisticated makeup routine, tells her cat to behave himself while she's gone, and heads off to catch her train.

......
Your posts here speak for themselves.
I have not misunderstood anything you have written. I suggest you take another look at your posts.

This statement:
An interest in make up and fashion is normal and not incompatible with doing well at school.
flatly contradicts your own earlier statement in response to the comment Good quality makeup, properly applied, can look subtle enough to be natural. I don't see why school would have a problem with this.

You said : I'd assume that they were spending too much time on grooming and possibly being groomed by adults, and not enough time on homework and pets.
This comment is full of value judgements assigned to proper makeup use that are not warranted by reality but instead reflect and express your prejudice.

'I have no issues with teenage girls moving into adulthood.'
flatly contradicts your own statement:
'Good quality make up' on a child - because that's what 14, 15, 16 is, isn't it? - makes me shudder.
It seems you do in fact have an issue with teenagers moving into adulthood; teenagers are not children at 14, 15, 16. And you only have no issue with teenage girls moving into adulthood as long as they spend years looking like clowns while they do it ridiculous, imitative, incompetent daubers and thus perhaps not sexually attractive. You don't have to take people seriously in any respect if they look silly.

You can dismiss the thought that they are maturing in the sexual sense if they look like four year olds who have got their hands on mummy's makeup and seem to have no sense of how attractive they really look, no accurate appreciation of their features, no realistic idea of how to maximise their attractiveness.

And your statement that you have no issues with teenage girls moving into adulthood contradicts this earlier one too, (and it also contradicts the statement about the incompatibility of being interested in makeup etc,. and doing well in school):
If a teenager was so good at her make up and dress sense that she looked sophisticated beyond her years, then I would wonder at that. I wouldn't think badly of her, but I'd wonder who was teaching her, for what motives and to what detriment of her school career and values.
Again, you want teenage girls spending years in orange-faced-clown limbo. For some reason, 'sophistication' is something you can't accept in the same sentence as 'teenage girl'.
The equation of attention to appearance with detrimental effects on studies is repeated.

I looked like a clown at that age in my Miners, Rimmel and Boots 17, and to my mind that's how it should be when you are protected within your family at taking your first steps into the adult world.
Projection.

BOFster · 20/09/2014 10:19

Steady on, math Shock

I've seen you make some cracking informative and wise posts- using several paragraphs to try and take somebody down line-by-line is a bit beneath your talents, don't you think? It's only a conversation about make-up, for goodness sake.

SuburbanRhonda · 20/09/2014 10:31

Well, someone has to disabuse limited of the notion that teenager girls are either incompetent fools when it comes to applying makeup or are in training to be prostitutes.

And math's post is worth it just for this:

I disagree with your notion of what is 'normal' for a young girl. What you described clownish and wearing stupid clothes is normal for a young clown.

Grin
BOFster · 20/09/2014 10:33

Sledgehammers and nuts spring to mind though.

SuburbanRhonda · 20/09/2014 10:36

Maybe, but having a DD with the same issue as the OP's DN, I'm happy with a sledgehammer if it puts an end to limited's misinformed drivel.

Fairenuff · 20/09/2014 10:37

No-one had orange faces when I was at school. That 'look' hadn't been invented yet. None of the girls looked like clowns either.

hackmum · 20/09/2014 11:07

I don't know if anyone has made this point already (13 page thread - crikey!) but spots and acne are not the same thing. Acne is quite a severe skin condition that can only really be treated by medication.

Ordinary teenage spots are something else. Personally I don't think covering them up in makeup is a good idea: makeup clogs up the pores and the chemicals in makeup can seep into the skin. But I couldn't point you to any evidence that says that it makes spots worse.

When I was a teenager (in the dark ages) none of us would have even dreamt of wearing makeup to school.

capsium · 20/09/2014 11:27

hack you can get natural mineral make-ups with no harsh chemicals to 'sink into the skin'.

Most people use some kind of products on their skins, from cleansers to sun creams and moisturisers...make-up is no different really.

I wore make up to school in the 80s which is quite a while ago now....

soverylucky · 20/09/2014 11:30

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

BoyFromTheBigBadCity · 20/09/2014 13:07

My acne didn't come at school, but uni. at school I just had horrible spots. I think yanbu OP. To those poster's saying at 14 you're still a young girl, a child, must have different rules from the adults - that's not how school treats you. When I was 14 (only 9 years ago) I had to sit GCSE exams, had already aged 13 chosen path defining GCSE options, was taken on residential school trips where I was responsible for navigating a foreign city without any teacher aid. We were consistently told to behave in a grown up way by teachers, had to take on responsibilities greater than that of a child. I found this incredibly annoying about school - I had to be an adult in all the boring ways - taking total responsibility for my workload and organisation, never 'being silly or childish' in school with none of the fun or privileges, such as being allowed to cover my skin problems without being told off.

TheNewStatesman · 20/09/2014 14:31

I think no makeup for school is fine as a general rule, but if there is bad acne then I think it may be reasonable to make an exception for medical reasons. As others have said, scars and birthmarks would also merit an exception.

Can she get a doctor's note?

And yes, look into hormonal treatments such as the pill.

Branleuse · 20/09/2014 14:36

when i was at school, girls in year 9 and above were allowed to wear discreet makeup.

It didnt affect anybodys education as far as i could tell

YANBU

kali110 · 20/09/2014 17:36

By 15 id learnt to put my makeup on really well so i didn't look like a clown, i came out of school with gcses a*-c so didn't do me any harm.

Not all makeup is greasy. L'oreal true match and bare minerals are great. Wearing makeup does not make skin worse.

Im 30 and iv tried various skin tablets since i was a teenager and none have worked for me!

Only thing that worked was dianette, on it for a year and soon as i stopped taking it they came back.

Benzol peroxide cream or gel has made a great difference to my skin.
Never made my lips dry?

mathanxiety · 20/09/2014 22:16

Fair enough, BOF.

In my defence, I see girls in a no win situation and it bothers me. They are judged by everyone and sometimes it seems they can't win. I think women should cut teenage girls a lot more slack than we do. We should encourage anything that gives girls confidence and should not imo allow ideology to trump practicality when it comes to doing that. Above all we should not comment on their appearance or judge them according to appearance, and we should never shame girls or support making them learn or work in an environment where their appearance could be reasonable grounds for humiliating or embarrassing them. We are in danger of making it all about appearance when we make it all about appearance and I think that defeats our overall purpose.

And to echo what BoyFromTheBigBadCity said - we also in this culture encourage the philosophy of bodily integrity for girls and women, the idea that your body is your own and what goes on with your body is your own choice and your own business. It is completely in contradiction of widely accepted acknowledgement of bodily privacy for teenage girls for a school to assert that a teenage girl does not in fact have a choice about a fundamental aspect of her own body how to present the visible part of it to the rest of the world and must not only obey institutional rules that arose in an era when women's bodies were not their own to do with as they chose, but can be publicly told what to do with it by an authority figure, and have her choices overruled and negated.

......
Maybe it depends on where the BP is applied or the concentration of BP? If close to the lips, I have personally felt mine in need of moisturising. I don't think fashion-type lip balm really helps though.

limitedperiodonly · 20/09/2014 22:43

I have been a teenager who's worn bonkers outfits and make up and hair.

That's the whole point of being a teenager.

Anyone who says it's not is fucking mad.