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Indyref 12 - keeping the ball rolling

999 replies

flippinada · 15/09/2014 20:38

Hope everyone doesn't mind, I'm to keep the discussion going. As you were folks :)

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14
BakerStreetSaxRift · 16/09/2014 23:09

Latte Agreed.

AnnieHoo · 16/09/2014 23:09

I agree with latte (again! Wink) and EWF's BiL

AnnieHoo · 16/09/2014 23:11

I hope GB becomes President Brown of Scotland if it's a Yes.

Luckytwo · 16/09/2014 23:11

Justsaynonono - he's made it clear that is what he is going to negotiate. So vote no!

ShinyShinySpoons · 16/09/2014 23:12

I'm English living in England so don't have a vote but I keep reading how the iScotland will deliver a fairer society. Great if they can. But if those in the economic know, according to reports, are right how will this play out? If the taxation revenues are much less than what they are now how will iScotland deliver universal welfare benefits for all?

Surely after considering what they need to spend on education, health, housing and defence they will also come to the conclusion that they can't leave people on JSA/IS/ESA for years as much as they might want to.

An independent Scottish government will also bring in requirements for claimants to look for work and possibly even sanctions for not doing so. Every government that has to cut costs will review benefit expenditure. It's a fact of life. It will happen. No government can afford to pay universal benefits for life for everyone. If you think that won't happen you are deluded. Even the SNP have to balance the books.

StatisticallyChallenged · 16/09/2014 23:13

I think GB has spoken very well. I also don't think he is quite deserving of the level of blame he got for what was a global downturn. Although "no more boom and bust" was always going to be a little optimistic IME. But there was far more involved than he had control over.

Mind, I think Darling deserves the blame even less, even though he was the chancellor IYSWIM. Lots of the issues which caused the crash had been building for years.

trixymalixy · 16/09/2014 23:13

I trust Gordon Brown too. I don't think he was to blame for the global financial crisis somehow.

squoosh · 16/09/2014 23:14

Tomorrow's Daily Record front page.

Indyref 12 - keeping the ball rolling
TroelsNextCampaignManager · 16/09/2014 23:17

GB was not to blame for the global financial crisis but was really bloody stupid (as Chancellor) to sell off UK gold reserves near the bottom of the market. Finance 101 - buy low, sell high - not vice versa.

Prior to cock ups like that and Iraq, I had always thought he was intelligent and sincere and he seems to be coming across that way here.

livingzuid · 16/09/2014 23:17

latte I agree. I know someone who lives in his constituency and said it was a lost cause. I also hated him and Blair with a passion.

Then I had the chance to meet Sarah Brown and was blown away by how astute and clever she was, and charming. So I thought hmm maybe it's not all bad of a woman like you chooses to be with him (wasn't there a bit of a scandal around this as well). And I cheered him on for the bigot comment. I felt quite sorry for him about that, particularly as the woman in question was one.

I'm coming round to him and mature enough now to realise the whole crash was not one man's fault. I always thought him more sincere then Blair and more capable. And I have been impressed by his performance in this campaign. Enough to get me to consider joining the Labour party which I didn't think I would in my life!

Luckytwo · 16/09/2014 23:17

A good welfare state does not let people just stay on benefits forever.
There have to be ways to get people into work, working for no money or zero hours contracts aren't necessarily the way forward.

EarthWindFire · 16/09/2014 23:17

Front page Mirror

Indyref 12 - keeping the ball rolling
SquirrelledAway · 16/09/2014 23:19

The Torygraph is reporting Betfair already paying out for a No vote on Thursday.

livingzuid · 16/09/2014 23:20

I wouldn't trust Alex Salmond to run a bath. Grin and true!

squoosh · 16/09/2014 23:20

'Ed Bangers' made me laugh.

I'd love to write puntastic headlines for The Mirror.

StatisticallyChallenged · 16/09/2014 23:21

LuckyTwo I'd agree . I think something did go wrong with our benefit system. I don't think the Tory solutions are the right ones before anyone says I support bedroom tax. We've not got it right, but I don't think I've seen anything to convince me that we have any better plans here.

frankie80 · 16/09/2014 23:22

I've always liked Gordon Brown, it always makes me angry how he got criticised. Seeing him leaving downing street with his kids made me think "see everyone, he's a human being, not a monster". :(

I rate him highly as a politician, even before this referendum I felt he was a very no nonsense, this is how it is, speaker.

LatteLoverLovesLattes · 16/09/2014 23:23

AS - I don't know how anyone can be within 5ft of this odious little man and not slap him. Urgh, fuck muppet.

Fontella · 16/09/2014 23:23

Interesting reading all your comments on Gordon Brown.

When he was prime-minister in waiting so to speak, everyone spoke so highly of him. You'd rarely hear a bad word said about him, it was always what an excellent chancellor he was, what a skillful politician, steady, safe, honest and so on.

He became prime minister and suddenly he was the anti-Christ and everyone hated him.

I do wonder sometimes if good politicians are better off staying out of the top jobs/limelight altogether. He definitely does seem to have taken on a statesmanlike role in all this, a voice of reason almost .. and from what little I've seen (we aren't getting anything like the amount of coverage you are) it suits him.

As for Clegg - I don't think I've ever been as disappointed in a politician as I have Clegg. He was so impressive in those early televised election debates and I really though at last we had a young, charismatic, liberal politician who could really go places. He's turned out to be a complete and utter waste of space. So many things I've just though WTF? Is this that same person from those early debates? I don't know what he's thinking half the time. Never thought I'd say this but I'd have Cameron over Clegg any day of the week.

My own personal viewpoint of course - I know others will disagree entirely but as the discussion was drifting that way a little, I thought I'd add my own observations.

Smile
EarthWindFire · 16/09/2014 23:25

Night all.. Hope you all manage some sleep. Tomorrow is one day closer. Smile

Luckytwo · 16/09/2014 23:26

Aye mrs. Statistically I think we'd get on in real life. :)
Potentially it's too big a problem. But that like the NHS is UK wide isn't it .?

flippinada · 16/09/2014 23:27

Agree that GB is the one talking the most sense at the moment.

I should be asleep but this discussion is too interesting.

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flippinada · 16/09/2014 23:28

Night earthThanks

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TeamScotland · 16/09/2014 23:28

I don't rate Gordon Brown at all as a politician, so far. He's an unfortunate character. However, Tony and Cherie Blair shafted him, that's obvious. Maybe he learned something and can have a future in an independent Scotland.

I think Dave Cam sent him to the lions last week, on purpose.

On a non political note, he and his wife did something extremely kind to friends of ours with a very sick child, not long after they lost their own daughter. Can't say much more, but Sarah is truly lovely.

Luckytwo · 16/09/2014 23:29

Do you know fontella ? Apart from the Cameron any day bit we almost agree :)

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