to ask where indyref Part 5 is?

[grovel]

Well?

In defence of the view that sharing a landmass necessitates a single political system: "It's a pity that the people of Ireland felt the need to put a border across their island."

This cracked me up. Priceless.

Weatherall no one said it was a reason to stay in the UK.
It was mentioned as just one more thing that the SNP hasn't any plan to deal with. Building up security services, and getting other countries' services confidence to share information with you, will take many years.

ChelsyHandy you've missed the bit about the apparent irrelevance of our defence and security services... or maybe blue face paint and sharpened wooden poles will suffice in the Brave(Heart) New World.

IrnBru LOL @ £265k for a flat in Edinburgh! I don't know any family who can afford this. Am wondering what planet some folk are on on this thread

Are you having a joke? You seriously don't know anyone who lives in an average part of Edinburgh at all? 265k is what just about any couple in a decent job in Edinburgh are having to pay for a two bedroom flat. As a starting price. You must know a very limited sector of society. You seriously don't know any couples who are in reasonably well paid jobs at all? How can you possibly then presume to speak for their futures?

I am actually beginning to wonder if some of the posters on this thread have ever been to Scotland. Or maybe just to Edinburgh. Its like going back 100 or more years in time. Maybe they are basing it on Sunset Song, or similar.

Chelsy- since when did I write off half of Edinburgh? How much wine have you had tonight?

I live in a two bed flat in a vair nice part of E and it would currently sell for about 170k. (I check everything that comes up for sale)

Indeed Annie. I grew over-excited at the sheer quality of the argument.

WildThong re the 200 job losses at Technip. The Yes supporters never seem interested in real families suffering job losses. They spout automated responses about "working with families to help them" and "retraining for different careers" but in truth they CGAS and its all about sounding good to help their political careers.

From what I've heard, Technip are one of the few companies admitting to the job losses, along with Shell, others are quietly no longer recruiting, everyone knows the property market is stalling because of the Referendum but daren't talk about it in case it sends it into freefall.

Never under-estimate the fragility of an economy, especially one just beginning to recover from a world recession. Never under-estimate the importance of business confidence and certainty, created by a government which doesn't constantly change the goalposts every 5 minutes. Its such a bloody stupid and unnecessary thing to do, playing with ordinary people's lives like that.

weatherall I have told you before, I only drink a red substance, and it isn't wine.

I'm beginning to wonder if all these edinburgh financial services posters have ever been to the rest of Scotland?

Have you been to easterhouse, drumchapel, castlemilk, shettleston?

Have you been to Aberdeen and seen how full the horizon I'd with ships?

Have you been to Islands where banks come in vans?

Have you been to the depressed depressing ayrshire towns full of drugs and empty of hope?

Scotland has so much going for it we don't need to have such disparity of wealth in a small cohesive nation.

Re people losing their jobs and retraining- that's what I had to do after I lost my loosely financial job during the crash. But thankfully I had my retraining funded by the Scottish government. If I'd been in England I'd probably be on some zero hours McJob.

A job for life just isn't realistic in the 21st century, not in Scotland, not in the UK, it has nothing to do with the referendum.

several of us have already told you of our diverse and non wealthy backgrounds weatherall. Stop making out we don't know our country, or different social classes, or what poverty is.

What? Ships? In the sea? You're having me on surely?

No, you're right Weatherall. No-one else but you has ever been to Troon. Or East Kilbride. Or Fetlar. Or Paisley. Or Kilmarnock. Or Shettleston. Or Carmyle. Or Peterhead. Or Fraserburgh. Or Banff. Or Lochmaddy.

It takes an affa long time, and my horse is not as young as he did use to be.

My friend who earns a similar amount to LadyCordelia in the Edinburgh financial sector went to one of those schools in those towns, whose citizens you are so eager to write off weatherall. She lived in the sort of village where you got blown sideways onto a pile of industrial waste on the way home if you weren't mugged by the local druggies. She now owns a 3/4 million pound plus FLAT in the New Town.

Do tell her she hasn't a job for life though? Do people honestly think that? I think, realistically, many people hope to have a career for life, but surely moving employers every so often is the standard way of raising your salary. And moving between different towns and cities, or even countries, is hardly unusual? Its not really a question of a job for life. You seem to be living in the past.

Well, there isn't going to be any jobs at DH's level in an independent Scotland and quite frankly, he's really not up for retraining to be the face of the childcare initiative.

If I'd been in England I'd probably be on some zero hours McJob.

This is so offensive, it's not even funny.

Is there anything actually wrong with the bank and library coming round in a van? Many people still find it convenient. It was pretty standard in a lot of rural Scottish villages in the central belt until relatively recent times, not just the Western Isles. I'm sure it still happens in bits of Fife, for example. It doesn't mean the area is poor. Just that its rural, and the service is being provided to cover those people who can't get into a branch.

Where I grew up going to the bank meant a walk through muggers paradise, and the library came in a van here too.

"I think that what you think about an 80 k salary says a lot about you. It is an unfathomable amount for the majority of people in our country. And if you don't realise that I think you should be worried about how out of touch you are ."

Thank goodness there is someone who is in touch with reality on this thread.

"They didn't do very well at keeping glasgow airport safe when terrorists tried to bomb it did they?"

Valid point weatherall.

I'm quite amused at the worry over defence in Scotland, tbh. Who are we supposed to be shitting bricks about?

I'm getting rather tired of this line.

Do they really expect to convert people to a Yes vote?

I mean, criticise murderers, paedophiles, psychopaths (theres certainly a few of those...), or those on similar salaries and higher making a mess of running City of Edinburgh Council and other under-performing councils, but with hard working high female earners, you are onto a surefire loser.

Who do you want to pay the high taxes in an independent Scotland then?

I'm really getting the impression of late that some have not led very varied lives.

"Someone is buying them!"

You're right Chelsy, and it ain't locals!

Reality for us is over 80k. So what? Are we only supposed to aspire to a council house and no more?

I'm quite amused at the worry over defence in Scotland, tbh. Who are we supposed to be shitting bricks about?

Oh FFS.