To be shocked that charges have been dropped and Cameron is tweeting happiness about Ayasha case

[Albertatata]

Shocked generally at the way this has been reported. So distrustful of both the medics and police when at the end of the day the parents removed their ill child, took them to a different country without any medical handover, starting an international search and now David Cameron is tweeting that he is relieved charges aren't being brought!

It is undoubtfully a terrible terrible situation but there is a way to behave and this isn't it. Fine if you want to sell your house and access medical care in another country do it, but do it with the guidance and cooperation of the medical team looking after him. Don't bloody run off with him to another country & not tell anyone.

Prepared to be flamed but the fact of the matter is that we have only heard the families side of things and medical team are limited by confidentially.

When have I said that everyone following a religion will do so the same way? I have repeatedly pointed out that there did not seem to be any problem in these parents' case.

Bloody hell. Read what I write, not what you imagine I must have written, based on your own prejudices and knee-jerk reactions.

We can't really judge the medical evidence from here, but we can ask if the SGH followed proper procedure and ethics in their dealings with the parents.
The concerns about prejudice also need to be answered.

On the other thread, most of the professionals in child protection repeatedly expressed outrage at the SGH in particular, including anger at the manipulation over religion:

Spero Tue 02-Sep-14 23:44:19
"there seems to have been a rather spiteful and deliberate attempt to paint the worst possible picture at the earliest opportunity which has involved misleading the police, the CPS and the judiciary."

Spero Tue 02-Sep-14 22:56:18
"There is a doctor named in the order of the 29th who gave information to the court. I do hope his insurance is all in order. I hope these parents have a very good clinical negligence lawyer."

There is no way that religion would have been mentioned in this case if the family had been CofE. Their religion would not have been on our radar.

It should not be on our radar now.

Happy, It would be hypocritical of me not to acknowledge your expertise in the field, having castigated the medical profession for dismissing that of their patients.

Do people really believe that people working in hospitals don't care?I have worked with plenty of treatment radiographers who have cried over their patients

No, of course it's not the suggestion that the people administering treatment don't care. With all due respect, though, the radiographers are just doing what the doctors tell them to do, hopefully with a good outcome, but doctors sometimes get it wrong.

It is the unwillingness of some high-handed senior doctors to accept that everyone is entitled to a second opinion, (or a third, as my mother was once gratefully told) that I take issue with. That, and the defensiveness which often kicks in when a doctor's opinion is challenged. It all goes to create the kind of 'us and them' culture in many hospitals which benefits neither the patients nor the staff.

I'm sure if it would benefit this child he would have been put forward by his medical team.

How is it, then, that the specialist proton beam therapy centre in Prague seem to be prepared to treat Ashya? They have apparently now received his notes and have concluded that they may be able to help him.

You've thrown all kinds of nasty insinuations at me, MrsDeVere, set up all kinds of straw men, and you accuse me of being snarky?

Yeah, no. Talk to me again when you can keep your straw men and nasty insinuations to yourself. (I'm not holding out any hope.)

I cannot bear to read this thread. I am the parent of a child who died from a brain tumour. Those of you who have been in the lucky position of never having had a terminally ill child and are going on about what is right or wrong - just fuck off. You have no idea. No idea of how hard it is to watch your child become disabled with a brain tumour. To have their disabilities made worse by surgery. To have their bodies suffer the rages of chemotherapy and radiotherapy. You have no idea what the child has to suffer and how the parents suffer watching. If I thought there was a treatment out there that could have saved my child I would have done ANYTHING to get him that treatment. And I would not have given a flying fuck what anybody else thought. When your child is that ill you will try anything.

annie I'm sorry but I agree with MrsDV, you are being snarky because as has been pointed out several times, there religion has absolutely no relevance to this case.

They have not refused any treatment, simply asked for it to be delayed while they looked into the PBT. They have not refused any treatment based on their religion. Once it was established that none of their decision making was based on a religious concept (which would have taken what... 5 seconds to ascertain?), that should have been the end of it. It should have had no connection to the case in hand any more than the size of their feet or the colour of their hair.

Whoever leaked that information to the press (and lets face it, it could have been anyone who knew them either deliberately or accidentally letting it slip), did everyone a massive diservice by totally derailing the media coverage.

So sorry to hear about your son Min :(

Cases like this must be very hard for you xx

Extremely hard Bogey and people talking about it with no knowledge of either the medical side or as a parent to a sick child makes me want to scream and cry.

It's raw and horrid and devastating MrsD.

To all those who have healthy children. My child died. He went through all the treatment the Drs recommended. He followed a medical protocol that has, in the last two months, been scrapped as it proves to be too harsh on the children, makes them suffer too much and not enough children survive it. I will say it again - this was a treatment recommended by the Drs. Even they don't know, with all their knowledge, they just don't know.

MrsRuff, it would be my guess (and it can only be a guess as we don't know the full facts) that there is no reason to not treat him with protons (they're not a worse option) just that they're no better than x-rays so why would you treat him abroad when he can be treated near his home enabling his family to be together. Prague is unlikely to turn away the money. We will be treating patients with protons that could be treated with x-rays as these machines cost a lot of money and you don't want them to stand idle.

Madrigals, I find that very sad. The medical professionals I know would be happy to suggest alternatives if they are proven but are unlikely to suggest you try something that there is no evidence to show it helps and will cost you money. A lot of doctors work for the NHS and in private practice and therefore see nothing wrong with crossing over.

Mary's, the court order would be to ensure the child has some treatment rather than none which would definitely lead to his death. It happened with Neon who was in the news when his mother refused treatment for him.

Yes it was the Milan protocol . What it did to my son was horrendous. But so was the tumour and where it was sited. It was all so traumatic, the disease, the treatment, his death. His death. Most children do not survive an aggressive malignant tumour. Most people have no idea. Mercifully they have no idea.

So to the original OP - are you being unreasonable - yes you fucking were.

I'm so sorry minmooch.

minmooch. And the same to MrsDV and any other parent who has lost a child. My heart goes out to you all, I cannot begin to understand how painful it must be.

I know my language there is a bit clunky, in my defence a two second power cut set the alarm off waking me up at 4.30am and I'm so knackered I can hardly see.

The medical professionals I know would be happy to suggest alternatives if they are proven but are unlikely to suggest you try something that there is no evidence to show it helps and will cost you money

There's not always the luxury of time to hang around and wait for something to be proven though is there? We used something unproven with our son when he as 2. His paediatrician shook his head, laughed at us and said "well if you will insist on wasting your money". Roll on 11 years, and his neurologist suggested that we should consider trying that same treatment. Good job we didn't wait for it to be proven (think he would have been more damaged).

Oh do fuck off YABVU