to be shocked and scandalised that this went on unchecked for so long? [MN edit; contains details of current Rotherham news story, possibly triggering]

[ReputableBiscuit]

www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-south-yorkshire-28939089

Where I live there are many Asian girls who are "rebelling" against their culture and are being groomed and abused by groups of men in their community. They are then disowned by their families and end up at my workplace with their children needing to be housed and protected from their families. There are often pages on Facebook called slags of whatever area where photos of young girls are posted sometimes naked or in their underwear and guys (mainly Asian) will comment on what slags they are what sexual acts they have done often with the girls numbers. The pages get reported and taken down but a new one will often reappear. The girls are Asian, white, black, mixed race. These men will exploit any girl and I know there is sexual abuse within the community that is never disclosed to anyone outside of it. I work with women who escape it.

"minifingers some Christians think it is better to wait until you are married to have sex. I don't think it's a bad thing."

I think it's a bad thing in a society where people can't afford to set up home and get married young, and are surrounded by a highly sexualised culture. I think repressing your sexuality for years can be very harmful at an emotional level - look at paedophile priests, men who spend years discussing and studying sexual ethics and morality, then go and sexually abuse children. :-(

"I wouldn't be surprised if each one didn't employ a narrative to dehumanize these children that was particular to their class, race and religion. But in the end, it is men (?) raping children for power and sport."

^^ this

I also work with girls who have had children by older white men who groomed them from being young who are equally as vile.

When I was a teen I saw a lot of the things that happened in Rochdale happening in my town too. I could easily have fallen prey to a gang of older guys who had nice cars I saw it happen to girls I knew. I now work in a community where it still happens.

an Asian social worker, female, was adamant that these girls who engaged in sex with older men did so of their own volition and the men could not be blamed

They were children, they could not consent to sex, the law recognises this, the men were breaking the law.

Personally I would like to see the age of consent raised to 18, with allowances for say... 13, if both partners are very close in age so that a 16yo boy having sex with his 15yo girlfriend isn't prosecuted as a sex offender.

good point mini fingers. I think alot of christians marry young anyway.

ooh I think both girls and boys are put under so much pressure to have sex as though it is the be all and end all.

212
best wishes to you and dd

how much of this was justified by the idea that eg prostitution is a lifestyle choice?

When I was about 16/17 I had a boyfriend for about 2/3 months, he was asian and worked in his uncles kebab shop, he was about the same age as me. He was so lovely, I remember him very fondly.

I could have been described as a 'vulnerable teen' in that I didn't live with my parents or have a good relationship with them, they lived in a different city a long way away.

I used to hang out in the back of the kebab shop with him and we would drink beer together. His uncle and uncle's friends were always very nice and respectful to me, they used to give me free food and drinks (soft drinks) and chat to me but never really hang out with us. I never had sex with this boyfriend, I would have and wanted to, we just never had the opportunity, nowhere to do it. I don't believe his uncle would have ever accommodated that, although I think was happy to turn a blind eye. My relationship with this boy just fizzled out when we both moved away.

They were such lovely people but their profile and my profile at the time looks very similar to the abuse cases. The difference was, no abuse took place, there was no pressure to have sex and most definitely none from the uncle, no sexual attention from him at all, that would be a horrifying thought.

This whole Rochdale scandal is tarnishing my memories of this time and it shouldn't.

Why is this tainting it Kendodd your relationship sounds like a normal teenage relationship.

I grew up in Bradford and there was always a problem with Asian (mostly Pakistani or Bangladeshi, not Indian) men targeting young white girls, usually in the form of cruising in cars shouting sexual comments, mass 'brushing' (where a group surrounds you and 'accidentally' touch you up) or just overall cultural-based disrespect like spitting at you or calling you 'white whore'. The younger ones were worse than the older first-generation men.

This behaviour was made worse by the lack of action by the police, because the racism card was used at every opportunity. In the end, they just gave up and left the whole Pakistani-dominated area to police itself. It became a no-go for white people, especially women. Many wouldn't even drive through the area. This was in the 80s and 90s and nothing has changed.

Because we hung out in the Kebab shop, the older uncle giving me free food, the uncles friends all being around, no women from the family ever being around. A lot of the girls abused started off having relationships with boys a similar age and older men then became involved.

Why is this tainting it Kendoddconfused your relationship sounds like a normal teenage relationship.

Because it makes me wonder 'were they grooming me?' and they weren't they really weren't, they were all just lovely to me. I'm sure the abused girls were all treated very well at first as well though. That's way it all feels a bit tainted now, and it really shouldn't, it's sad.

3littlefrogs wrote on the first page of this thread -

"There is a culture and a belief system in these places - particularly among the young men, that young white girls are subhuman, trash, expendable.
This has been known for years by local people, but it has not been socially acceptable to say so without being accused of racism."

These young man come from families where their sisters are constantly told that the worst thing they can do is be like a white girl. If the boys in the same family grow up believing all white girls are trash it's no surprise. A colleague of mine went to see our MP about a case we were on the fringes of and was told she must be very careful not to be racist. It makes me angry that people in authority don't listen to the people who know what they are talking about.

this all makes for extremely distressing and disturbing reading

And if they were grooming you, there would have been sexual contact. Minor at first, then escalating.

Yes I know, there was sexual contact, not sex, only with the young boyfriend, and only very freely given and wanted. As I said they really wasn't anything sinister happening. I just can't stop myself looking back and wondering if I was just really naive. The uncle even drove us to London once, which was really nice of him, even that is looking bad against the backdrop of Rochdale.

And I was going to add if my teenage daughter had a similar relationship with a boy from a kebab shop with a older uncle in the background, again after the Rochdale scandal, I don't think I'd be comfortable with it. I can't work out if this would just be me being racist or sensible.

I like to think of myself as not at all racist... I'm sure at times I am though....perhaps as demonstrated above. And before anyone says it if we swapped the Kebab shop for a chippy, would I feel the same? I don't know? I don't think I would like an older uncle of any race taking my daughter somewhere.

I'm led again to the feeling that the propensity to use women and children as a free resource to be exploited for financial gain or sexual gratification is almost universal, just give men enough opportunity and the conditions where they can get away with it and they will take it

Surely by now there is ample evidence that the particular type of gang led sexual grooming of young vulnerable girls is overly represented by Muslim, mostly Pakistani men but there have also been cases involving Afghans, Iraki Kurds etc. If you just did an easy mathematical analysis of the number of cases, and the percentage of pakistani etc men in the population it would be apparent that they are more likely to carry out this crime than white indigenous, or non muslim ethnic minorities.
It is time we dropped our squeamishness about appearing racist (a very British fear) and asked why this is, and put some onus on those populations to acknowledge and address their own problems with anti white racism and vicious misogyny. And stop lambasting politicians such as Jack Straw who dare to put their head above the parapet on this issue.

Surely by now there is ample evidence that the particular type of gang led sexual grooming of young vulnerable girls is overly represented by Muslim, mostly Pakistani men but there have also been cases involving Afghans, Iraki Kurds etc. If you just did an easy mathematical analysis of the number of cases, and the percentage of pakistani etc men in the population it would be apparent that they are more likely to carry out this crime than white indigenous, or non muslim ethnic minorities.
It is time we dropped our squeamishness about appearing racist (a very British fear) and asked why this is, and put some onus on those populations to acknowledge and address their own problems with anti white racism and vicious misogyny. And stop lambasting politicians such as Jack Straw who dare to put their head above the parapet on this issue.

Kendodd - I understand why you feel this way and why you might wonder if you were being naive. It's not weird at all given the issue being discussed.

www.rotherhamadvertiser.co.uk/news/96521/ex-mayor-barry-dodson-faces-child-sex-abuse-charge.aspx#.U_2-KqxQRRI.twitter the race thing is only part of it