to be shocked and scandalised that this went on unchecked for so long? [MN edit; contains details of current Rotherham news story, possibly triggering]

[ReputableBiscuit]

www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-south-yorkshire-28939089

I have read part of the report and I'm very pleased that awful police attitudes towards the victims have been flagged up as being one of the primary reasons the abuse went unchecked for so long. The report is absolutely shocking - the utter uselessness of the statutory agencies, children's services, the police, CAMHS (who removed the names of abuse victims from their lists if they failed to turn up to their first counselling session :-( ) . Only schools, the Educational Welfare Agency and a youth project - (Risky Business which worked with many of the victims) come out of the whole thing with their reputation intact.

Have name changed for this.

Two weeks ago my 14 year old dd revealed that she had been having a sexual relationship with a 28 year old she'd met through her school organised work experience. We contacted the police pretty quickly and they have taken it extremely seriously. We were referred to the child sexual exploitation team and children's services within 24 hours, and had two female officers visit who couldn't have been less victim blaming - they fell over themselves to show sensitivity to my dd. DD also had great support from the specialist nurse at the GUM clinic I took her to as soon as I knew what had happened. This nurse separately contacted the police and children's services so there were two referrals - one from us directly and one from the clinic. The man in question has fled the country but the police have reassured us that they will follow this up and his employers have been notified (he works with vulnerable adults so I would have been very worried if social services and the police hadn't seen fit to do this).

DD has been referred for specialist counselling.

I'm now wondering if the care and attention we've had has anything to do with the flagging up of appalling police mismanagement of CSE in Rotherham....

212 best wishes for you and your dd. bloody awful.

I'm with Somethingpink.

Coming from near the area, if you have listened to local radio or read local forums you know what is going on and how long it has been going on - you won't see that much of it in the local paper, and any comments made about it online are taken off almost immediately. A lot has been hushed up. I have even heard interviews on the radio with young women that have been previously groomed and are now trying to help younger girls out of the situation. This should not be down to them to sort out but nobody else was doing anything. Even listening to interviews with people of authority it's all bullshit what they are spouting and a lot of sweeping under the carpet. Where was the national media picking up on it? They would have been straight there if it was a celebrity.

I think anyone who is trying to disentangle the cultural/religious aspect of this from the actual abuse is being very naieve. It's entirely due to the culture that Islam seems to perpetuate -that women (especially non Muslims) are second class citizens. Frankly I don't see why we should respect or tolerate any culture which subjugates its women like Islam. And yes, white males are capable of abuse too. But for all its flaws, Western culture is a damn sight more accepting of independent women than any Islamic culture I have come across.

Justagirl that's depressing. Surely there could be more prosecutions now if there are so many victims.

I'm amazed that women are colluding in the race smokescreen. No woman or child can make an allegation of rape in the certainty that they will be treated respectfully and that their complaint will be investigated properly.

Lots of people think this is ok - women are prone to be liars. And there's actual women who are going along with this whole "oh, it'd have been dealt with if the accused hadn't been only Asian origin" crap.

It wouldn't have ever been dealt with because of the toxic attitudes towards female people.

Very - there's a shocking amount of sexual exploitation going on the UK and most of the perpetrators and victims are white.

Ironically it's not the sexism of Islam which has resulted in this awfulness exploitation going unchecked for more than a decade - it's the sexism of mostly white English born police officers, who have refused to see abused children as victims and therefore not treated their exploitation as a crime.

And attitudes to towards young people who aren't from nice middle class homes as well.

I wish I shared your confidence that any female person from any background would be treated better.

So recently we have seen a rich white paedophile ring and an Asian paedophile ring and I wouldn't be surprised now if there is every other variation of paedophile ring. I wouldn't be surprised if each one didn't employ a narrative to dehumanize these children that was particular to their class, race and religion. But in the end, it is men (?) raping children for power and sport.

What fucks me off is that when people have tried to speak out about the rape of children on an industrial scale they have been silenced with accusations of hysteria. They have been met with this mocking tone and accusations that they believe there is a paedophile on every corner . Actually, I am most cross that I fell for this pervasive and discrediting stonewalling tactic.

I agree, it's culturally 'excused' misogyny on the part of at least two cultures that has resulted in a decade of children being abused.

These girls were seen as 'trash' by everyone, and that's a very hard truth to stomach.

My niece and her family are from the region. Her eldest dd is in her late 20s and they have always been aware of the threat imposed by some groups of Asian men. I will use the term in a descriptive not racist sense. There were/are no groups of white men engaged in such intimidation.
The poster who was sure that the accused group would also target young Asian girls is at best naieve. They would never defile a member of their own community for fear of reprisals.
In some Muslim countries where British people go on holiday the behaviour of white teenagers can send the wrong message to locals who do not understand the accepted levels of freedom our girls have. (Turkey and Morocco and Tunisia).
However, these Rochdale men are supposedly British and choose to treat British social mores with contempt. They are a disgrace to their religion and to their (usually Pakistani) background.

What Apolcalypse said.

I'm not surprised. When I was at university in Leeds I was shocked by how thriving the red light districts in both Bradford and Leeds was (although I did have a very sheltered life in Devon before moving there). What shocked me even more was how young some of the girls look (14/15ish) and how it was Asian men in nice cars who would loiter around and 'watch' them, or arrange the deal. The police must have been aware of this.... I was aware of it just from getting lost a few too many times! A friend was originally from Rochdale and she said that this kind of thing was well known, 'Asians' ran the red light area and would loiter outside schools. Regarding Ayatollah Khomeini, I believe those are his words but very few Iranians would marry a child. No more than the amount of white British people who would marry a child. My ExDH is Iranian and although he may be a lot of things he is not a child abuse apologist. But there is a problem with how non-Muslim women are viewed by some Muslim cultures. I agree that this is not only a cultural issue but also a class issue too. Obviously misogynistic too.

peaceful - I agree (was a bit sleepy when I wrote that) porn also has a large part to play in different parts of the world's attitude to 'western' women. And I guess now with the internet and more accessible porn it does play a greater part BUT watching Miley Cyrus twerk and running around naked on main stream television - so normal- in a culture with little other access to the western world probably has a greater effect. Or even films/ television programs that feature 'casual' premarital sex.
Up thread things were said about Islam and child brides ...and the old ways dying out... 'the old ways' is a valid point in some parts and cultures of the world there is still a different attitude to what we consider underage sex (and to women).
I agree it is due to education and poverty/life expectancy. If you live in poverty with a high child mortality (as my DP's grandmother), coupled with a high chance of death during childbirth, it is in a society's interest to encourage women to produce as many children as possible from as soon as they can. Also attitudes to premarital sex. The longer you leave it before marriage the less likely you are to remain a virgin or worse have an illegitimate child with no husband/man who can work to support it...
Purely using Islam because it had already been mentioned.
The same is true for all areas of the world that are not as 'developed' with a poor life expectancy, whatever the religion. Very much doubt that primitive tribes in the Amazon rainforest have a calendar driven age of consent - or a particularly liberal view towards women's rights.
(I am not religious - I believe that lots of religious 'laws' came about purely to ensure the survival of the fittest and continuance of the human race. So in order for mankind to survive, we need to breed, encourage breeding and ensure that a certain percentage of the offspring survive to reproductive age. An illegitimate child may not be supported, survive to reproduce. As we have become better at adapting our environment, coupled with modern medicines etc this is less important - we have the opposite problem - so we now need to control population growth. There are lots of illustrations of this. (Even small things like eating pork (Jews & Muslims)- pork goes off quickly - reason we have bacon and ham to preserve it - a problem especially in hot climates. Also prone to parasites that can effect humans as an omnivore.) It does make me wonder sometimes if there was a greater intellect involved. And feel that the problem with a lot of religions is they are just out of date.

"The poster who was sure that the accused group would also target young Asian girls is at best naieve. They would never defile a member of their own community for fear of reprisals."

Read the report.

Asian girls were also targeted and abused by these men.

"Also attitudes to premarital sex. The longer you leave it before marriage the less likely you are to remain a virgin or worse have an illegitimate child with no husband/man who can work to support it..."

These attitudes are also prevalent among traveller groups and among fundamentalist Christian groups.

Littlems- that narrative comment is spot in. Well put.

minifingers some Christians think it is better to wait until you are married to have sex. I don't think it's a bad thing.

I think the fear of being accused of racism does stranglehold these investigations but all the other thing mentioned are relevant,

I believe Mary was a teenager as was Juliet but then people had to marry young as they died alot younger.

A few years ago I attended a training event about honour killings, the majority of the attendees were social workers. A discussion ensued about children and sex, an Asian social worker, female, was adamant that these girls who engaged in sex with older men did so of their own volition and the men could not be blamed. I was vocally opposed to her views but was shocked at not receiving any support from the other attendees. My assumption was that most of them were on agreement. These were social workers! What chance do these kids have when the people paid to protect them also judge them so poorly. I think this is a class issue more than anything. I'm sure this is not representative off all social workers but I'm still all these years later astounded at the views of these so called professionals.

Are there going to be any marches or anything in support of these children and the many others abused in care?