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AIBU?

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To hope that I can ask about FF without being shot down in flames?

999 replies

Darksideofthemoon88 · 23/08/2014 12:58

I'm interested in WHY people choose to FF if not for medical reasons (ie they can't because of medication they have to take, or because their baby was very premature and is unable to suckle) - I've seen a lot of threads where people assert that FF was best for them/their family/their baby or that they chose to FF without trying BF, and I'm curious as to why. Genuinely curious I'm not interested in fighting with anyone about what's best or right; I'd just like to read about why people FF because I honestly don't know. In the interests of full disclosure though (I know how MNs feel about this! Grin ), I am a breastfeeding mother.

OP posts:
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Fairylea · 25/08/2014 11:33

Baffled as to why the thread has been reported. .... Confused

Mrsjayy · 25/08/2014 11:34

But mini all you are saying is the obvious and then slating mothers for not breastfeeding you are not saying anything different or seeing anybody as a intelligent person who ff their baby yes breastmilk has health benefits nobody really disputed that

TheRealAmandaClarke · 25/08/2014 11:39

People dispute the health benefits of breast milk all the time. This thread is full of comments about how it makes no significant difference.
There is a pervasive belief that there is no real difference between bf and ff.

combust22 · 25/08/2014 11:43

"As long as a baby is fed it doesn't matter what they are fed"

How I hate that comment being trotted out.
It matters a great deal what I feed my children.

SeagullsAndSand · 25/08/2014 11:48

Nobody has disputed bfing has benefits(although imvho a lot of "research" is still all these years on weak on being cast iron proof) however the "benefits" to many(myself included) just aren't big enough to merit months of misery,dangerously underweight babies and their individual circumstances.

Sorry being ffed didn't matter to my dc and nobody can say it did.If I lived in Africa it would have done.The advantages my dc have outweigh hugely any tiny advantage they "might" have had through breastfeeding so it clearly didn't have any significant difference as regards my dc and I suspect the vast maj of kids on this thread.

YetAnotherHelenMumsnet · 25/08/2014 11:51

I would love Yetti, thanks. Or should I ask to be promoted to HelenMumsnet, do you think?

dreamingbohemian · 25/08/2014 11:51

Actually if we're going to project into the future, I think what future generations will be baffled by, when they look at our parenting era, is how much we obsessed over the tiniest choices and believed they would have a huge impact on how our children would turn out.

People do baby led weaning to make sure their children are fantastic eaters later on, they limit screen time so their kids will go to Oxbridge, they don't do sleep training because it will cause emotional problems, etc etc etc etc

even mini just said BF benefits are unmeasurable at the individual level and yet how many women put themselves through agony and misery trying to BF because they have to do what's best for their child

It doesn't escape me that many of these choices are in the first year of life, when women are still the primary carers

So basically, women have to shoulder this huge responsibility and guilt, if you do one 'bad' choice to make your life easier or more manageable, you are not doing your best

But I think future research will show genetics and overall environment are the most important factors. And people will unearth these threads of ours and laugh at us.

SeagullsAndSand · 25/08/2014 11:51

Well Combust I hope every meal,snack and drink during their entire 18 years meets the standard re the shed loads of research which indicate what "might" or "might" not be deemed as healthy or the optimum best.I hope you always set the best standards as regards what you eat.

Personally I think an overall balance is best and bfing is just part of that balance.

catgirl1976 · 25/08/2014 11:53

It matters to you combust22. And rightly so.

But it matters not a jot to anyone else. And it really shouldn't matter to you how anyone else feeds their babies.

combust22 · 25/08/2014 11:54

"months of misery,dangerously underweight babies"

But breastfeeding needn't be like that.

Mrsjayy · 25/08/2014 11:54

Yetimumsnet is what you should go for Grin

combust22 · 25/08/2014 11:56

" And it really shouldn't matter to you how anyone else feeds their babies."

Well it does matter to me, the widespread use of formula milk makes breastfeeding difficult.

Mrsjayy · 25/08/2014 11:56

But it is for some combust maybe we should acknowledge breast feeding is not as easy as its cracked up to be and a mother is perfectly justified in her decision to stop or not do it

catgirl1976 · 25/08/2014 11:57

Does it?

I never found that to be the case.

MoominKoalaAndMiniMoom · 25/08/2014 11:59

combust It matters to you what you feed your baby. It doesn't matter to us. And it shouldn't matter to you what we feed our babies unless you're a busybody.

'But breastfeeding needn't be like that'

But for many, it is.

SeagullsAndSand · 25/08/2014 11:59

It needn't but it was and may well still have been regardless of how many Laleche support workers I'd have had airlifted in.To be frank 2 days of dreading every feed,resenting my babies and hating being a mum was 2 days too much let alone weeks or months.

It was my call to make,to weigh up the info and make a decision accordingly which I did.They were the right decisions x3 with bells on!

Mrsjayy · 25/08/2014 11:59

Why does it make it difficult combust do you think mothers give up too easy do you think they are shallow and selfish for choosing formula milk do you think mothers should be ashamed for not breastfeeding,

MoominKoalaAndMiniMoom · 25/08/2014 12:00

combust How does widespread formula use make breastfeeding difficult? Most ridiculous statement of the day award goes to you...

'Oh my! Someone feeding their baby aptamil! I can no longer lactate! Alas!' Hmm

tobysmum77 · 25/08/2014 12:00

of course it matters what a child eats. Of course breastfeeding when it works well is the best thing.

I think though mini you and many others are so obsessed you fail to see the whole picture. It is one factor in a whole range of others and is why 'research' and anecdotal evidence will continue to show surprisingly low differences. If I fed my children unhealthily for 6 months then became an organic whizz then 10 years later what would the effects be? Nothing I suspect.

Formula milk isn't even unhealthy, it gives babies the nutrition that they need to grow and thrive. Therefore in the grand scheme of things it isnt a big deal. Breastmilk is best, yes quantifiably impossible to say how much but so is mum (and dad) being a healthy weight, having nothing go wrong that can't be controlled, parents not smoking, children getting plenty of exercise, children eating well, children doing stimulating activities, using the correct car seat, not living in a damp home etc etc.

We don't have thread about how people are irresponsible to be overweight if they have children for example? Why the obsession with breastfeeding?

Aeroflotgirl · 25/08/2014 12:00

Combust have you read the thread, for a lot of women it is for whatever reason, traumatic birth, PND, mastitis, insufficient milk transfer, milk just not coming in the list goes on. So obviously the baby us not recueving the right nutrients and is being undernourished, so has to be fed! Like other parts of tge body, breasts don't always work as they are designed to, baby still has to be fed.

catgirl1976 · 25/08/2014 12:02

Mastitis makes breast feeding difficult.

Returning to work when your baby is very young can make breast feeding difficult.

Exhaustion can make breast feeding difficult.

Tongue tie can make breast feeding difficult.

Inverted nipples can make breast feeding difficult.

Poor milk supply can make breast feeding difficult.

PND can make breast feeding difficult

The use of formula by other people has no effect on the difficulty or otherwise of breast feeding.

MoominKoalaAndMiniMoom · 25/08/2014 12:02

Aeroflot makes a very good point about breasts not always working as they're designed to. It seems like we're expected as women to have breasts that work, when other parts of the body often don't. Various parts of my body don't work as intended, fine. My breasts don't work? Suddenly I'm a 'lesser' mother.

tobysmum77 · 25/08/2014 12:03

and combust I suspect you haven't had your 10 day old baby admitted to hospital, stripped, tested for lots of things, had a cannula put into their arm while they scream Sad

There are risks of breastfeeding also.

Fairylea · 25/08/2014 12:05

The only way the ease of availability for formula makes a jot of difference to breastfeeding is that women don't struggle on miserably for longer than they need to if they decide to formula feed. Surely that's a good thing?

If people want to continue to breastfeed there are tons of organisations, breastfeeding support groups and helplines . I think it's seriously undermining the intelligence of women to suggest that because a tub of formula can be purchased from tesco etc they would readily give up breastfeeding if it's important to them.

tiktok · 25/08/2014 12:06

I've come a bit late to this, and I have not read the whole thread.

It's notable that posts which state the uncontroversially obvious - that how you feed your baby has an impact on you and your baby, and that there are different outcomes for bf and ff babies - are described as coming over as judgmental and militant. The impact is minimised by some of these posters, with the usual non-scientific and puzzlingly naive observation that you can't tell by looking at a bunch of five-year-olds/a bunch of adults which were bf/ff (of course you can't! You can't tell a lot of things by looking at people - sheesh) and therefore it doesn't matter....as if the only thing that would matter would be ff making people cross-eyed, or green-skinned, or something else solely visible to a casual glance.

Bf has a positive impact on health - generally speaking, when breastfeeding is going well, both mothers and babies gain by it, physiologically and nutritionally. In individual cases, these benefits are either absent (because bf is not going well) or are off-set by other (to her, equally valid) aspects of the mother's or the baby's well-being. But in any case, if someone simply does not want to bf at all, then of course she is an autonomous adult and able to make that choice - it would be as absurd to say every woman must breastfeed if she is capable of it, as to say every woman must conceive and give birth if she is capable of it.

Equally, though, as an autonomous adult, it would be nice (though not legally enforceable!) if she could own her decision/choice not to bf without denigrating discussion points or ignoring factual info, or assuming breastfeeding info and support and research is designed to judge her as a mother.

Basically, breastfeeding is (potentially) a lovely thing to do for your baby which, mostly, mothers and babies enjoy....when it's going well. The majority of women want to try this potentially lovely thing, and should be supported in doing so, wherever they want to do it and for the length of time they want to do it. Those who wanted to do it, and found it all went wrong, and feel very sad about it, should not be told they are making a fuss about nothing because it makes no difference (you wouldn't say that to someone struggling with fertility issues, would you?). It makes a difference to her because it felt important to her and part of how she saw herself as a mother.

All women who ff, including the ones who don't feel sad, or who did not want to bf anyway, or who ff from the start or near the start, and are fine about it, of course are entitled to as much support and info as they need to do it rewardingly, safely, and confidently. What I think is asking too much is that all discussion (about culture, nutrition, illness, marketing and whatever else connects with the topic of infant feeding ) ceases because it is judgmental to those who don't bf. There are some unpleasantly aggressive and defensive posts on this thread, for no good reason as far as I can tell.

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