to think parents should make room for adults by getting their kids to sit on their laps.

[Bouttimeforwine]

I have always done this, in waiting rooms, on buses, anywhere really. Even till they were too big really to be sitting on laps. Even now I will get them to sit on the floor at friends houses so that adults get the chairs. It's polite and the way I was brought up.

I often see children taking up a space, when it would be easy just to pop them on your knee for a short period of time. I know for a fact that some of these parents have no physical reason not to do this. They just think that their child has as much right as an adult to have that seat. True but it's not good manners is it?

AIBU?

If kids came home from a school trip battered and bruised because teachers didn't sit the kids down on the coach or figured on a bus they would have to stand anyway so why bother, it would be a different story.

If it's a choice between a four ur old being smashes in the face with bags or tripped over and an adult getting bumped a bit instead it's a no brainer surely??

Why is it disgusting for a pair of young children not to give their seat up to an able bodied 25 year old?

I just don't understand it at all.

I honestly had no idea that people were looking at children on public transport and thinking this way.

I don't take my kids on public transport very often due to aforesaid anxiety. Last time we went I had the 4yo in a seat and the 7yo standing with me. A woman asked if I wanted her seat for the 7yo and I declined it. But actually I should have got the 4yo to stand up so that someone else could sit? I had no idea this was an actual thing, that people expected families to stand in this way. And that our actions on that day were disgusting and showed us up as stupid.

What on earth?

It used to be generally accepted good manners, that's why. Somewhere along the line a lot of people have missed the memo.

Change it to "to make room for people" and it would be an unreasonable request.

On buses, if people are still getting on, I'm happy to sit DS on my knee to make room for anybody.

If you don't want to do this, sit near the back - elderly people often will not go too far back as they don't like to walk too far. Take it as a given to never sit near the front of the bus, they're there for elderly/infirm not for us youngsters.

So sarah

In your eyes, the 6 year old who is seated should get up for the 20 year old who has just got on the bus?

And to let the 6 year old stay seated is teaching them that the world owes them something?

Endangering small children for healthy adults is manners?

Got it

Why though? Why is it good manners for an under ten to give up their seat for someone in their 20's when it's not expected the other way around?

It is a given that vulnerabilities are catered for.

So all things being equal, why is the child less important than the teen / early twenties etc?

edam so it actually is good manners for families to stand to let others sit down?

I honestly had no idea.

Even if it's not endangering them.

In a scenario where all is equal, why does the under 16 (child) deserve a seat less than the over 18 (adult)?

Most fit healthy people wouldn't accept a seat from a 4yo would they? I mean, really? Is this thread serious? I am getting a bit freaked out.

Children come second to adults. Got it. That's why so little funding goes to paediatric cancers so many of them afflicted never make it to adulthood. Why so many are sold as slaves or killed in wars adults start.

I see.

I will sit my child down when possible. I don't care to lose another one if possible. If an adult has a problem with it, fuck 'em.

I make room for others to sit down by putting one of my children on my knee (or one on each of our knees if my husband is there too) Why? Just because I can and it's a nice thing to do.

I don't think that an adult is more entitled to a seat than a child but the fact is that they are smaller and therefore it is possible for them to share a seat with their parent and make room for someone else to sit down too. If I'm on my own and only one of them can sit on my knee, I wouldn't make the other one stand.

I bloody wouldn't.

And the mum chucking her four year old off the seat for me will get this look from me for caring more what I think of her kids "manners" than the safety of her own young child!

This is like the reclining seats on aeroplanes thread, a parallel universe most had no idea, nor cared, existed.

I value a child's life more than my own. ALWAYS. If I saw a child getting up so I could sit, I'd decline. If the bus goes flying, I want it to be my 43-year-old arse that goes out the windscreen, not some kid who never got a chance to do what I got to do, leaving some family feeling the way I do.

If I was on a train with DH and the kids and some people got on and I said "right everybody up we need to let this group of 20 something blokes sit down" he'd think I was utterly mad. That would be utterly mad wouldn't it? Surely?

I am starting to doubt myself now.

It's good manners because children have not paid full fare (or in some cases anything at all) for their fare. Adults have paid for their tickets. Plus children have bags more energy than adults. Especially at the end of a working day.

Sheesh, can't believe I'm having to explain this, 20 years ago no-one would have questioned it.

NB I did say earlier, there's a gap between the age when if there aren't enough seats a small child sits on the parent's lap and the age where it's safe for them to stand up on a moving bus or train. In that case, when there aren't enough seats, it would be nice of the parent to stand but not essential. Allowing small children who could sit on your lap to take up a seat when grown ups are standing is extremely bad manners and extremely selfish.

But I have. I've paid full fare and 2/3 child fare and cram both girls in one seat while I stand.

Should they give up the seat and endanger themselves??

Fair enough then Giles.

Edam, what are the applicable ages in your scenario?

Since child technically means under 16 and adult means 18+, does the 15 year defer to the 19 year old?

People over 60 who are perfectly healthy haven't paid full fare, either, nor have some disabled people.

And many in need adults will in fact not have paid for their tickets but still come first for a seat

In my experience, more often than not, the person giving up their seat finds a space at the back or on the top deck.

It's definitely a bus user's coming of age when you're old enough to give up your seat for an old lady on the bus!

I've been very surprised at the number of elderly people standing at the front of the bus until a slightly less old person gives up their seat for them - I'm always catching the bus with the 9.30 bus pass brigade!

Is it though. I'm not sure it is. People have said it is disgusting for a child to have a seat on public transport if adults are standing.

I really hate putting people out I never asked for a seat when I was pg but I thought it was OK for the girls to share a seat while I stood or like the other day DD4 sat while I stood with the bigger one.

So now I find out this is not true after all and that children must stand. because they haven't paid a fare? That is til 16/18 on TFL. Girls that age can be carrying babies themselves.

I thought I had a grasp on this TBH but apparently not.

It's odd, none of the "children matter less than adults" advocates seem to be able to answer my question.

Let's assume all things are equal, fares been paid, no vulnerability.

11 year old child is sat. 20 year old gets on. why does the 20 year old have an automatic right to the 11 year olds seat by dint of age?