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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

to be sick of all the "tell someone" nonsense following RW's death?

314 replies

cailindana · 13/08/2014 08:44

My fb feed is full of trite messages saying "if you're suffering, talk to someone, we care, we will look after you blah blah blah." Bullshit. When I was severely depressed I did tell people - my GP, my parents, my sisters, my friends everyone. For the most part I got indifference, annoyance, "what can I do?" "get over it" "you're worrying mum," etc. It was only because DH is a bloody saint who spent hours and hours with me that I didn't kill myself. If he hadn't been there then I wouldn't be still alive.
I'm sure if I had killed myself, my family would have done the whole "I don't know why she did it, we had no idea," fuckwittery when in fact they would be perfectly aware of why I'd done it, they just wouldn't think it was a good reason and they would blame me for being cowardly.
Equally everyone else I know who is/was severely depressed is pretty open about it, in fact, I find that depressed people mention their condition quite a lot. The response is generally fear, a sense of not knowing what to say or how to respond, indifference or even disgust.

IME people who are in the depths of depression don't tell others because they have already told them in the past and got nowhere. Implying that if you are in that state all you need to do is "reach out" and someone will be there and everything will get better it totally inaccurate, very few people I know have had that experience. Even the very good kind close friends I had when I had PND last year essentially ignored the illness. They were helpful, very very helpful on a practical level (visiting, sorting out the kids etc) but they never asked me how I was or how the medication was working, I always had to bring it up and then they would just nod and mutter something encouraging. I don't blame them at all for that and I am extremely grateful for the ways in which they did help. It was actually on MN that I got the best support. Here, I met people who had gone through the same thing, who acknowledged my awful thoughts and feelings without trying to change my mind (the whole, "Oh it's not that bad!" that only makes depression sufferers feel they must be mental if no one else can see what they see) and gave me reassurance that yes it was shit but it would pass. They were here whenever I needed them, unlike RL friends who are understandably busy with their own lives.

Depression is a complex illness that requires specialist help. Talking does help, definitely, but a depressed person can't save or cure themselves by just being more open and talking more. Having someone listen is a welcome temporary relief but it doesn't treat the illness any more than talking to a cancer patient would treat their illness.

OP posts:
unrealhousewife · 13/08/2014 15:28

Legion my mother said that of her own son. She's catholic, there's a lot of nonsense involved with suicide and catholicism that filters into common non religious attitudes. Even so, she said it was selfish, not in relation to god etc but in relation to what he left behind.

I think it's common that they push people away and this creates even more guilt as they will have upset people in their lifetime and all we remember is the last row we had, the last paranoid episode, the last self sabotage and what we could have done differently or said differently.

Probably all of RW's acquaintances and friends and of course family will be going through this pain.

It's very hard to get past all that pain and say 'he couldn't help it'. The fallout from a suicide is immense, especially if there are children involved. It's easy to feel angry.

My knowledge of suicide in men is that it's very often a sudden decision, something just tips them beyond the point of no return. Of course it is never their fault, never selfish and always just pure distilled 100% tragedy.

NaughtySpottyBengalCat · 13/08/2014 15:30

Slowredcar I have not one but two Bengals!!! They are all that has kept me going for most of the last 13 years. I feel distraught at the thought of leaving them. We have not been apart more than 7 days in all that time. I agree their purrr is a great healer. I had quite a big operation 6 months ago and I am sure my bones healed quicker for the purrrrrs - which are on the right frequencies to promote bone growth :)

Fairywhitebear · 13/08/2014 15:31

Agree with you. Felt very down/possibly on verge of depression after birth of both children. Told a lot of people, no one listened and it made me feel worse. People don't like to hear 'depressed' they think it's catching!

RonaldMcDonald · 13/08/2014 15:36

I think it would be useful if there was a way to include some basic counselling for family members when someone is severely depressed

I have had experience of family members feeling that all their efforts are 'in their face' or 'not appreciated'.

It's difficult.
Sometimes the help offered isn't what the depressed person would want, ever. A furtherance of their own agenda

NaughtySpottyBengalCat · 13/08/2014 15:37

The awful thing is that the abuse and the lies never go away. When your mother and the rest of your family tells you everyone hates you, that you are stupid and useless and ugly - you as a child believe them. Of course you do. I spent years blaming my 5 year old self for not marching into a police station and asking for help. That is too much for a 5 year old who is terrified of humans to ask. When I asked for help when I was older, I was not believed and punished for lying.

Yes, plan d can be accomplished easily in many ways. I did not score 90% in pharmacology for nothing. I always knew it would come in handy even if I never qualified.

Sicaq · 13/08/2014 15:39

Thanks MignonetteSmile I was very lucky in that it was an isolated episode, long ago now. Looking at this thread, I can see that many people are having lifelong struggles. It's a complex illness, or, rather, umbrella of illnesses.

Sicaq · 13/08/2014 15:44

Sorry, Naughy; life just isn't fair sometimes, is it? Sounds like you've always done your absolute best. I really think it is worth you trying crowdfunding: I have seen plenty of others do it and frankly you are far more deserving than many of them.

unrealhousewife · 13/08/2014 16:03

Ronald you've hit the nail on the head.

If families and close friends were helped to deal with their friend's depression it might actually help the depressed person.

I took the view that I wouldn't change the way I behaved or responded to him so we had some blazing rows. I refused to allow him to push me away and detach from him which a lot of people probably did, or trod on eggshells around him. I'm not sure whether that was the right thing to do or the wrong thing, whether it would have pushed him further. I know that at one point he blamed me for going back to the doctor 'thanks to you I'm on AD's again' he said it as an accusation, angrily.

I do believe that the response/lack of response of families and friends probably could tip them over the edge but also their actions could probably also save them if they knew what to do.

I wasn't told about two of his suicide attempts because they didn't want to upset me. I'm furious about that because it robbed me of the chance to reach out to him.

NaughtySpottyBengalCat · 13/08/2014 16:07

I think I have to sicaq. I am no longer fit to work. I don't want to waste money being given benefits for a life I don't want. This is the one chance I have to get the money I need for a life that would be fulfilling for me and give back to society. If I can get it distributed to enough people, and everyone who has ever been depressed or abused or lost their dreams due to being poor gave just £1 then I would have they money in no time. If it doesn't work and I totally humiliate myself, well I was going to die anyway so nothing lost

DayLillie · 13/08/2014 16:09

People don't like to hear 'depressed' they think it's catching!

One day, a mum at school asked me how I was, just after my twins had started school and I said I was suffering from depression. I was not asking anything from her and I was not 'sad'. I was coping and was fine, as one ever is. She just turned round and walked off.

spongebob5 · 13/08/2014 16:12

I'm glad you've posted about this OP. My FB feed has been full of people saying how tragic it is about Robin Williams death. Yes it is tragic , but there are people out there every single day that are going through similar things who don't get the time of day when they're feeling low.could be your neighbour, a family member or a colleague. Does it take the suicide of a famous person for us to sit up & take notice of how mental illness effects people?

I'm a CPN, I wonder why physical illness gets so much positive coverage in the media while mental illness seems to be forgotten about.

I went on a course the other day with some general nurses, when I introduced myself and gave my job title, one turned to me and said ooh I wouldn't want to do your job! I did say to her that people with mental illness are just that: people! I'm not tarring everyone with the same brush but let's just have some perspective here, mental illness can be anything from anxiety to schizophrenia & it's likely that we all know someone who has or have experienced it ourselves at some point.

mignonette · 13/08/2014 16:13

I do wonder what will happen when all the ravers from the late eighties hit older age Sad. All that fucking with our brain chemistry. I do believe that the mental health situation now is a fraction of what it is going to be in twenty years time.

I'm not the only HCP wondering this.

mignonette · 13/08/2014 16:15

Spongebob

Oh yes the "I couldn't do/wouldn't want your job' from some HCPs who treat patients on general wards with MH problems as if they have Ebola. First chance they get, they try to fob them off rather then taking the time to actually learn about their health problems. Holistic care- it is a joke sometimes.

Mental illness is more common than cancer.

Iwasinamandbunit · 13/08/2014 16:55

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

fassbendersmistress · 13/08/2014 17:13

On the one hand I think YANBU. I recently plucked up the courage to tell a close friend (friendship for over 25yrs) that I was suffering from severe depression. Had been hospitalised and was terrified of people finding out. I felt so vulnerable telling her but she offered support and friendship and that felt good. That was 10 weeks ago. Havent heard from her since. I got in touch when I was discharged and suggested meeting up....she was busy...I really wish I hadn't exposed myself now by reaching out to her.

However, if it raises peoples awareness or even gets people having conversations about mental health, depression etc then that's not really a bad thing.

Andallmyhopeisgone · 13/08/2014 17:58

YANBU.
It really pisses me off when people say "why didn't they just tell someone".

RonaldMcDonald · 13/08/2014 21:25

excellent explanation to everyone about depression

ADHDNoodles · 13/08/2014 21:45

I've been getting the whole "Reach out" to someone you think is depressed so they know you're a lifeline.

Problem with that is, it gives the impression that you, the average person can cure someone of their suicidal thoughts or depression. You can't. You can't fix them anymore than you can fix a cancer patient (unless you're a legit doctor).

Depressed people need professional help. There needs to be posts encouraging people to seek out a doctor, not talk to someone who isn't trained.

Saralyn · 13/08/2014 22:01

I think that a lot of people genuinely think that someone comitting suicide (if they weren't known to be seriously mentally ill) does so because they feel worthless. And if only they had told a friend how they felt, the friend could have convinced them that they were a great person and that they would be missed. And that that would be it, the suicidal person would have been saved.

So maybe the important message to get through is that people who commit suicide (in many cases at least) have been mentally ill for quite some time, even if that wasn't appearant to others. And that they need professional help.

BeyondTheLimitsOfAcceptability · 13/08/2014 22:35

Yanbu.

And the healthcare is a joke. I have been depressed for at least 14 years, since i was 14. I have had disordered eating, i have self harmed, made suicide attempts and think about dying daily. I am now on meds that work better than ever, but i still want to die. I wont kill myself because i worry about the effect it would have on my children, but that doesnt take away the urge to die. I'm not sad daily now, just pretty much blank. I've also had manic episodes that point towards it not being something so simple as regular old depression.

I am not considered ill enough to see a psychiatrist

tiredandsadmum · 14/08/2014 00:13

yanbu - it is normally the people posting it who are most selfish and thoughtless in RL.

olgaga · 14/08/2014 00:18

YANBU

"I just wish you could enjoy life more".

Said with the best of intentions. Made me want to end it all right there and then.

RonaldMcDonald · 14/08/2014 00:37

That is a perfectly reasonable thing to say to someone
How you hear that when you are very depressed is another matter but it is a reasonable thing to say

I hope your symptoms have decreased since then and you are feeling more able

Thebodyloveschocolateandwine · 14/08/2014 00:47

People are scared of what they can't see and you can't see depression like you can see a boil or a cut.

Again like with the bereaved people don't know what to say so sheer away.

Agree with you op.

MummyBeerest · 14/08/2014 01:12

Yanbu.

Someone upthread said it best-in RL, when people know someone is depressed, they "can't be around X because she's a downer." Gee, sorry my depression is so hard for you.

None of these Facebook friends knew Robin Williams when he was feeling really low. We just saw him as a funny comedian. He was paid to entertain us. In the privacy of his own home, when he was feeling awful, maybe he was a total "downer" too, but he's Robin Williams, so would we all be more tolerant of it?

No real eloquent points to make. I'm a depressed person and sometimes I'm not the most compassionate listener when I hear other people's problems, depression, etc.

What I'd rather hear people say is, "we never know how people are hurting."