To be shocked at how many people think having no contact with family is normal?

[dogscatsandbabies]

I'm a lurker. Can't help it, I find AIBU gets me through many a night feed. I'm always totally shocked at how blasé some posters can be when giving advice "she sounds unbearable to me, I'd go NC" and similar phrases.

Really? Just like that you'd advise someone you don't know to break all ties with a relative over a situation you've only heard one side of, creating a family situation that can become unbearable for husbands / wives / siblings who are very literally stuck in the middle?

I know there are some situations when decisions are taken not to see family anymore for various good reasons but I'd seriously hope these were carefully considered and thought through in time given the wider impact it can have. NC just seems so normal to so many. Is it just me that thinks (safety of children etc aside) most problems are at least worth working on?

Huge sympathy to you, Flocc.

I'm fortunate as these things go; Dad doesn't give the tiniest of rat's arses about my children. I should never have had them as far as he is concerned. I gave up the glittering political career that he was determined I should have for children.

Of course if people wanted his side of the story, to hear him tell it he has wonderful grandchildren who he adores. He talks about them all the time, apparently. In the community, he's seen as a great family man. In reality, he saw my children for maybe an hour every 6 months or so, and this was when I was allowing contact and making an effort to call him.

He doesn't know about his grandson's SEN, or how difficult life is for him. He didn't care when his granddaughter was fighting for his life in hospital. I mean, he literally didn't care - it's not just that he didn't visit her, it's that he couldn't be bothered to call, and when I called him, he changed the subject to something about him. It's not a surprise, he told people her name was something else for twelve weeks (not a similar name - something that was on a longlist from months earlier that we'd gone off but he really liked). After I corrected him, I was made to feel bad that he'd got it wrong. 'But I've told people now!' like it was my fault that he'd put himself in an embarrassing situation.

Note - I did tell him what her name was. My mother told him what her name was. He just wasn't engaged enough to pay attention.

The level of grandfathering he actually wants is pictures of my children to show to people so that they can see how wonderful a man he is. He's not going to be chasing me down for contact any time soon, for which I'm hugely grateful.

It is said too often on here and you only get one persons version of events so not the whole picture.

It's a bit like LTB for any little thing he does or thinks. Either it's just said or there are some men who must never utter a word and work 24 hours a day just to get to stay in their homes.

One thing that puzzles me is - how would I know if someone I know felt our relationship was toxic, and went NC with me? Isn't one aspect of 'toxicity' the lack of insight of the toxic person 'it's all about them'; so if someone decided I was toxic, and went NC, my attempts to make contact with the person who (to me) had inexplicably vanished from sight, would be construed as 'trying to reel them back in for more abuse' etc.
This is all hypothetical, no-one I know has gone NC, but it bothers me! Things can look so different to the 2 people on each side of a situation.

When you have a loving happy family, it can be hard to understand that not everyone is so lucky

One of the great things about Mumsnet is that it can give you an insight into other peoples lives . And perhaps gain a little empathy

I recommend this to you OP

So I have another question and I GENUINELY don't mean this to be inflammatory, I'm just interested. Of those of you who have chosen NC with a relative or parent have your siblings / aunts / uncles done the same? Is this person toxic to all family and friends or do they single you out?

I am always more surprised and shocked by what people will put up with in the name of family.

Is it just me that thinks (safety of children etc aside) most problems are at least worth working on?

Define most problems OP, where is the line in the sand?

if someone decided I was toxic, and went NC, my attempts to make contact with the person who (to me) had inexplicably vanished from sight, would be construed as 'trying to reel them back in for more abuse' etc.

My feeling on this is; if someone is toxic, they will not respect the other person's wish to not be around them.

If someone disappeared from your life, and was cagey or ignoring you repeatedly, then my guess is that you would just ask; is there something I've done?

If they came back to you and said 'yes, you've been trying to control me as long as you have known me. I find it really difficult when you step in an insist things are done a certain way. You aren't interested in me even remotely; I feel you didn't even know what I'm going through. Every time I suggest something different, something for me, you cry and make me feel so guilty that I end up trying harder to please you. In short, I'm feeling as though I'm being pushed out of myself because I'm so caught up in being the person you want...'

Well, you'd be hurt, obviously. What happens after the pain is what counts though.

If you were toxic, you might find yourself having panic attacks that they really should know about, or having a heart tremor that needs investigating so they'd come back and help you through that difficult time. (My dad's mum has had two weeks to live for 3 years now. He's contacted everybody to ask them to tell me that I must visit her, it's real this time, she's about to die...') In short, you'd attempt to manipulate the other person into coming back to you. That's what toxic people do; they manipulate other people in order to get their way.

Then, the chances are you'd conveniently forget that they ever pulled you up on your behaviour. It simply didn't happen. Everything's fine and always has been. You are wonderful.

If you were non-toxic, you would sadly agree that the person didn't want you in their life and you'd let them move on and you'd move on yourself.

dogs- I have no idea how my other relatives relate to each other.
I have 5 aunts, 3 uncles and 23 cousins on my father's side and I don't know where any of them live. Perhaps they all keep in touch I have no idea.
It has been 5 years since I have seen my sister.

I haven't spoken to my MIL since 2 weeks after our wedding day (which she tried to ruin) when she screamed down the phone at me telling me I wasn't welcome in 'her family'

She has only met our toddler DD 3 times (once at the wedding!) and hasn't met our newborn at all.

She is the one missing out. Frankly, life is easier without someone who is clearly unstable with a nasty edge.

Mind you, it would help enormously if FIL would actually listen and agree to help sort out what the issues are. Pretending that a load of crap didn't happen is not a solution!

Thanks looking, that makes a lot of sense.

I can see I'm qualified to comment compared to some of the very sad situations on this thread so will bow out. My comments had been based on threads I'd seen in the past where I felt NC was being advocated for relatively minor transgressions. Nothing more.

PS I guess non toxic people are also prepared to apologise if they've upset people they care about.

I think it's more a mumsnet thing. In real life I know very few people who are actually nc

Sorry. NOT qualified.

You don't know how you would behave in certain situations unless it happens to you, what you think you would do, and what you would actually do can be two different things.

I think mumsnet is invaluable for offering people trapped in a cycle of unhappiness a way out - a realisation that it is okay not to be involved with people who do not have your best interests at heart, and who never will have.

It is freedom to be the person you are. Something that you take for granted if you are lucky enough to be surrounded by family who geniunely want your happiness.

Of those of you who have chosen NC with a relative or parent have your siblings / aunts / uncles done the same? Is this person toxic to all family and friends or do they single you out?

My siblings are not NC, but none of them chase down contact; they don't really have a relationship with him one way or another. I'm the only one who's actively avoiding him.

They all know that I'm NC. My sister understands completely why I've done it and is quite protective of me - she holds no truck with his attempts to use her to get in contact with me. My brothers know and accept it but they don't quite understand it. I haven't ever shared with them what was happening.

Our relationships with him are all quite different. This will often be the case in dysfunctional families - one or several children are treated differently to the other siblings. Dad used to delight in setting me above my other siblings, and had me dancing on the end of his rope. He loved the discord between us children. I was his project, the others were given a lot more freedom from him. I was taught to fight them to protect him. By the time he left, I felt as though he was throwing me into the enemy's pit.

Our relationship was intense and incredibly twisted. He had me wanting to marry him. I literally wanted to take my mother's place.

Because of that intensity, that smothering, suffocating desperate need to be everything that he expected me to be, he and I were just different, and I was very damaged.

If we'd have continued down that road, with me fighting the others for his sake, I'd have ended up as his and I'd lose them. Having spent my late teens and early adulthood recovering, I'm hugely grateful that I ended up with them and not him.

my grandparents were lovely my mom is not my fil is not nice either i don't think not speaking to them affects my children if anything my middle child is determined never to speak to grandad again as he was there when a massive incident occurred thats the main issue with fil batter your brother by all means but don't do it on a,your grandchild's birthday and b,less than a foot from both of your grandchildren when they can't get away forcing your son to get involved and drag you off you should not try to get your son arrested for dragging you off nor should you rant vocally that the grandkids should be destroyed and are not even your grandkids

jesus christ himself would have to intervene before he speaks to grandad again right now he never wants to speak again

Completely agree with you OP. In cases of abuse yes it's probably justified but if I'm correct this isn't actually what she is talking about. It's the ones who suggest that a husband not buying you a present for your birthday is being borderline abusive and that you should take the children and leave immediately, or that a grandparent has fed your baby a bit of banana and the answer is to stop all contact and forbid them from being alone with the child from this point forwards. Happens regularly.

most problems are at least worth working on?

Totally disagree.

Most poster do give clear reasons for their problems and usually involve years of suffering with a mad mil to contend with who wont listen, yadayadayada

who I have never seen it happen regularly at all.

women are constantly being told that they have to compromise, to work on relationships, make allowances for other people etc. frequently this means putting up with an awful lot of shit for the sake other people, that threatens their own mental (and sometimes physical) health and happiness

these decisions aren't taken lightly, but i do think that more women should be encouraged to focus on the positive relationships in their lives, that support them and make a positive difference to their lives

Some families are so toxic and detrimental to health that NC is better than suffering years of emotional abuse. Not all families are the Walton's. Some op families on here are that, op is unhappy, family wether it's PIL or parents are so horrid to the op, despite them bending over backwards to please them, sometimes NC is tge only way. I went NC with my toxic sister, she resented me from the word go, she was 21 when I was born, and admitted to me as an adult she wished I wasn't born. When I was a child, the put downs, treated differently. Low level emotional abuse. One day I just had enough and dident bother anymore, distanced myself. Best thing I've done, I am a much happier person now.

You don't have a clue, some families are awful abusers.

I don't recognise this Mumsnet you are taking about

Here I generally see lots of threads where women who have struggled for years with very difficult problems are offered help and support .

Of course there are a few bonkers threads and some equally off the wall replies. But usually posters with genuine serious issues are given mostly well balanced advice, from a range of perspectives