Intolerable situation with DH and DM - who is BU?

[CambridgeBlue]

I'll try to keep this brief - basically DH can't stand DM. I am the first to admit she can be difficult and at times very irritating. She falls out with various friends/family members, has absolutely no tact and can be pretty self centred. Trying to keep it balanced I would also say that life has dealt her some pretty crap cards but she is well-meaning, generous and would do pretty much anything for her family.

DH has never had much time for her but lately the situation has got completely out of hand. He will barely speak to her if she visits, never comes with us if we go to visit them and just makes it obvious he can't stand her. I have some sympathy as she can be quite intrusive (always turns to me, never DB ) but I think you have to make some allowances when you marry into a family - I could never imagine behaving to MIL as he does to DM.

Two things lately have brought this to a head - first is that DM has a big birthday this year and DH has flatly refused to attend the celebration. I have accepted this because I know DD and I will have a better time without him but it looks awful to other people and just emphasises to DM that despite me making excuses for his behaviour, he does actually dislike her.

Secondly, they had quite a major incident at home a few days ago which led to DM calling me lateish one evening in tears. I was asleep, DH wouldn't wake me (luckily the phone had so I did take the call) and was extremely unsympathetic. I appreciate late night calls scare the crap out of you and maybe there was no need to ring at that time but again, I just can't imagine being so unkind to someone.

I just don't know what to do. I have made a conscious effort lately to stand up to DM when she is being unreasonable but at the end of the day she is my mother, she is getting older, is not in great health and I have no choice but to be there for her. DH can be quite judgy and antisocial with other people but never as bad as this.

It's ruining my relationship with DH as I feel completely stuck in the middle (we are pretty happy the rest of the time, not perfect but what relationship is?) What's worse is that DD is getting old enough to see both sides and she feels stuck in the middle too. I find myself offloading on her because she is the only one who understands but that's not right as she is too young to have to deal with such crap (she's 12).

We're supposed to be off on holiday in a few days but I feel totally fed up at the thought of playing happy families for a week - I try to put things out of my head and keep the 2 'sides' separate as much as possible but it's just not working any more.

I think you grew up with a demanding, controlling, selfish mother and have now married a similar kind of man. No wonder they clash. They're the same. It's all about them and very little consideration of you. And no wonder they love being around you because you put up with it all. There's deeper stuff going on here. You should be furious with both of them the way they treat you. You need to learn how to grow some balls with both of them.

Bang in the middle of those 2 actually DrudgeTrudy.

I was less annoyed about the call as I did see it as a legitimate emergency for once but then I found out she hadn't even told my DB 24 hours later. I'm not sure why he should get away with not being involved especially as he doesn't have a family - he's quite flaky (lovely too though) but that's not my problem.

But caimbridge you don't normally give a call to people depending on some sort of rank. I have rung dc1 about X so I will also call dc2 and dc3 about it.
You ring to get some support and you will know that one of them can give you that and not the other. The same way that you might ring your mum about x subject but not your dad iyswim.

70yp is tricky. Some of those are still very much on the ball whereas others are more fragile.
I know my patents are at that age and I have notice a clear decrease in their ability to handle stressful situations in the last few years.

I also have a controlling mother but she and DH get along okay. They didn't always and it still flares up every now and then but for the most part it's okay.

I've gotten better at telling my mother when things aren't about her and she needs to back off. At the same time I expect DH to suck it up sometimes.

I think not going to her birthday and being arsey around Christmas is ridiculously immature. If he doesn't want to go to the rest of the visits or if he wants to be out when your DM is there, well whatever. But those few times a year he can frankly stop being such a princess IMO.

As for the phone call, I'd kill DH if he refused to give me a phone call for me.

This is all about your own boundaries I think- being brought up by your Mum has made it difficult for you to say "NO".
I would practice being more honest with both of them about your feelings- they will kick against it at first-but otherwise you are pandering to both of them.

It may actually be easier for you to take DD with you to see your Mum on your own and ignore DH-but it isn't up to anyone else to tell you-you need to think hat you want and go for it!

Over the years he has become more stubborn and determined not to do anything he doesn't want to

Ah, this does sound bad and if it continues in the long term then it isn't going to work is it? Marriage is based on give and take not 'my way or the highway' type approach.

Your DH and DM are frighteningly alike in their selfish demands on you. I think with both him and your DM you need to have very firm boundaries about what you are and are not willing to accept or you will go bonkers trying to keep the peace and please everyone, especially if that means doing things that make you feel uncomfortable.

It's not an easy situation though

I did see it as a legitimate emergency sooooo what did you do zoom round with a water pump and whatever people do to clear water from flooded houses or hire a helicopter to rescue your DM?

Neither?
Then why the hell did she phone you, if you could do buggar all.

I would have def waited for a day or so before worrying anyone.

My DB's life has been a list of crises, it still is, but it is largely due to his own doing, marrying someone before knowing them properly, marrying someone for the wrong reasons, not saving properly for the future etc etc etc It is def not my job to 'save' him constantly.

YOu have a pia DM and a possibly selfish and inconsiderate DP.

What you have to do is just get on with your life (and your DD's), yes, you can just concentrate on yourself and do the utmost to give yourself a happy time
We are only on this planet once, make the most of it and let the buggars stew others look after themselves.

No there was nothing I could do from miles away at 11 o'clock at night. She said she just wanted to speak to me which I suppose is fair enough. It's true that she shouldn't have to then call DB just to even things up but she would never call him first even though he only lives a few miles from her, his role is to be the funny flaky one whereas mine is to be the supportive sensible one it seems .

Stop her cambridge stand up to both of them

I don't think one should have to justify speaking to an elderly parent at 11 pm who is agitated because of flooding.

I don't think a caring partner stops his mother in law from speaking to her daughter about such a matter, unless the daughter has specifically asked to be left to sleep etc. Even then the partner should express sympathy, give advice etc.

It's not that there's a right answer, but the question is where do the poster's own boundaries lie and how is she to go about setting them with both partner and mother.

God, I know the OP was asleep, but was it really the end of the world for her to be a kind voice at the end of the phone? It was 11pm not 3 in the morning!

(and how many times had her mum been awake in the early hours waiting for the OP to roll in, in previous years?)

The OP hasn't said she had to be up early to perform brain surgery!

A little kindness is a good thing!

11pm isn't a late call!

I thought you meant 2am.

Your dh is bu and rude.

He knew your DM before he married you. His choice.

Can I just reiterate what others have said about you offloading onto your daughter. Please please stop doing this.

This to me is the worst behaviour out of all of it. It is incredibly damaging for a child.

Your daughter does not have the maturity to realise that your discussions with her are to validate your own feelings and to sympathise with you about the situation. She will absolutely accept whatever you tell her is right and that Granny is difficult and Daddy is awful etc etc

It sounds to me in the nicest possible way that you need to grow up a bit. You are not stuck in the middle, you do not have to play this role. Just accept they don't like each other and do things separately. It may be easier than you think rather than all this angst, especially as they live so far away.

I don't think a caring partner stops his mother in law from speaking to her daughter about such a matter, unless the daughter has specifically asked to be left to sleep etc. Even then the partner should express sympathy, give advice etc.

This is exactly how DH would behave in an ideal world, it's how I'd hope DD's partner would be in years to come if we called up with a problem.

Gosh, it's a bit like history repeating itself.

Your are the responsible one DM dumps on leans on all the time, your DD is your strength that you lean on. Hmmm?

That's a bit harsh - I said in my OP I didn't want to do that and I am making a conscious effort not to - I'd say I was learning from past mistakes rather than repeating them. I never want DD to feel about me the way I do about DM.

I think yabu. Your mum sounds like a pain and it sounds like you enable her.

There are countless threads on MN by people whose DHs won't stand up to their mothers. Inevitably the OPs on those threads are encouraged to go NC and told that their DH's first priority should be to his family and that if he sometimes asks you to compromise in favour of his mother that makes him a manchild tied to the apron strings.

Well, I think your first priority should be to your husband. Your mother has another child, not to mention a husband, and the way she clings to you sounds strange and unhealthy. I think it's very strange that you're resentful of your husband rather than your mother in this situation. And conscious effort to learn from past mistakes or not, please stop leaning on your DD before you create another too-close mother/daughter bond and set her up for another round of the same uneasy dynamic.

Just stop being your DM's doormat, honestly, break away a bit and you will be surprised that the world won't fall about your ears, she won't throw herself off a cliff, in fact she might be a bit more reasonable if there isn't someone to load with her 'problems'. She might become better company and less wearing.
Then your DP might like her more.
Don't humour your DP, leave him to it. Find nice things for you to spend time doing which don't rely on others permission or approval.

The flooding phone call is sidelining the real issue which is you being dumped with worries by your mother. Stop encouraging it, just let her rant then hang up. See less of her. You can change this dynamic and stop the stress.

Once that is sorted you can sort out your DP......

It all sounds utterly exhausting, tbh. How much of your own life, the one life you will ever have, is spent worrying about either your DM or your DH, how they are behaving (separately and towards one another), what they've just done, how you're going to handle X situation next month? Do you think either of them gives that much thought about doing what makes you happy? Really do think about how much you can withdraw from all the 'handling' of both of them as it is a huge drain on you. I am a people pleaser myself, hate conflict between people close to me, and I know exactly how it can come to this.

There is no 'X is right, Y is wrong' here. Life is a set of compromises. The thing is that it shouldn't have to be you arranging them all the time and putting all the effort into. I do think that where contact between your mum and your husband is concerned you need a plan, i.e. he agrees to be there and polite at Christmas, this big birthday and maybe one other time during the year and in return he gets to 'go away for the weekend' or something when she makes her other visits. But otherwise you need to shake off a lot of this responsibility. One aspect to this would be ringing your brother and telling him you can't sustain it and he needs to step up a bit or he will have both of you on the phone to him about all the family ins and outs.

I think you should suggest a compromise - he sees her half as much as he is seeing her now (by the way I think 6-8 times a year is A LOT) and behaves politely during these occasions.

If your DH wants to cut her out of his life then that is his descision, he isn't trying to force you to do the same

Why would he go to her party? Surely by not going he is avoiding an atmosphere and you are able to go and enjoy yourself

I think by trying to fix things between them you're fighting a losing battle

I also think it's really unfair that your DH is getting the brunt of your resentment

He was in the wrong about the phonecall though, that was your decision to make (though I can sort of understand why he was a bit narked about it)

Your H is being a rude, entitled, immature, selfish arse.

No matter how he feels about his MIL he should not be making someone he loves miserable about someone you have no control over, didn't choose to have in your life, and to whom you are bound by a family bond.

You should not be feeling this pressure from him.

And it's not just abut your mother. Selfish stubbornness that has caused you to carve out your own life when he misled you into thinking he was capable of behaving differently when dating is not on. He is making no effort and taking you for granted.

My mind is going in the same direction as Oldie's here, Cambridge.

"He can choose to cut her out of his life" well of course he can, but should he?

Both of them need to grow up.

I would tell my DH to man up and come to the birthday to support YOU and help supervise DD - this occasion isn't about him, and part of being in a family is some give and take. It is important to teach DD that sometimes you have to do things you don't fancy in the pursuit of family harmony/job commitments etc. If it was a work meeting and he didn't like the client as a person, he couldn't tell his boss "I don't want to go". This is an important family occasion and you want his support. Can you stay elsewhere (rather than with DM), to minimise the time he is subject to her pfaffing about?

Minimise other contact through the year, he doesn't need to choose to spend time with her, although it would be nice if he would suffer the odd occasion politely, without humphing etc. Is there other things you do for him because he wants it, rather than you? (Not necessarily social things, hobbies, or trips out etc)... show him how everyone has some give and take, it's part of being part of a community/family.

Definitely give your mother some firmer boundaries. If she's calling every day and it's getting annoying, finish a call by telling her you'll call her Tuesday, and if she calls before that over some trifle, tell her you can't deal with it right now, but have time on Tuesday to chat about it with her.

You don't need to be caught in the middle of this. Perhaps you may need to negotiate some occasions, but "normal" interactions of phone calls, the odd visit, christmas shouldn't be stressing you all year (and worrying about a family holiday without your DM).