Breastfeeding on Cross Country trains - a horrid experiance

[Paulala]

Hello ladies, I'm a first time poster & a first time mum so apologies if I introduce myself by way of a horrid experience but I'd like to know if you think I'm being unreasonable.

I've just taken my first train journey with my 7 month old boy, we were travelling alone to Derby with everything we needed for a week on a Cross Country train. Everything was going ok until we returned to our seat from a nappy change. The nappy change itself was quite upsetting for him, being strapped to a table in a moving urine soaked metal cubical isn't very pleasant, but I hadn't expected a lot from the facilities.

I intended to give him a breastfeed at our seat but when we got there the seat beside us was occupied (we were in a set on 2 seats not a table of 4). I asked the man sitting in the seat if it would be possible for him to move to one of the single vacant seats 3 rows up just while I breastfed so I could have a little bit of privacy. He said No & stated that was the seat he was allocated why should he move.

I asked him again saying my baby needed to be fed, he was hungry & distressed & there were empty seats in view he could use. He said I should move there instead, this really wouldn't have helped as they were single aisle seats & would have meant I'd have to feed even more publicly. I was so upset I asked him if he expected me to breastfeed in the seat beside him with him watching & he just shrugged his shoulders.

At this point everyone close by was aware of the situation & I'm still standing in the aisle with an upset baby, this man hasn't even got up to allow us to sit down. The ticket inspector then arrives & I explain to him that the man in the seat beside us is causing a lot of distress with his insistence on sitting there while I breastfed. Anyone who's traveled by train will know neighbouring seats offer no prospect of personal space.

I fully understand his right to the seat he booked but both he & I could see other seats he could have taken until I stopped feeding then he could have returned to the seat he booked when we finished. I'm sure many men would have been totally ok with doing that. Instead he was nasty & snarly & the thought of him watching me feed my baby in such a tight space was horrible. I had no option but to ask the ticket inspector to help me find another seat & to help me move all my things, we would also need the assistant at Derby station to be made aware we'd be on another carriage. All because this man would not move 3 rows up.

Still seating stubbornly in his seat the man recognised how upset he'd made me & stated loudly to everyone, right I'll move & asked the guard what he was going to do about it. The guard then said we'll sit you in first class sir don't worry about it you will be ok there. I couldn't believe it he'd made me suffer through a very public request to breastfeed privately (or as private as I could be) he'd initially insisted he would not move while I did so & left me feeling like I shouldn't be breastfeeding on a train, all while I stood with a distressed baby in a moving carriage while everyone watched. When the man eventually moved I sat & fed my baby & cried it was the worst breastfeeding experience I've ever had.

I have to travel back next week with the same train company & I'm dreading it, I can't express milk & I'm really worried something similar will happen again. I think trains should have a breastfeeding policy which recognises a womans need for privacy and a bit of respect. Not a system where men are rewarded for making women feel bad about the need to feed their babies. Do you think I'm being unreasonable?

Cheers ladies,
Paula

Sirzy... I've had a response too and have asked MNHQ to post their view here as there seems to have been many reports of that post.

Are all of you attacking the poster actually woman or even parents.

What? .

I thought the way she acted was indefensible and I felt sorry for the man she bullied and harassed.

I thought her comments later were vile. But never mind helensburgh MNHQ have condoned her post and evidently agree with you.

Probably a good job or else she could have been in serious trouble making the accusations she did in here in RL.

It speaks volumes that the guard moved the man to first class and not the op.

Wasn't there a thread pulled lately where posters were a bit harsh on a celebrity and MNHQ said they were pulling it because they WERE NOT on the thread to defend themselves? So what's the difference?

No that I agree with the constant thread pulling, btw.

helen She was rounded on for her flounce and calling a man a misogynist pervert because he wouldn't do as she asked.

I imagine the difference, from MNHQ's perspective is that a celebrity could sue them whereas the average person? They're stuck being pissed off.

I don't see where in her post she called him names to his face

She doesn't say she called him a pervert to his face but she does say she was asking him if he was going to sit there and watch and she did announce to the guard, presumably loud enough for him and the rest of the carriage to hear, that he was 'causing her a lot of distress' by 'insisting he was there while she breastfed' whereas in reality he just insisted in sitting in the seat he'd paid for. It would have been pretty mortifying and 'he is insisting on being there while I feed' coupled with 'are you just going to sit there and watch' is a roundabout way of calling someone a pervert to their face imo only it took 5 minutes and was very public rather than 5 seconds and between the two of them.

Possibly but I seem to remember that the message mentioned not being able to respond. And doubtful a celeb could sue based on not being liked. Libel obviously is a different matter.

Evidently mnhq think sexist unfounded allegations are fine if the butt of them is a) anonymous and b) male.

I haven't read the whole threat.

Having breastfed my own dc, also on trains and other public places, I often used a cheap pashmina scarf to cover dc and me, giving us perfect privacy.

Doesn't cost much, doesn't take up much space either.

I'd actually be really pissed off if my partner told me his automatic reaction to a woman starting to breastfeed was to move. Because that would imply breastfeeding was some strange private activity.

And she's not a 'new mum', btw. Seven months in is a bloody long time, in the wierd dystopia of new parenting!

See I am wondering now why I wasn't perved at shile breastfeeding

I didn't have a cape so maybe that's why!

Or maybe I just got in with it, didn't expect anyone else to care a flying fuck as they have lives of their own to lead and I usually fed and read.

I feel I missed out on making a huge fuss.

Bugger.

I don't see where in her post she called him names to his face

So it's ok to call people vile names behind their back then!?

She did accuse him of wanting to watch though.

I think the OP was very wrong here, it doesn't help at all to normalise breastfeeding and make others more comfortable by shouting pervert at men if they don't cower and hide from a perfectly normal function.

Accusing him if wanting to watch is pretty much calling him a breast ogling dirty old man.

You have given a total stranger your power. He had no obligation to move and you had no right to ask him to. You sat sobbing over your baby while breastfeeding on a train? Can I suggest another strategy?

You change your baby in his buggy in the space between carriage, I wouldn't wipe a dogs arse in changing facilities on a train. Baby will not be distressed but happy. Find the nearest seat or even sit on the floor and pop baby under your top and feed him.

End of.

I fed babies all over the place, in tight corners, big spaces, public spaces, dirty spaces and private spaces. I just got on with it. For first time mums there is a big shock which is nobody else in teh big wide world cares about you breastfeeding. Yes in an ideal world the man would have moved. Any man I know would have moved. But you gave all your power away here.

mother yes my dh wouldn't dream of moving as it kind of implies disgust/ embarrassment.

He probably wouldn't notice and certainly wouldn't care either. Perfectly normal in our circle of friends.

The difference between this and the celebrity thread is surely that the man is anonymous, the celebrity wasn't.

I certainly didn't attack her for the way she felt.
I would disagree, your and others posts along the lines of I was happy to feed in public, others are happy to feed in public so get a grip are berating her for not wanting to do the same.

Oh and btw, next time go and sit in first class yourself, nobody will throw you out.

I know, I think I had one queasy remark once from my ultra-prudish BIL. I did once wonder about whether or not to breastfeed in a nice restaurant but in fact the Turkish staff all made a huge fuss of the baby. (And the work contact I was lunching with - a father himself - didn't turn a hair.)

We are saying that in reality nobody actually makes a fuss.

If she felt she wanted a bit if privacy I'm sure the guard would have looked for a seat for her, what you don't do is ask someone to move from a booked seat and make them feel like a perve for saying no.

I have had people move away from my bellowing toddlers, mind. Quite understandably.

I wonder if mnhq would change their stance if someone recognises their partner as the subject of this?

And what gives a breastfeeding mother the right to transfer herself to first class without asking ?