Breastfeeding on Cross Country trains - a horrid experiance

[Paulala]

Hello ladies, I'm a first time poster & a first time mum so apologies if I introduce myself by way of a horrid experience but I'd like to know if you think I'm being unreasonable.

I've just taken my first train journey with my 7 month old boy, we were travelling alone to Derby with everything we needed for a week on a Cross Country train. Everything was going ok until we returned to our seat from a nappy change. The nappy change itself was quite upsetting for him, being strapped to a table in a moving urine soaked metal cubical isn't very pleasant, but I hadn't expected a lot from the facilities.

I intended to give him a breastfeed at our seat but when we got there the seat beside us was occupied (we were in a set on 2 seats not a table of 4). I asked the man sitting in the seat if it would be possible for him to move to one of the single vacant seats 3 rows up just while I breastfed so I could have a little bit of privacy. He said No & stated that was the seat he was allocated why should he move.

I asked him again saying my baby needed to be fed, he was hungry & distressed & there were empty seats in view he could use. He said I should move there instead, this really wouldn't have helped as they were single aisle seats & would have meant I'd have to feed even more publicly. I was so upset I asked him if he expected me to breastfeed in the seat beside him with him watching & he just shrugged his shoulders.

At this point everyone close by was aware of the situation & I'm still standing in the aisle with an upset baby, this man hasn't even got up to allow us to sit down. The ticket inspector then arrives & I explain to him that the man in the seat beside us is causing a lot of distress with his insistence on sitting there while I breastfed. Anyone who's traveled by train will know neighbouring seats offer no prospect of personal space.

I fully understand his right to the seat he booked but both he & I could see other seats he could have taken until I stopped feeding then he could have returned to the seat he booked when we finished. I'm sure many men would have been totally ok with doing that. Instead he was nasty & snarly & the thought of him watching me feed my baby in such a tight space was horrible. I had no option but to ask the ticket inspector to help me find another seat & to help me move all my things, we would also need the assistant at Derby station to be made aware we'd be on another carriage. All because this man would not move 3 rows up.

Still seating stubbornly in his seat the man recognised how upset he'd made me & stated loudly to everyone, right I'll move & asked the guard what he was going to do about it. The guard then said we'll sit you in first class sir don't worry about it you will be ok there. I couldn't believe it he'd made me suffer through a very public request to breastfeed privately (or as private as I could be) he'd initially insisted he would not move while I did so & left me feeling like I shouldn't be breastfeeding on a train, all while I stood with a distressed baby in a moving carriage while everyone watched. When the man eventually moved I sat & fed my baby & cried it was the worst breastfeeding experience I've ever had.

I have to travel back next week with the same train company & I'm dreading it, I can't express milk & I'm really worried something similar will happen again. I think trains should have a breastfeeding policy which recognises a womans need for privacy and a bit of respect. Not a system where men are rewarded for making women feel bad about the need to feed their babies. Do you think I'm being unreasonable?

Cheers ladies,
Paula

Wow, thanks for the update OP! I'm amazed you managed to ascertain that the guy was a pervert and a misogynist from a few minutes exchange in a busy train carriage!

If you need two seats fair enough - but pay for 2 seats. Simple. This is just like families on planes who won't pay to reserve seating together, and then expect other people (who have) to move to accommodate them! No chance!

Mmmmmmn.

I taught my children bf is perfectly normal.

I also taught them to go through life as fully functioning adults who are kind and considerate and don't expect the whole world to revolve around them

I didn't allow strops and tantrums either or encourage them to accuse perfectly innocent strangers of fairly serious offences on a whim.

This thread is gold! I'm not sure whether I would prefer it if she's a goady fucker or a genuine entitled princess. On the one hand, people like this exist, but on the other...

Hilarious!!

So...." Wow DH you'll never guess what I am reading about on MN, this is the most entitled princess ever or indeed a goady fucker!!!"

"Oh yeah, whats happened what did she do"

" she asked a man if he could move for a few moments whilst she BF in tight train carriage seats and he said no"

"yeah what an entitled princess...fancy, asking a man to move....jeeezzzz"

I can personally think of far more entitled princess examples than a lady with tiny baby asking someone to move momentarily.

I'm amazed you managed to ascertain that the guy was a pervert and a misogynist from a few minutes exchange in a busy train carriage!

Wow so a man has never spoken to your breasts before?
Interesting.

Anyway, this will ramble on, I think its awful how many feel the need to pile in here.

Thing is if the OP had just fed the child without fuss this poor bloke being accused if being a pervert and a misogynist (very serious accusations OP, I hope you're proud of yourself and that nobody ever accuses your own partner of similar) probably wouldn't have noticed.
A lady sat opposite us on the train once fed her baby while carrying on a conversation with us, he commented when we got off about the baby looking very cosy all snuggled up to her. I had to point out that baby was in fact having lunch...

To add - he probably didn't move because most trains now are full of reserved seating and he could have been worried about moving seats to a reserved seat and then at the next stop the person getting on there that wanted that seat.*

Yes the poor worried man. She did say didn't she it was only whilst the baby fed.

SweetSummer... you're adding to the 'pile in', you know, by posting.

He made the issue public not me. The man was a pervert & a misogynist who clearly got off on belittling me infront of the carriage.

That's one hell of an assumption, given that you were the one getting lairy with him for having the audacity to sit in his own reserved seat.

Most people don't even notice BF. Why assume that he is a perv? And you were the one who made a scene and belittled him.

Next time, why don't you pre-book two seats - that way you will have a less stressful journey, and so will all the other passengers.

'we would also need the assistant at Derby station to be made aware we'd be on another carriage'

This surprised me most about the op. I haven't read all the pages, but is the op disabled? Why else would you need an assistant to escort you off the train?

sweet do you commute on trains on a frequent basis?

If you or the op did you would understand that seats can be empty until the passenger who has booked then gets on.

This poor man may commute every day if he gives up his seat to move he may well be turfed off at the next station and end up standing for hours

The world doesn't revolve Around one woman travelling with a small baby. Other people have busy knackering lives too.

Some posted really need to understand rail travel.

Oh and the meaning of mysogynistic, pervert, entitled and princess.

Sheesh, I thought this thread was going to be about being told someone couldn't breastfeed on the train. Why do some people think that breastfeeding automatically mean that the world must now revolve and you and your whims?

FWIW, I do think the bloke was a bit of a prick for not moving, it probably would have been no skin off his nose really.
But
Breastfeeding does not give you the right to make someone do something they don't want to do, purely for your own convenience, nor does it automatically give you some sort of right to 'privacy' that others do no get.

Accept that some people are unhelpful arseholes, that's life. Then get over yourself.

I would assume the op had luggage or pram, travel cot etc. in the guards van. My dh books his bike on the train and there is a guard waiting at the carriage to let him put his bike on/take it off when he gets to his stop.

I imagine he wasn't a poor worried man anymore than the op is a vulnerable woman!

Both are adults.

One acted like a reasonable one and the other didn't.

And if you ask a favour, whilst it might be nice for people to comply, you can't expect them to. The man had booked a seat, was in said seat, then someone asks him to move. He refuses so the OP causes a scene. If the OP had been reasonable, may SHE would have been the one moved into first class.

Some people may just want to sit in their seat, minding their own business - I am sure that he wasn't interested in watching you BF!

Thing is if the OP had just fed the child without fuss by the sound of it he had not even got up to let her back into her seat!

Thing is if the OP had just fed the child without fuss

Hard to feed baby without fuss cramped onto small train seat.

I would honestly be ashamed of my DH, had he not immediately jumped up when saw woman coming back with baby and said " let me see if i can sit elsewhere and give you some room"

Eauneau... So, what would you call a woman who didn't want to move? What's the equivalent of 'prick'? A bitch, perhaps? Why would you overreact in this way? It's bizarre.

Somebody who doesn't help/doesn't want to help isn't an 'arsehole' as you so charmingly put it. They are a person who doesn't want to help or can't.

A person who DOES help is helpful. A person who doesn't help is unhelpful. We covered this in primary school, I'm sure that we didn't 'do' swearing and namecallng.

I don't think people think she is an entitled princess because she asked him to move, more that she berated him for 5 minutes about it and claims that him sitting in his own seat was making her suffer, called him a pervert, and thinks train companies should provide private places for breastfeeding even though everybody knows that the rail system is full to bursting as it is and she could have breastfed in her seat and she wouldn't have had this problem if she'd booked the two seats she claimed she needs. Actually, just that last bit. Wanting two seats but only paying for one in the hope that you can harang or shame the person in 'your' second seat into moving.

Yes! I do understand rail travel, and I understand the use of words and legs....

He could have moved, then moved back to his seat if necessary, he doesn't have to be consigned to the wilderness of two seats up for all eternity, human bodies are flexible and can move.

, and thinks train companies should provide private places for breastfeeding even though everybody knows that the rail system is full to bursting as it is

Oh yes the poor ickle little train companies who try their best to give us the most expensive and over crowded appalling rail service in all of Europe