to demand OW pays back the money h spent on her

[justfoundout2014]

I know I am, but I am so enraged. Found h has had a 2.5 year affair with a mutual friend while being a sahp. We are still living together for financial reasons, but I am pretty sure the marriage is over - though he still maintains not necessarily. The problem is I keep finding out more little details and each one causes stress.

We have pretty big money worries and I have been looking through our account history today. I am at fault here as this is the first time I have looked in the 10 years we have been together, despite the fact that I am more or less the sole earner . I have found that he has paid for a couple of hotel rooms and a couple of other things in the last couple of years. The amounts are not huge at all, but obviously that's not the point.

I will confront him tonight but I so want to demand that she pays me back the amount, or that I will turn up at her house until she does. Yes, it was family money, but I bring almost all of it all in and she knows that. How could she let him pay for anything? This is not helped by the fact that I have asked her several times to meet me and discuss things since I have found out and she has refused. Her texts are the most mind-blowingly patronising, inhuman things I have ever read. She doubts I 'could be civil' but 'sympathises with the situation I'm in' etc. No apology, no regret, nothing.

I know he has betrayed me most, but she has too and I just want acknowledgement of that. I won't do it, obviously, but just so angry now and want her to have some consequence like I have.

I don't know about having no obligation digitized surely as a friend you sort of owe it to them not to shag their husbands?

The not giving full disclosure and wanting to minimise things is a fairly classic code for 'ok, I was a norty boy and couldn't keep it in my pants, but hey, I'm still the lovable rogue you married, so let's brush it under the carpet and move on, eh?'

It is in his interests to keep you angry at the OW (rather than him). It's in his interests to smooth things over, refuse to discuss, try and force his agenda. You don't have to let him.

On another point, you certainly will be spending less on food, utilities etc once both kids go to school and there is no-one in the home during the day. Also he'd be liable for maintenance - which doesn't seem to have factored into your consciousness but certainly he's thought about - because he wants everything to 'stay the same'.

You need to work out what you want from your marriage - not from your joint parenting, but from your marriage. Once you're clear on that, shit hot legal advice as to how to get it.

Good luck.

I'm sorry to hear about what your h has done

He is a cock, this is no reflection on you.

She is also a cock.
She owes you nothing financially. Stop texting her immediately and DO NOT go to her house or approach her in any way.
She is a walk on villain and not a main character.

She and your H will have made up an acceptable little narrative for the scummy way they have behaved. Don't allow them to further justify their actions by behaving in a harassing manner toward this woman.

IME behaving completely calmly and taking my time to see a decent solicitor, hire a nanny, see a therapist etc was much more frightening for my ex H
He wanted a fuss and drama and loved all that idea of attention

It is not for him to say your marriage isn't necessarily over. That is for you to decide first. When you have time to spend thinking and letting this settle, your thoughts and feelings will clear and you will feel stronger and better able to cope. You'll be able to act without hurt or pain driving your next move.
Then you decide if you want to continue in this marriage. Then you speak to him.

People telling you they are sorry for causing you and your family group immeasurable hurt and pain doesn't change what occurred. I know it feels as though you deserve an apology but there is no justice to be had from her or him.
Shock and then anger are the beginning stages of grieving for anything...you have to through them to move on.

Yes, while I fully understand that h's betrayal is by far the bigger, I struggle to accept that she owes me nothing/had no obligation etc. She sat with me in parks time after time, in pubs several times knowing what she was doing!! H had to lie, once committed to an affair - there was no way out. I know he could and should have stopped it, but he couldn't avoid lying to me. She had no need to ever see me. We all met, she could have avoided me without causing suspicion (we weren't established friends before this happened) but she chose to develop a friendship with me, knowing what they were doing. I will never understand that, and can only assume she got a kick out of it. I also know she wanted my kids to be friends with hers, and didn't see why she shouldn't have everything she wants.

I don't think I've explained it very well, and I don't mean h couldn't help having an affair, he bloody could have, but once in, he had to lie. She had no need to have anything to do with me, but she chose to. Had she not done so, I wouldn't have her bloody phone number to harass her!

She doesn't owe you the money he does. You need to cut her out of your mind. Just take it from him I'm sure you have access to the accounts.

She had no need to have anything to do with me, but she chose to

People like this like the drama, they like being involved. Don't give her what she wants. Delete her number and never speak to the horrible woman ever again.

I have seen three solicitors and what they all said actually goes against a lot of what is said on here about SAHDs. It doesn't seem to be about custody anymore, but about coming to an arrangement through mediation. I suppose it helps that my h is not contesting what I want (not that we have done anything official yet) but all the solicitors seemed to think that I didn't need to worry too much about losing the children in any case. There is no way h has the potential to earn enough to pay this mortgage, and I couldn't afford that and a bedsit for myself, meaning the house would have to be sold if I moved out. Solicitors said that it is considered 'for the children' and to be preserved until they are 18, at which point sold for h to have a pay out. he doesn't want one, though of course may feel differently then.

There us very little chance as harsh as it may seem, that would sign off a consent order where your DH gets nothing at all, especially as he is currently not working.

Yes the house could be awarded to the primary carer. It is nothing to do with SAHD, rather it is to do with who cares most of the time for the children.

Yes you can come to an arrangement through mediation.

Courts do lean more toward shared care these days where there is near as much as is possible equal care of the children. If this is what would happen in your case then you would both need suitable accommodation for this to happen in, which may or may not mean the selling if the family home.

It may be that you come to an arrangement that your husband gets the tax credits as he has no income and is the sahp.

If this is the case the marital assets that you have need to be split under the S25 rules.

Should read 'that a judge'

So have the three solicitors lied/misinformed me? If h chooses to have nothing, is that not allowed?! (I know he may change his mind, was also advised to move quickly, as that is likely to happen, in their experience). He is absolutely adamant he wants nothing. He wants to maintain stability for the dc, acknowledges I don't deserve this and says he has his pride. Is that really not allowed?? If he got the tax credits, what would that achieve, except my not being able to work .

Solicitors also said he would be expected to find work, and that, though he may be entitled to spousal maintenance in the meantime, it would not carry on long-term. He says he wouldn't take it anyway.

You need to cut the OW out of your thinking. Whilst she clearly has no morals shagging a married man and enjoying money earnt by his wife, that is irrelevant to you really, she could be anyone. You will never get anything satisfactory from her - not information, not money so you must leave her alone. You need to focus on your disgusting husband and where you are going to go from here.

To seperate you finances fully you would need a consent order to stop claims against each other in the future.

If you put forward one where your DH was to get absolutely nothing then I would expect a judge at least to meet you both to discuss it.

I have seen cases where judges have sent consent orders have been sent back for various reasons.

In the long term he would be expected to work, just like any sahp would be going through this situation.

I am so sorry to hear that this has happened to you.

i appreciate that you are angry and yes, what they have done was wrong. However in your situation I would think i would be the bigger person and block her out completely, some people have little moral compass and will do whatever they can to make themselves feel better about what they have done wrong. IMO your dignified silence shows her up for being the person she obviously seems to be.

Be angry with him the most i think, yes she has betrayed you as a friend but what he's done is worse. he said vows and he broke them.

I see. I think one of the solicitors at least did mention that we would probably have to be seen as it looks so favourable to me, though every other way it's completely shit for me. Seems madness to think that if someone admits they are in the wrong, they are not allowed to take the consequences of their actions financially, where marriage is concerned. H had no career before becoming a sahp, so couldn't argue that he had potential earnings that he never got, if that's relevant. Seems to me, if I have to support h, the only ones to suffer would be the dc, and, dd, in particular would absolutely hate to not live with me, regardless of who is considered to be the primary carer.

I wouldn't rely on what he says now, while he still thinks he'll get what he wants (return to the status quo). If you decide to end your marriage, I think what he wants will change. I actually wouldn't believe a word that comes out of his mouth, tbh.

H had no career before becoming a sahp, so couldn't argue that he had potential earnings that he never got, if that's relevant. Seems to me, if I have to support h, the only ones to suffer would be the dc

I am sure that that is a situation that many come across. My DPs partner tried to argue the same. She had no career either and had no intention of ever having one and was most put out when the judge told her she had to work.

Agree with Lonny. When he gets advice he will be back for money - he'll be after spousal maintenance, a chunk of your pension, maintenance for the kids, the works.

Everyone says they will be reasonable until it comes to the actual sitting down and hammering it out part.
He still thinks that acting fair might give him brownie good guy points with you
This may all change if you decide things are completely over, especially if you take control of the situation

If a woman had an affair we would not be telling her to walk away from her family, family home, maintenance etc and tell her to start afresh
No solicitor will allow him to do so either

Can I just ask - if he did decide to try for what he could get, would my income not be taken into account? I mean, I know he would not want this house - he would feel tied by it, doesn't (now) like where it is, aside from the morality of kicking me out, he wouldn't want it. I honestly don't think he would want to be here with the dc all week, with me just seeing them weekends - he would feel trapped and lonely and have a lot of the downsides life with me has, without the benefits. I honestly don't think that would be his aim.

So does that just leave spousal maintenance? If a judge looked at my outgoings, they would surely see I cannot afford more than a piddling amount. Then what? Order the house to be sold? But meantime he would be expected to find work, no? So by the time any sale went through, he would surely be in work anyway - so what would be the point??

My pension is a worry, but he is a fair bit older than me, my retirement age is, fuck knows, old, and likely to increase further, and he also has a degenerative condition, so not sure I need to worry about that.

Putting everything aside, if both of you aim to put the children first and go through mediation in that spirit, then it is possible that you'll come to the kind of agreement you mention.

But if he was one of my friends, there's no way in hell I'd be saying to him 'walk away from the house, walk away from just's pension, start again at the other side of town with nothing, sure you'll be able to get a job in a bar and support yourself, she doesn't owe you anything.' And that's just me talking. Not a lawyer.

Yes, he's been a shit and caused your family life to implode, but settlements aren't usually based on who did wrong, they're based on the best interests of the children.

I do sympathise, my friend's in a terrible marital situation and can't afford to do anything about it - her H would get legal aid, but he doesn't want to split, so she'd have to fund everything and buy him out of the house, etc (long story which I won't go into).

just, my ex earned a lot less and he got 60% of our joint assets and I alone support the children. The law is sexually neutral. Like I do your husband earns much less - in your case nothing - so he is like a typical housewife in that respect. There is no fault in UK divorce so it does not matter if the person getting all the money is the one at fault as in my ex's case.

If I were he I would not move out and I would delay things and try to be seen as the primary carer so I could aim to get the house and children and eventually move another woman in whilst getting financial support from my ex wife.

He is much more at fault than the other woman of course.

I've just noticed that he has a health condition which makes it difficult for him to work. Surely he would be entitled to some sort of (additional, if he#'s getting something already) incapacity benefit if you separate (even in the current economic climate).

The house, savings, pensions and assets aswell as debts make up the marital money pot.

This is then split according to certain criteria, usually on the needs of the parties. If your husband has a degenerative illness then yes that would be taken into consideration.

- her H would get legal aid, but he doesn't want to split, so she'd have to fund everything and buy him out of the house, etc (long story which I won't go into).

Legal aid is only now a valuable for cases of DV.

*avaliable

I don't know all the legalities but I don't think you should chase the other woman for any money. Cut her out of your life and consider the money the price of finding out what a false friend she was, in which case it was well spent, it's worth it to never have to see her again. Don't put yourself through the stress of arguing with her about money when her attitude has been so unapologetic and upsetting.