About gay vicars.

[VivaLeBeaver]

Now I admit I'm not religious so I don't really get the argument of breaking church law, etc.

But I think its crazy that in this day and age a vicar can be refused a licence to practice by the local bishop because he's gay.

I thought Christians were meant to be tolerant, compassionate, etc.

Its even more crazy when he wouldn't be working directly for the diocese but for the local hospital.

bbc news story

He is able.
He is willing sometimes
Evil comes from Satan

Ergo, if he is only willing to prevent evil sometimes despite being able to, he is malevolent. And if he is able to prevent evil, why does he allow Satan to get away with it?

I have found this short YouTube video of Matthew Vines giving a short overview of the arguments he makes for biblical acceptance of same sex relationships, in the book I mentioned above.

Link m.youtube.com/#/watch?v=gmp6lLct-fQ

He may well be malevolent. He is allowed to be.

You see, I realised eventually that He can be whatever He wants to be.
It doesnt matter what label is put on Him.

He is the one with the power.
What are you going to do about it?

Personally I succombed, backtracked, gave in, submitted, trusted.

Thanks for that link from the American from kansas, he makes a good case but what do you think to all the sexual immorality in general between heterosexual couples?

food for thought

I'm surprised free will hasn't cropped up yet. God will not stop evil if it interferes with someone's free will.

I'm surprised free will hasn't cropped up yet. God will not stop evil if it interferes with someone's free will.

suffering can be caused by things other than evil. Hep A, AIDS and earthquakes etc etc.

But christians can pray Bardette.

Earthquakes are from God

You have made me stop and think about the other two.

Christians can pray, but God will not stop a person from exercising free will.

He may well be malevolent. He is allowed to be.

So why on earth would people worship him and trot off to church and sing hymns full of praise of him? Isn't that utterly hypocritical?

^You see, I realised eventually that He can be whatever He wants to be.
It doesnt matter what label is put on Him.^

He is the one with the power.
What are you going to do about it?

On a personal level, absolutely nothing. Because the whole thing is fictional. I respect people's wish to believe, but I'm constantly bemused by the way that believers have to tie themselves up in massive philosophical and logical knots because there is no way you can seriously make sense of it.

Christians can pray, but God will not stop a person from exercising free will.

So why will he not prevent things that are nothing to do with free will, such as natural disasters and children being born with dreadful illnesses and disabilities?

Is God willing to prevent evil, but not able? Then he is not omnipotent.
Is he able, but not willing? Then he is malevolent.
Is he both able and willing? Then whence cometh evil?
Is he neither able nor willing? Then why call him God?”

What if God is able to prevent evil but chooses not to because people have the right to be evil if they want to?

You have made me stop and think about the other two.

as the creator of all things, didn't he make AIDS and Hep A too?

Someone once called prayer "posh moaning"
They aren't far wrong ime :)

in many churches a minister/vicar/elder would be asked to step down from leadership because of other"sins" too eg adultery, drink driving convictions for fraud or indeed any criminal record or going bankrupt etc not just being gay

It makes sense to me Icimoi.
About 97% sense. I considered that was enough.

Baddderz

I must admit that I have to remind myself to give thanks, and say thank you in general. I dont consider myself the best pray person in the world by a long way.

writtenguarantee. I am afraid that I do not know the answer.

I read somewhere that Aids was a manufacturered disease. this was in a conspiracy theory type book written by a New Zealand christian

God created the world perfect and without suffering, but people chose to pursue evil and the world became corrupted. God did not create disease.
Disease was never in the plan but has evolved as a result of evil in the world. Some disease it is easy to see the link: smoking=cancer, others the link is not as obvious and direct.
I said earlier that diseases such as HIV would die out if people stopped being immoral.
But God gets blamed - if a woman contracts HIV as a result of rape is that God's fault? If a child gets cancer because he lives in a polluted world is that God's fault? If people starve to death because the world's resources are hoarded by the rich who's fault is that? Many people live along the San Andreas fault line knowing that there will be an earthquake sooner or later, should God force them to move so he doesn't get blamed for their deaths?
We are responsible for the suffering in the world.

I have had a think Bardette, and I think that you are right.

It goes back to God is good and evil comes from Satan.

But God created the world. So the microisms or whatever must have been put there by God. But Satan made them bad.

Churches attitude is you can be gay as long as you are celibate. Presuming that if you get married you will no longer be celibate and that is where the problem is