To wonder why people hate immigration/immigrants so much?

[PeachyParisian]

I don't mean to the UK specifically, but within Europe, worldwide..

Does it boil down to a sense of entitlement? i.e. I was born here so i deserve to reap the benefits of my ancestors hard work.
Also I suppose economic migration is completely different to fleeing to claim asylum although I see no differentiation made in the UK media.
Its always about "benefits tourism"/"generous benefits given to asylum seekers".
I'm an expat, DH is non-EU and we are planning on moving to the UK this year and I'm tired of all the raised questioning eyebrows incredulously asking me if he really is forrin.

I find it hard to get my head around the idea that I am worth more, deserve more etc just because I was lucky enough to be born a British citizen.

I think expat is an easy way to distinguish oneself from the horde of filthy immigrants, while maintaining one's distance from the locals in the new country. 'I'm an expat, having a sunnier life and bestowing my presence upon the fortunate country I have chosen.'

It also absolves people from the need to integrate. 'Its fine, really, there's a lovely expat community.'

You will find these people in the comments section of the Mail Online complaining about Polish people in Britain speaking Polish to each other.

I call myself an immigrant. Perfectly happy to. I was an expat when I was temporarily in a different country. When I was an expat, it was funny how many people didn't bother to learn the incredibly easy language there. I wonder if they are the same people who moan about immigrants not integrating in the UK...

Trazzle, I completely understand why OP used that word in this context. What I think it's telling is how many expats only refer to themselves as such in their "new country" and even when talking to people who are not British, then go on about how they have left the UK because it's going to the dogs as there are so many immigrants.
I think that they don't even realise they are immigrants themselves because in their head they are expats.

I'm an expat, having a sunnier life and bestowing my presence upon the fortunate country I have chosen - It is isn't it? gah, that's me taught.

I think what many DM readers don't realise is that the EU works both ways. I can roam freely thanks to the same rules that allow other EU citz to move to the UK. I'm obviously biased but i think it's fantastic. Funny how I only hear people bitching about Roma people or anyone Eastern European moving to the UK from the EU but nobody minds if its the French, Italians and so on.

Sorry OP, not having a dig at you. Like I said I think your use of the word is completely correct in the context you have used it, just not in every context.

Sorry Mee I didn't mean to be condescending. Hope you didn't take it that way. Thanks for clarifying. And thanks for not being rude

I don't think it was that great for my ancestors who were poor living in the 19th century, great for the landowners etc but not the working classes.

p

Actually, I was being a bit of an arse, and I apologise for that. There is the temporary vs permanent issue that MrsTP raises - though I've always described myself as an immigrant here even though it was only supposed to be for two years! And I think there's an issue of common usage - people use it because everyone else does. But it feels to me a UK/US thing which partly springs from a sense of cultural superiority in some people, but then taken up more widely.

I always enjoy the DM comments about the immigrants coming over and talking in Foreign, which are always signed off 'which is why I no longer live in Britain' with the username 'John Smith, Spain'.

These are people who've never met irony.

I think people mention roma and EE because its their presence that has been most noticed over the country as a whole...

I honestly don't know what your driving at op.

What most guardian readers do not seem to realise, is that the UK is not comparable to most other European countries in that its a small Island...it also has more pull factors than other eu countries.

All the main parties have admitted it was a huge monumental cock up, not to do what Germany and the other countries did when the borders opened and put work restrictions in place.

People see the effects of mass immigration with their own eyes...

Most people except a few die hards on here.

Also op, whilst its wonderful that you and many others have gone to other countries, thats that countries governments business.

The UK government has a duty and responsibility to look after its citizens and to allow sudden mass movements of people to live here, has not been the right thing for the UK.

I also find the argument that mass immigration is a good thing rather un savoury when countries like Poland are having a mass brain drain, as there is very little movement into the EE block countries.

Moan away about past crimes from western european countries but are you sure its not happening again when people are leaving poor EE countries, they are not benfiting from mass immigration are they?

im white and from a commonwealth country (without giving too much identified info)
I am apparently acceptable but my 3rd generation british neighbours who have Indian heritage get abused because they are not white/from former british colony

sorry I meant to say former predominantly white colony.

The UK government has a duty and responsibility to look after its citizens which includes people who would desperately like to live with their family members who are unable to join them in the UK.

Also op, whilst its wonderful that you and many others have gone to other countries, thats that countries governments business eh?

And the poorer countries do benefit greatly from those who choose to move away. Money is sent back to help families, build homes and so on. Not everybody who comes to the UK intends to stay permanently but doing so is the only way to earn enough to give themselves a decent quality of life.
I will never begrudge anyone who is working hard to make a better life for themselves and their families.

People who don't like immigration tend to tell me that they don't mean me. Things get awkward when I tell them they do. When I first arrived I was a uni dropout who took a low pay low skill job in a low pay low skill small town. (Worked my way up from there to a skilled profession). Even had surgery on the NHS 3 months after my arrival. But I didn't choose to have appendicitis.
I was lucky the EU allowed me to do that and think free movement is a fantastic right which shouldn't be thrown lightly.

The people who fear immigration the most are those who have never moved away, and don't know what it's like.

What most guardian readers do not seem to realise, is that the UK is not comparable to most other European countries in that its a small Island...it also has more pull factors than other eu countries.

Yes the UK is a small island, as I mentioned earlier there is a similar number of Brits living in EU countries as there is European immigrants in the UK, a polish person doesn't take up more space and resources than I do, do you expect all the Brits living abroard to "come home" or would you expect the coutries we live in to embrace our presence despit the UK not having a reciprocal agreement?

The only advantage I can see with living in the UK is that English is spoken, the UK is far behind many other EU countries in many respects which is I imagine why there are so many British people who have chosen to leave.

People who don't like immigration tend to tell me that they don't mean me. Things get awkward when I tell them they do. When I first arrived I was a uni dropout who took a low pay low skill job in a low pay low skill small town. (Worked my way up from there to a skilled profession). Even had surgery on the NHS 3 months after my arrival. But I didn't choose to have appendicitis.
I was lucky the EU allowed me to do that and think free movement is a fantastic right which shouldn't be thrown lightly.

The people who fear immigration the most are those who have never moved away, and don't know what it's like.

From a UK perspective, I'm puzzled by your post. The Uk has a pretty proud history of welcoming migrants. To name but a few - Huguenots in the C17th and C18th, Jews in '30s, Asians from Uganda in the '70s.

I don't think most people "hate" migrants; that is rather a silly and simplistic assumption. Rather there is a real fear that there has been immigration to the UK on an unprecedented scale and that the infrastructure cannot cope and migrants cannot assimilate. At my local primary, 75% of kids speak English as a 2nd language. The teacher's main focus is trying to teach basic English language skills and the remaining 25% are being held back. Urdu is the main playground language and non migrant children feel excluded.

I also think your comment about entitlement due to "ancestors" is misplaced. The welfare state was only founded in '40s and '50s. You overlook the contribution that many people have made (and continue to make) through their UK taxes all their working life. An old aged pensioner who has paid UK taxes for over 50 years might well wonder why he is waiting longer for his hip replacement operation because people who have never paid a penny of UK tax are in front of him.

Suffering, access to education, and poverty needs to be addressed around the world. More needs to be done by 1st world countries to assist developing countries. Your proposal to move the world to the UK is not an answer.

I have lived and worked in different European countries. I still believe the British are relatively tolerant tbh.

I think there have been serious issues in those localities that have experienced a large increase in economic migrants within a relatively short space of time. While immigration (particularly from Eastern Europe) may well be a net economic gain for then nation, it has exacerbated pre-existing pressures on local funding - this is especially true of low income areas. My DiL is a primary school teacher and accommodating a lot of Eastern European children has put them under severe financial pressure.
The government should have diverted a far larger proportion of this extra income to core services in those areas.

I think people are generally more tolerant of asylum seekers (though many just mistakenly lump the two groupings together). But central distribution policies were responsible for tensions 10-15 years ago. Lots of relatively young men sent to quite poor, ethnically homogenous localities was never going to be a recipe for social cohesion. Plus - in the early days - little thought was given to how asylum seekers from different ethnic groups could/would live in close proximity.

I think hate is a very strong word to use.
The people I know who have concerns do not hate immigrants.
They are concerned that:
green spaces are being eroded to build more houses.
you may start with one person who then brings their family. These dc will be competing for the same education and jobs as native dc. This will devalue their skills and lower their earning potential ans standard of living.
they feel that there is no longer a sense of nationality, they feel as though europe is becoming a large state.

It is easier to dismiss these concerns as hatred than address the feelings behind them.

All the main parties have admitted it was a huge monumental cock up, not to do what Germany and the other countries did when the borders opened and put work restrictions in place.

of course, they are looking for scapegoats for failed policies and know this resonates with a lot of Brits. when have immigrants not been the easiest scapegoats?

What most guardian readers do not seem to realise, is that the UK is not comparable to most other European countries in that its a small Island...it also has more pull factors than other eu countries.

The Netherlands is comparably dense. France is less, though much is covered by mountains. we are talking about some fractions here (sometimes not insignificant), but not orders of magnitude.

People see the effects of mass immigration with their own eyes...

what are those precisely? crowding is a negative, but that is a south east thing which is exacerbated by strict planning (that's the problem). otherwise good food and good plumbing?

Your proposal to move the world to the UK is not an answer I have no recollection of making such a proposal

I don't think there's anyone alive today who was welcoming the Huguenots into Britain though is there so that's not strictly relevant.

littledrummergirl Are you basing your belief that a 'native' is more deserving on the fact that nobody should have to move abroad to find work or because people born here should get first dibs on all the good stuff?

good food and good plumbing

Why would their skills be devalued by competition? It's not as if less skilled people would outcompete them?

And as for gramps waiting longer for his hip operation (which might be performed by an immigrant assisted by other immigrants and nursed back to health by immigrants) - the country of your birth says little about the amount of UK tax you (or your parents) have paid.

very sensible points on here and I totally agree about the pensioners who have been working since they were 14 etc.

I think we need to consider that most people were very poor in the uk and it was only a few who really benefitted from colonialism.

I dislike the way the SE is so overcrowded and I don't agree with mass immigration but don't hate the people.

In 2008 there were actually more immigrants in Spain than in the UK, and most of those came in the past 15 years rather than the 60 or so that they have been coming in to the UK. In that respect, there is nothing special about migration to the UK

Now the immigrants are leaving Spain in their 100,000s

If you want immigrants to leave then you need to pray for a huge economic slowdown, and you need to get rid of the UK's incredibly generous benefit system. After a few years with no proper job, the immigrants will go home... mind you, your children may leave the country too ;)

to clarify, by mass immigration is everybody referring to the EU rights of free movement?