to aak UKIP supporters if you would have voted for the Nazis too?

[wigglylines]

The brilliant Michael Rosen on UKIP.

l“I sometimes fear that people might think that fascism arrives in fancy dress worn by grotesques and monsters as played out in endless re-runs of the Nazis. Fascism arrives as your friend. It will restore your honour, make you feel proud, protect your house, give you a job, clean up the neighbourhood, remind you of how great you once were, clear out the venal and the corrupt, remove anything you feel is unlike you…It doesn’t walk in saying, “Our programme means militias, mass imprisonments, transportations, war and persecution.”

We are talking about hundreds of millions of pounds of loss to the NHS in these various ways. Ms Soubry needs to raise her game, and show some urgency and some sympathy for long suffering taxpayers who foot the bill for this injustice

The programme showed how anyone can register for free treatment with a GP; how illegals and fictitious people could register and obtain potential access to hospital treatment where they are meant to pay; demonstrated that the Uk issues cards to false applicants for European health Insurance where UK taxpayers have to pay for treatments using them; fails to collect much money from European governments for all the reciprocal treatments we supply here; and how the UK has a bad deal with the Republic of Ireland over treatment for retired people

Rosen made a good point and what he describes is just what happened when the Tories got in. All those promises and yet the poor have less money and less rights than ever.

The real mistake is thinking that one lot of politicians is worse than the rest on the basis of some Daily Mail headlines. I'm sure there are all kind of valid objections to UKIP, but the ones I hear from people tend to be nonsense that they swallowed completely because they saw it in capital letters.

UKIP tap into this sense of entitlement

I think you've missed the point by a country mile.

Which is why UKIP are growing in stature.

The disenfranchised are not entitled because many are deemed to be the underclass....hopefully that will change soon and something will be done about attitudes that keep people down.

I'm not obviously foreign until I open my mouth that is, and it's amazing what horrible things people feel it's acceptable to say to people like me. Things that, a few years ago, I would rarely have heard.

That is the trouble now. People that were surpressed are now somewhat erupting.
It is like the locked in teenager being allowed out his room. He is annoyed.
Whereas, there should have been some talks, and a bit of the meeting of the ways as regards how many people to let in.

Too late now about what has gone on before.

But not too late for something to be done about it. Else the whole thing could end up nastier than it already is.

Kinsorange- you mean you're a stealth foreigner? How very unsporting of you! Not British at all...........

Martorana, I copied and pasted that from further up the thread. Not sure if you are joking or not?

Nope Trevor, I think you misinterpreted me. It's the same sense of entitlement men have to all the good and secure jobs. When they see women come in and take the jobs they think of as their own they get all upset and have those manly tantrums that usually result in women getting fired. UKIP represent those who are having to compete for jobs against people who are often more qualified and harder working. I hate the term disenfranchisementThey have the franchise. They have access to jobs and housing. In many cases they choose not to put in the effort and the hours to compete. Instead they have a tantrum and blame their ills, not on the collapse of the global economy, not on the ConDem govt that disproportionately target cuts at the poor and less able to cope, but at those who, despite these disadvantages, flourish by hard work and dedication. I'm not saying it's easy being part of the underclass, but the immigrant experience shows us that it is perfectly possible to survive and even thrive in hard times. If it's not the immigrants, it's the gays or the women or the disabled.

I have versions of this conversation daily with students who blame everything but their reluctance to work on their poor grades.

Kinsorange copied and pasted from my posting. I like the frustrated teenager analogy. It perfectly encapuslates the rage without intellectual engagement that UKIP employ.

I'm pretty sure England has overtaken The Netherlands in terms of population density.

ok. Not my point though. also, the UK is much bigger than england.

You aren't going to find many people moving to Inverness.

The fact is England does have an extremely high population density, and a sensible government would control immigration.

The world's most densely populated countries (excluding island/city states):

• Bangladesh: 964
• Taiwan: 639
• South Korea: 484
• England 410