Active discussions

Meet the Other Phone. Protection built in.

Meet the Other Phone.
Protection built in.

Buy now

Please or to access all these features

Talk
AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

See all MNHQ comments on this thread

Original poster

To Have Horrified By This And Refused To Get In Car?

210 replies

GoldenGytha · 02/05/2014 19:17

I was out for lunch today with a friend, her niece and niece's two boys aged 4 and 1.

It was about a 20 minute drive along the dual carriageway to the place we went to for lunch, but after that friend's niece wanted to go to Matalan for some clothes for a forthcoming holiday.

When we got back into the car after lunch, Matalan was about a 5 minute drive back along the dual carriageway and niece told the 4 year old to just sit in his seat and not bother about his seatbelt as it was "only a couple of minutes along the road" She also didn't strap the baby into his seat.

I said "You can't do that, you must strap them both in, it's not safe" I was rather abruptly told that it was not my business, they'd be fine for all the distance they were going. I said I couldn't get in a car where a child wasn't safely strapped in, and that I was very uncomfortable with it.

After a lot of muttering and "FFS Golden, what a fuss to make about nothing, are you always this bad, and if it makes you fucking happy I'll strap them in"

I don't normally go about telling folk what to do with their kids, but this really shocked me, WIBU to have said something?

OP posts:
thebodydoestricks · 02/05/2014 20:43

I won't post links but they are there if you google

French coach crash Worcester school.

.

Original poster
GoldenGytha · 02/05/2014 20:43

Thanks everyone!

I was beginning to doubt myself for a minute there,

Friend and her niece did make me feel very awkward, but I'm glad I spoke up.

OP posts:
DioneTheDiabolist · 02/05/2014 20:44

Maryz are you really stamping your feet or are you trip trapping over bridges?Wink

Alcibiades, don't bother with actual sciencey stuff. Just take Anonymans approach to statistics: Make up a number and guess! It's much more fun and much less time consuming.Grin

Original poster
GoldenGytha · 02/05/2014 20:45

I remember talking to you thebody

That was a horrific crash, how is your DD doing now?

Thanks
OP posts:
Original poster
GoldenGytha · 02/05/2014 20:48

I have to go for now, but will look back in later,

Thanks for the replies everyone,

I thought I had done the right thing, but pleased to see you all agree,

Well all apart from Julia.

OP posts:
Ohbyethen · 02/05/2014 21:02

My second cousin died in a crash half a mile from home. He was 3 and didn't want to get in his seat, they were only going to pick up his mum and sister from a party round the corner so he was allowed to sit on the back seat rather than deal with a full on tantrum.
They were t-boned by the other driver who ran the junction.
His injuries were devastating but his dad sustained only minor bumps because he was wearing his belt.

He is a broken man. He has never driven a car since that day. Very sadly, but understandably, his marriage failed it was too much to get through, the grief, the guilt and the blame.
He says he is 100% responsible for the death of his son because if the same thing had happened with him strapped in, he would have survived. Why didn't he make him? Why didn't they walk? Did being 5 minutes late really matter?
Not being strapped in has destroyed a whole family.

I will never be in a vehicle and not use belts or seats. Not even once. Not for a 2 minute trip. Never.
Because if you don't strap in then you will be responsible for anything that happens. If you think 2 minutes is a fair trade for the weight of that knowledge as you look at your dead child then you are a dangerous fool.

Ohbyethen · 02/05/2014 21:08

This reply has been deleted

Message deleted by MNHQ. Here's a link to our Talk Guidelines.

DioneTheDiabolist · 02/05/2014 21:11

Ohbyethen that is such a tragic story. But one that needs telling to people who adopt a complacent attitude to restraining children in vehicles.Sad

rabbitrisen · 02/05/2014 21:12

I could be wrong, but I dont think that troll hunting is allowed under any circumstances?

rabbitrisen · 02/05/2014 21:13

aw, how awful. Poor family.

Mintyy · 02/05/2014 21:14

I can't imagine that there is any persuasive argument for saying that a 4 year old and 1 year do not need to be strapped in to their car seats (where such luxury is available and infact required by law in our priviliged western world) so imo HQ should just ban the wankers who are saying yabu, op.

Ohbyethen · 02/05/2014 21:31

Dionne - I agree. I have told it more than once for that reason but it's sad and frustrating how many people find a reason for it not to be at all relevant to their behaviour.
It's worrying how sure people are that it'll never happen to them, as if their skill or other actions will protect them and my uncle somehow did something that caused the crash and of course they never would so it's fine.
The cruel irony is he was actually a very good and careful driver who followed all the rules, the accident itself not his fault, but an 'unimportant' rule he thought he could bend 'just this once' was anything but.

Maryz · 02/05/2014 21:33

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

alcibiades · 02/05/2014 21:41

Dione - good idea, so I'll state categorically that 100% of people who don't insist on seatbelts are twats.

The sciencey bit is that I've been trying to learn physics - and today I learned about the formula for kinetic energy: (1/2)mv2. That's half, times the mass, times the velocity squared. What that means is that if I was standing still on the pavement, maybe waiting for a bus, and someone walking fast (5 mph) barrelled into me, I'd be knocked over. If a cyclist/skateboarder/whatever going at twice the speed (10 mph) hit me, the effect wouldn't be twice as much, it'd be around four^ times as much. An unrestrained child in a car even at a low-speed collision is going to hit the solid frame of the car with a lot of force.

Ohbyethen - That is such a tragic story.

Peggy - Back in the mid 1970s, when we had our firstborn, our car was a fairly modern, standard car of that time. It didn't have seatbelts in the back. We took it to the garage to have seatbelts fitted. The mechanics had to figure out where to fit the anchor points on the frame. It might not be the law to have seatbelts fitted to older cars, but it is possible to achieve that. That might save your life one day; or at least save the police from having to deal with the consequences of your body being propelled out of your convertible.

Springheeled · 02/05/2014 21:44

I would never get into a car with anyone who wasn't belted up, and have had to insist sometimes, esp in taxis. Years of sitting through police road safety lessons and graphic videos have drummed it fully in that 'a person in a car without a seatbelt is an unguided missile'
Yanbu op

peggyundercrackers · 02/05/2014 21:57

Alcibiades about 14yrs ago now I was in a normal car with a seatbelt on and was involved in an accident whereby my car left the road and rolled onto its roof, every window in the car was broken, every piece of the car was damaged even the wheels were bent - luckily I wasn't hurt seriously partly because of my heigh, I am quite small and the Policeman commented he had never seen anyone walking away from such a bad accident and had I been 6inches taller I would have broken my neck as the roof of the car was pushed down to the same height as the headrest - so I am completely aware of the dangers of being in a bad accident.

There I no way on earth I will put seatbelts into my other car, I understand the dangers of being without them and I am completely fine with this.

rabbitrisen · 02/05/2014 22:26

Ok. Sorry. I misunderstood.
I too dont see why you got deleted in that case.

PigletJohn · 02/05/2014 22:44

I'm told (you might need someone who can calculate accelerations) that if you fall off the roof of an ordinary 2-storey house, you will be travelling at 30mph when you hit the ground.

If you friend would be happy for her kids to play on the roof, on the grounds that they probably wouldn't fall off, it would be equivalent to not using seat belts on a local journey.

Most accidents are on local journeys, because most journeys are local.

Original poster
GoldenGytha · 02/05/2014 22:52

Ohbythen Sad

That is such a sad story, I am so sorry, what an awful awful thing to have happened.

If I thought I could persuade friend's niece to always strap her children in by showing her this thread, then I would.

Sadly though, I think it would have the opposite effect and I'd be told I was an interfering old biddy and I was making a fuss about nothing.

OP posts:
Ohbyethen · 02/05/2014 22:53

Peggy - is your old car a pleasure drive, for want of a better term, for you or do you have children as passengers?

Bunbaker · 02/05/2014 22:54

Does the niece not know that it is illegal to not strap the children in?

Ohbyethen · 02/05/2014 22:59

Thank you Golden it's a shame she won't be told but I hope you are feeling better about having done the right thing.

If she's unconcerned about safety is she as unbothered about breaking the law? Although it's a small fine relative to the consequences the officer finding two tiny tots unrestrained will have firm words about her pig headed stupidity. If you know she's doing it, call it in I completely agree.

slithytove · 02/05/2014 23:02

This is a terribly sad thread :(

I just asked DH would you ever not strap the kids in - he said no.

Then I asked what about for a 100 metre journey up the road. He went quiet, obviously considering it.

If this thread does nothing more than reinforce the importance of car seats and seatbelts to each of us and our families, then it's a fantastic thread despite the trolls

emotionsecho · 02/05/2014 23:11

My first car had no seatbelts fitted and my dad quietly went and had seatbelts fitted, he never said anything to me, nor did he ask me to use them but I got the message and have used them ever since.

emotionsecho · 02/05/2014 23:18

Posted too soon, and I never start the car until everyone has their belts on and the children are secured in their seats, how many people have regretted taking a risky short cut, just this once, it's not far, etc., etc. Well done for standing your ground OP, I'd have done just the same.