To think people without fertility problems should not give advice to those with fertility problems however well meant it is?

[Moonfacesmother]

My heavily pregnant friend came over last night. She does not know we have been ttc for 18 months and have had one failed ivf cycle. However she told me about a close friend of hers who I also know although not very well.

My heavily pregnant friend (hpf) said that she said to this poor woman who has been ttc for four years and is about to start ivf the following:

'I said to her it's probably because you need to relax. Book yourself a dirty weekend and get drunk and I bet you'll get pregnant. I wasn't bothered if I got pregnant or not and I got pregnant first cycle so I think if you just don't worry about it it will happen.'

This is exactly why I have not told people about our problems! I was somewhat annoyed on behalf of our mutual acquaintance.

Aibu to think that people should just not say anything like this?! If you've been ttc for 4 years it's unlikely to require you to 'just relax.' My hpf spoke as though she was some sort of fertility guru.

[mrscumberbatch]

I don't know, I can't help but I feel like I need to say something encouraging or supportive.

So I probably say some sort of guff.

I'd rather do that than just sit in silence.

[allisgood1]

YANBU to be annoyed, your friend is ignorant.

[Kewcumber]

MrsCB - try "I'm so sorry that must be awful"

Works a treat and doesn't rub salt in some very raw wounds that other people have also repeatedly rubbed salt in.

No need to say nothing.

[ikeaismylocal]

Relaxing won't cure problems like a 0% sperm count or an early menopause but I believe if you can relax your body will be more likely to make the most of limited fertility that you have.

I have pcos, fibroids and a heart shaped uterus, dp has morphology issues. We are luckily in that there are eggs and sperm it's just they are not great quality, not reliable and once pregnant the fibroids and heart shaped womb make early pregnancy a minefield. I don't think that relaxing cured any of those fertility issues but I think that my body is more receptive to a pregnancy when relaxed and sex is much better when it's not ttc sex, I wonder if that makes a difference

I spent so many months trying all sorts of woo type treatments in the hope of improving fertility, acupuncture, drinking grapefruit juice by tge gallon, taking pills that taste like horse shit, post-sex legs in the air yoga. Most women I met whilst ttc have also dabbled in at least one or two woo type methods whilst ttc, it really is a desperate situation. I don't think suggesting that relaxation helps is so wacky.

[HoHum264]

I feel your pain, my SIL fell pregnant on the pill with DC1, tried for 'ages (7 months)' with DC2 and got preganant 'by accident' with her DC3.

My ex- best friend had DC1 with a married man and tricked him to get pregnant with DC2 whilst i was ttc, however i was told 'it will happen when it happens'!! good luck with your ttc.

[shakinstevenslovechild]

I think a lot of people, when hearing someone has a problem, feel the need to 'fix' it for them.

They don't know how to react, and they haven't been through it so can't empathise, they don't know the right thing to say so end up talking rubbish in an effort to be helpful.

The problem is, if nobody tells the person who is issuing this advice how upsetting it is they will continue to do it because they assume they are actually being helpful.

I think the best thing you could do is to have a word with your friend and tell her how upsetting it is so she knows for the future.

[larrygrylls]

I can see why it is annoying and relaxing won't deal with real medical issues.

OTOH, I do know a couple who both had issues (mainly his low sperm count). They tried naturally for a couple of years and then had 3-4 cycles of IVF. When they finally gave up about a year later, they had 2 naturally within two years, which he ascribes to being relaxed.

I don't know what the research says one way or the other, though.

[hunreeeal]

For every one person who gets pregnant the month they "relax" (which statistically will happen sometimes) there will be many, many others who also relax but don't get pregnant.

[beluga425]

My faves were:
"IVF? God you never do things the simple way do you!"

and a close second from a heavily pregnant 'friend':
"People with fertility problems are just selfish, they should accept that's just life. Some people have children others don't."

and after dc1, a large number of people saying, your body will know what to do now. You'll find it easy to get pregnant..."

The worst by far has to be the woman who did a scan a few years ago who said in a bored deadpan voice "we'll, it's all there, just doesn't really work that's all does it, just have to accept it really"

[Tailtwister1]

YANBU. In the end I just had to be outright rude to people and their 'well meaning' advice. It's so patronising and borne out of complete and utter ignorance.

[Kewcumber]

ikea - you might believe that relaxing helped but it was more likely luck.

Do you believe everyone on here who has had significant fertility issues when they say how annoying it is to be told to just "relax" or will you still persist in saying it to people? Just out of interest. Given that not one person has said "Yes you;re quite right, that's really good advice in fact my failure to get pregnant is my fault because I'm not relaxed enough".

And nearly having IVF doesn't actually give you much insight into the pit of hell that failed IVF is.

[hunreeeal]

Everyone asks "why don't you just adopt?" too, as if it's that easy. If they're interested in adoption why haven't they done it themselves?

[runningforme]

I've been the pregnant friend when one close friend was suffering miscarriages (2 whilst I was pregnant) and another was going through (unsuccessful) IVF. I didn't know what to say (I never said that though), I just know that I felt incredibly guilty every time I was with either of them, and felt like I couldn't share anything about my pregnancy. I think no matter what you say, it could come across as ignorant/offensive because the person you are dealing with is in a very fraught and emotional state and you are seen to be the 'lucky' one.

[ikeaismylocal]

How do you know it was the relaxing and not the skiing?

I thought it was possibly the skiing, all that hip swaying I imagined had helped the embryo implant.

No skiing with pregnancy #2 though.

ikea - please don't tell me you give people whom you know to be going through IVF that advice.

I tell them my story and that I believe it was the relaxation and total lack of hope for that cycle that helped me get pregnant.

There is research that shows that if you watch comedy programs and laugh whilst undergoing IVF the chances of success are greater. I have sent a friend going through IVF a funny YouTube clip each day until testing day ( with her consent) she said it felt nice to do something fun that could be helping her chances even in a tiny way. She now has twin dds.

[namechangesforthehardstuff]

It's inevitable isn't it? You start a thread like this and some daft twat one has to turn up and say 'Oh I have loads of kids and no problems conceiving at all now and all it took was a trip to Val d'isere. Marvellous isn't it?'

[AcrossthePond55]

If someone can't offer sound medical advice, then they're better off just saying 'I'm sorry you have to go through this, is there anything I can do to help you feel better about what you're going through?'. There probably isn't, since I'd guess that infertility is a lonely road to travel.

[larrygrylls]

The below was the only reputable research conclusion that I could find on the subject.

Having said that, being told to relax is hardly going to help you relax! It is one of those annoying things.


europepmc.org/articles/PMC2975045/reload=0;jsessionid=FQAIhdqe2lNmnKatdw9D.12

"Conclusions

Stress significantly reduced the probability of conception each day during the fertile window, possibly exerting its effect through the sympathetic medullar pathway.

Keywords: alpha amylase, conception, cortisol, fecundity, fertile window, stress"

[Glasshammer]

I think it'd gone to offer advice I've people actually have proper knowledge. However most people don't and they just talk crap

[Tailtwister1]

Everyone asks "why don't you just adopt?" too, as if it's that easy.

Ah yes, the old 'just adopt' card. Apart from the fact that it isn't easy, I find it offensive that people assume the default for those who are dealing with infertility should be adoption. I believe that adopting should be something you want to do, not just because you can't have your own biological children. Not everyone is suited to adopting either. That's not to say that infertile couples shouldn't adopt, but it shouldn't be assumed that it's the way to go.

[OddFodd]

I agree with you entirely. Having said that, I do know several people who had totally given up on TTC (about to start 3rd round of IVF or going through the adoption process) who conceived naturally. But I don't think you can just shrug your shoulders and achieve inner peace with infertility and bingo you're pregnant.

On the whole, there is nothing more irritating than someone who does something easily that you find difficult (whatever it may be) giving advice because they haven't actually had to try. And have no concept of the emotional cost.

[HadABadDay2014]

When a friend was going through ivf all I said was good luck and hope it works.

I doubt relaxing would have helped when clomid and something like ivf IUI ( not sure if that's right)

[Kewcumber]

I tell them my story and that I believe it was the relaxation and total lack of hope for that cycle that helped me get pregnant.

DS believes that the tooth fairy brings him money for his teeth. Doesn't make it true though.

High stress levels can reduce fertility but doesn't (from memory) have much effect on artificially stimulated ovaries during IVF and to be honest even if it has a small effect, its still a mindnumbingly insensitive and pointless thing to say to someone who has been ttc for years unsuccessfully. Especially when you are pregnant or cuddling your squidgey new baby.

[HarderToKidnap]

Didn't you know? Relaxing cures all sorts of medical problems. Cancer....relax!!! MS.....just relaaaaaax, go on hollibobs and your MS will just clear up!! Thyroid problems? Buy some dirty lingerie and you can dump the thyroxine!!

Oh no, sorry, the only medical problem relaxing "cures" is infertility. According, of course, to idiots.

[Kewcumber]

there has been research done that says many people who have IVF would actually have gone on to get pregnant if they had just continued trying without intervention and that there should in fact be a longer period of trying before referral to fertility clinics (except where age is a factor) but we (as a society) are not prepared to try for year after year after year on the whole.

So those who get pregnant whilst waiting for IVF to start are probably just one of the inevitable numbers who would have got pregnant eventually even without IVF.

[VeggySausage]

ha ha yeah, I just needed to relax too (the fact that my ovaries were covered in cysts and I didn't menstruate had nothing to do with my infertility!)