To think this wasn't offensive?

[CasioBlues]

I work in an office, and after meetings, there are often spare sandwiches that are offered around.

I work in one group. A group of people of a similar level, all friends, were talking today and someone mentioned these sandwiches were brought to their group by a female member of staff, and also friend. A friend in another group mentioned sandwiches also came around to their group by a female member of staff.

A male friend in my group quipped about the member of staff who brings them around "what a slag!". A few of us laughed, one friend found it really offensive.

I think among friends, it was obviously a joke on the "promiscuity" of sandwiches, but I'm prepared to admit I was wrong to think it wasn't offensive. It wasn't very professional, but among friends?

I bet you aren't academics at the London School of Comedy.

YANBU I would find that funny but, then I'm told I have a sick sense of humour.

I am struggling to find any humour in this man's comments whatsoever, or any relevance/connection between being a 'slag' and the distribution of sandwiches. To say I am bewildered about this apparent 'joke' is an understatement.

But anyway, I detest the word slag and in my experience the sort of people who use it are usually both deeply unpleasant and thick as mince. Not only was this a totally crap 'joke' but it was inappropriate and offensive, especially in the workplace.

But if you really must insult a woman for whatever reason (even as a joke) then there are far more eloquent and clever ways of doing it.

Slag is such a vulgar, cheap, downmarket little word used by vulgar downmarket little people with no style.

Some times jokes are just jokes, they are not veiled sexually aggressive put downs

It's precisely because this type of "joke" has been culturally acceptable that makes it damaging. It's continuing to normalise, at some level, the concept that women - because the term is, or historically was, almost exclusively used pejoratively about women - who have multiple sexual partners are slags. The entire "joke" is predicated on the fact you could - and were mentally being invited to - replace the word "sandwiches" with "sexual favours" because of the common understanding of the word "slag".

If there were a genuinely gender-neutral, non-pejorative term which had common accepted usage to mean "one (of either sex) who has multiple sexual partners" as a factual descriptor with no value judgement attached - say "bodkin" - then a comment such as "What? Helen/Henry handed out sandwiches to Finance as well as us? What a bodkin!" would be mildly amusing and inoffensive. But there isn't, and so it wasn't. Perpetuating, and therefore legitimising, use of the words which do exist, which have been used exclusively to insult, oppress and belittle women, in a so-called humorous context isn't funny. It doesn't matter that there was no "aggressive" intent, or that "everyone knew what he meant". The casual acceptance that "slag = woman who sleeps around = bad woman" continues, and women continue to be judged on their sexual continence or otherwise.

And I've never set foot on the Feminism boards, I don't have a first degree let alone a PHD, I have a fully operational sense of humour - but this is so self-evident to me that I am staggered the OP can't seem to see it.

I will agree with the OP that the word slag is often used in a gender neutral way these days; I have heard very promiscuous men being called slags many times, although usually in a jokey, eye rolly way. That's the difference I suppose, when it's said to a woman it's said with disgust and contempt.

But it doesn't change my position that

a) it's a horrible word

b) it was a crap joke

I get the joke. I wouldn't have found it particularly funny, but not offensive either.

In my experience and where I live slag is used to describe both men and women

I think it would be OK if the response to the fairly feeble 'joke' was something along the lines of "and you ate them all up, what a tosser/douche/bastard !" because then it suggests that your group are all into off colour banter. Not very professional but can be quite enjoyable so long as it really is equal opportunity, carries quite a high risk of someone being seriously offended though. If that sort of response would not be considered OK then you really need to think about why anyone laughed when their friend was insulted behind their back for doing something nice.

I've worked in bantery sorts of workplaces and don't think that calling someone a slag/slut is ever acceptable, not quite so bad if it's a guy who is insulted, but they are very loaded words better avoided. the sort of banter I'd expect would be much more along the lines of 'I thought we were special' (ie self depreciating rather than aggressive).

Op I get the joke, it is the sort of joke that would be said in our office and would have raised a laugh.

Agree with select.

Do any of the make members if staff bring sandwiches to meetings? Or do all the females in the office just take it in turn to feed the menfolk?

"In my experience and where I live slag is used to describe both men and women"

Really? In my experience and where I live, I'm glad to say it's not used to describe anyone.

Honestly, women do 't actually have to fall over themselves to prove how "cool" they are by laughing at every off colour "joke" men choose to make. It's OK not to!

I would have found the joke quite funny. And if it was made about a man (yes, using the word 'slag'!) it would still have made sense to me and I'd still have found it funny.

And the very mundane nature of bringing around sandwiches being described with quite a harsh word is a big element of the whole humour of it - so for a person to then take offence at the word suggests to me they're not paying attention, or... I don't know. Perhaps are determined to take offence, perhaps aren't good with subtleties of humour?

Humour is subjective but not liking or really understanding a joke doesn't make it offensive.

Wow. Not funny at all. I really don't see how her marital status was relevant although at least you have said that yourself. I like the jew analogy. Perfect example of how it isn't funny. And using pen thief as something similar doesn't work as that isn't specific to a group of people either by race or gender.

I don't mind the odd near the knuckle joke but it depends on context/environment. A work place like that would not be appropriate. I have challenged people who make sexist/racist/homophobic jokes as they are just not funny.

Very offensive, and YABVU.

OP I'm stunned by your spectacular obliviousness.

I would have laughed. I have heard men called extreme names, too, in similar gags where the point of humour is that it is so extreme as to be mental, applied casually to a mundane thing. It is important to the structure of many jokes to suddenly confound your expectations, which this does - and the more brief and snappy that is, the more you will laugh even if it isn't hilarious.

I think when people are mercilessly humourless and judgy about idle jokes in the name of a "cause" they gradually engender little bits of unspoken mistrust or skepticism in people about that cause, so if you feel very strongly about something I would beware the hidden cost of going to town on those who are having a joke.

I do think that people are missing an important point about jokes.

They are meant to be funny. Even if you don't mind about the use of words, this is just not funny!

When you say "just not funny", you seem to be saying it is objectively unfunny, just not funny to everyone.

I'm assuming that isn't what you mean, that would be silly.

I've worked in offices where " banter" is usual but I have never been called a slag and would take issue with anyone using that word.
I wouldn't be happy even if my closest friend used it to me - they never would though.
It's quite a strong word to me and inappropriate to call anyone.

Nope. Some things are objectively not funny.

slag is gender neutral?!?!?!?

There aren't enough smilies in the world...

Sometimes the collective pofaced, finger wagginess of this place makes me weep tears of joyless tedium.

You're seriously suggesting that slag is a gender neutral term?

I really hope you're not one of the teaching staff.