to think the OW is also to blame?

[HunterWellies]

Until fairly recently I have always thought that if a dp leaves his family for an OW that the responsibility for that lies just with him.

He is the one with a commitment that he has decided to break to be with the OW. She might be free of any prior commitment and in a position to start a relationship.

But if starting that new relationship means breaking apart a young family, and the OW knows that, should she also carry some of the responsibility? I am beginning to think that she should. Aibu?

[LouiseAderyn]

Lying I would use the word skanky to describe a man as well as a woman.

To clarify to the poster who said about women being in the workplace more now and therefore you couldn't not have coffee.(Sorry, cant remember your exact words and I am on my phone snd cant scroll back) I don't think the problem is with having coffee etc with people of the opposite sex. It's more about when you want to have coffee with one specific person more than anyone else and start investing emotionally and sharing in a way that takes something almost indefinable away from your relationship with your partner. That's when you are starting to cross a boundary, even though you haven't technically done anything 'wrong'.
It is at that point where a choice is made. It's when it is starting to become something more than two mates having a drink.

[MothratheMighty]

Then perhaps the wife/partner is also to blame, for not making more of an effort to keep her man?
That's how my grandmother would have seen it, that a wife should be clean and tidy with her face made up, a welcoming smile for her breadwinner, dinner on the table and no right to say no to sex.
My relationship doesn't work like that. If OH chose to have an affair, he'd be out of my life. No trust, no marriage.

[HunterWellies]

A lot of people saying that the OW may not be to blame as such, but that have acted very badly.

You could argue that there is such a very fine line between the two, it's essentially the same thing, no?

You can't behave that badly but still come off blame free, can you?

[MothratheMighty]

Grandma was also a jealous woman and saw the entire village as populated by predatory women willing to try and snatch her man.

[Notify]

IME most OW are married themselves.

I disagree that "it's not hard to say no you're married" Once real emotions are involved it can be very hard indeed. The popular image of the philandering husband out to get it wherever he can and the hard uncaring ow is rare IME. They are far more often with grid people who made poor decision early on and are now in deep with something they can't control. They are very aware of the hurt they cause and it makes them miserable but si does the prospect of stopping.

None if this happens overnight but builds up gradually with contact becoming more often and intimate so their idea of what's "normal" or right becomes blurred.

[JoinYourPlayfellows]

They are very aware of the hurt they cause and it makes them miserable but so does the prospect of stopping.

I have to say that I have approximately zero sympathy with someone who feels "miserable" at the thought of the devastation they are freely choosing to inflict on the people they should care most for in the world, including their own small children.

And I have even less sympathy for their "misery" at having to stop enjoying themselves and indulging themselves in their affair because they might actually be required to act like a decent human.

I don't know what at "good person" is, but if behaviour defines character, at the time you are behaving in such a wantonly cruel way entirely for your own enjoyment you are anything but a good person.

And no amount of handwringing and fake guilt (because if it was really your conscience talking, you'd stop) speaks any better of you. It just makes you sound like even more of a self-justifying asshole.

[MothratheMighty]

But what if they didn't knooooowwww.

Is she to blame for not checking him for microchips and rings and eartags?

[LouiseAderyn]

If you dont know that the man you are seeing is married because he has lied to you and said he was single, then you are not really an 'ow' - you are a victim of his duplicitous behaviour, just as his wife is.

[MollyHooper]

I disagree that "it's not hard to say no you're married" Once real emotions are involved it can be very hard indeed.

So don't get emotionally involved with someone who is married.

We all have choices and we all have control over what we choose to do.

'Things just got out of control' is nothing more than an excuse, a bad one at that.

[HavantGuard]

The 'other woman is an unpleasant, selfish person. They can't be responsible for breaking up a marriage or a family though, as that is an agreement between two people. Only one or both of those people can break it.

[JanineStHubbins]

But children are upset/miserable/hurt/devastated by parents splitting up whatever the reason. Should unhappily married people stay married forever, for fear of freely choosing to inflict misery on their children?

[MothratheMighty]

Louise, back to not shagging someone unless you know them quite well then.

[HunterWellies]

Oh no Mothra, if she didn't know, then she didn't know. What she does when she finds out is another matter.

Why any woman would want to be with a man who can obviously lie so well is a bit beyond me. The fact that they are the type to have an affair would put me off tbh, and if they were willing to leave their children I don't think that would entice me a great deal either. It doesn't exactly say a lot for them does it?

[badbaldingballerina123]

I don't really buy the view that the ow , or om made no vows to us and therefore owes us nothing.

The burglar , the bully , the crazy in laws , the drunk driver , all these people didn't make vows to us , yet we hold them accountable for the harm they do .

[MollyHooper]

There is nothing wrong with casual sex Mothra.

IMO if the guy lied about being married then it's all on him. It's the people who knowingly do it who are morally corrupt.

[HappyMummyOfOne]

The person breaking the vows is to blame, be it male or female. Lots of women have affairs too.

I think the other person involved is selfish, has no morals and quite frankly daft if they believe they wont have the same done to them but i dont think they are to blame. The person who strayed is.

[MorrisZapp]

No, the OW is not to blame. I understand the need for betrayed spouses to react with anger, I would too. And I may have had some harsh words to say about OWs my friends have found out about. But objectively speaking, no, of course they are not to blame.

The presence of young children just makes the cheater more of a shit imo.

[1stworldissue]

I think that while the commitment and promises are broken by the married one, the other person is still a morally bankrupt twat. I would have a lack of respect for anyone I know that started a relationship as the OW / OM.

Think of it like stealing, if a bank clerk was nicking from the company and someone was accepting that money, laundering it for them and aiding them in the theft. Would only the employed be breaking the law or both?

Same moralities involved.

[HunterWellies]

Good point Ballerina

[cerealqueen]

I have a friend who had an affair with a married man, whose wife then tried to commit suicide. No kids, as far as I know. She didn't see it had anything to do with her. She then went on to have an affair with a married man with kids. I was very judgemental when she told me, she just said she wasn't the one with a family, it was his issue. He'd come to her social events and be bringing her lingerie.

She always needs male attention, and doesn't care how she gets it. She knew the marital status. I told her she was trampling over the feelings of other people to get what she wanted / needed. We were at a funeral once and she was all over a married man she used to date when he was single. I've given up saying anything now. I now feel sorry for her as 20 years on and approaching 50, she is still seeking that male attention.

[Notify]

Am loving all the smug "not me, of course i would never do such a thing" when we know that the majority (yes ,majority) will at sometime in their lives

[LouiseAderyn]

The burglar/bully etc have harmed you, but in an affair it would be your husband/wife who has harmed you.

[OddFodd]

No it isn't a good point. Drunk drivers and burglars don't seek and gain permission of other road users/homeowners before they smash and grab.

We are all presented with temptation throughout our lives. It's the mark of an adult to have the ability to walk away from temptation. Otherwise we'd all be dribbling alcoholics and smackheads.

The only person responsible for being unfaithful is the person who's doing it.

[MollyHooper]

Is it really smug to say you would never get involved with a married man/woman?

Honestly Notify the way you talk it's like people have no choice in the matter.

Everyone does.

[LouiseAderyn]

I think a lot of people would do it until they see first hand or experience the utter devastation it causes. Then I think a person would have to be pretty cold to do it again.

I think a sensible person would avoid it from a self preservation instinct. A man who can coldly lie to and disregard his wife and the security of hus children isn't a good bet, really.