To think that you should not bring a lunch box into a cafe

[Chocolateandcrisps]

There is a lovely cafe in a church which we visit often. There is a little play area which my ds loves and reasonably priced lunches, cakes and a sandwich lunch deal for the kids.

Last week two people walked in with their kids, who were about 3 years old, ordered coffees for themselves and brought out a lunch box for the kids. They did not order cake, lunch etc for themselves - just coffee.

I have given my ds rice cakes, water from cup, snacks in cafes before but never taken out a lunch box.

Am I being unreasonable / judgy to think that you should not bring a lunch box into a cafe for your kids?

Yes that's true, there are machines too I guess, I always clear up every bit of it though and often buy her a nice cream for pudding.

I do think it's difficult to say that quavers out of your handbag are ok but snacks from a box are a no no.

I think baby food is fine if they don't sell it. But always polite to ask.

In a cafe you are paying for a service so why should cafe workers have to clean up after messy toddlers when they haven't bought food there.

If you are desperate for a coffee then buy your toddler something as well.

Always get them a free glass of water to go with it.

Um, in my case, no covered shopping area here, and no car. I'll organise to never be out over a mealtime then? Erm, nope. Not going to happen as I'm reliant on public transport and due to my own physical disabilities, my walking speed is around 1/3 that of normal too...

If the cafe owner had an issue with it, I'm quite sure she'd say, seeing as our group is on first name terms, and the other local cafés have no qualms about protesting. She's coeliac, and fully understands the difficulties of restricted diets. She was also the first cafe proprietor in our town to cater for coeliacs.

She doesn't have a problem, why do you?!

Caitlin - am into allowed to decide not to give my custom to a business whose principles I disagree with? I don't buy nestle products either - am I wrong for that too?

Ledkr... I don't know what the answer is, I think that many cafes are quite happy to warm up jars and, if they don't sell them, it's fine to feed. I'd probably ask though because I'm very buttoned up like that.

I'd say that if the establishment sells whatever it is you're about to give to your child out of your bag, it's the wrong thing to do. That would be my benchmark. If they sell it - buy it from them and keep the duplicate for another time, another place.

Limara... I'd pay ££££ for a can of 'Green Summer'.... oh how I loved that one!

Caitlin Limara your repetition of "it's not against the law" is wearisome and irrelevant.

Then why respond to it? It's my opinion of which I am allowed.

Lying, pretty much my benchmark too. I'd be over the moon if there actually EXISTED a cafe that could cater for my DS3, so that I don't HAVE to fart around preparing a flipping lunchbox EVERY BLOODY TIME I LEAVE THE HOUSE.

If they sold food for him to eat, the lunchbox wouldn't be opened. But they don't. So I WILL feed him. I'm not going to sit there eating a panini and a slice of cake in front of my barely-verbal 3yo with ASD whilst saying to him that he has to eat before lunchtime or after, am I?!

It's a omit point in the summer, as it's fine to sit in the open and feed him, whilst eating something I've bought for myself, and costs me far less too, but I put up with paying for something for myself in a cafe when it's pissing down because I'm not about to make him eat in the freezing cold rain.

And yes, the cafe does get repeat business, plus business from all our friends that DON'T have DC's with allergies too, because we are happy to tell everyone how wonderful the service is in that cafe. The foods bloody lush too!

Omit = moot.

Couthy, you're obviously one of the few people on this thread who has a genuine need to do what you're doing; I don't think anyone would have a issue with it, given your circumstances.
But you've got to admit, some of the nonsense posted here is outrageously cheeky.

People bringing sandwiches into Costa because they're cheaper in the supermarket; people announcing that they've brought their own because the cafe's selection is so rubbish (to the cafe manager!),
so many people not understanding that the cafe owner is working for a living like the rest of us, not providing a warm, comfortable refuge from the cold weather (complete with free newspapers) for people to eat their lunch in because it's handier than simply going home.

Floggingmolly I agree with all that you said.

Couthy has a good reason.

Couthy your case is entirely different.

We are skint beyond belief. Right now, we are in a self-catering cottage run by a charity on half-term. My son has ADHD and he is hard work but no allergies. Would not dream of turning up in a café and pulling out a lunchbox. If I can't afford to buy food for him in there we don't take him . If we can't afford food and drink both then we go after he has eaten and enjoy beverages and go on our way. DD2 saved up her pocket money to go to a café with me and have a slice of cake AND a pot of tea for me and a milky tea for her.

This economy is fragile and relies on tourism, we try to do the best we can to be a part of that.

Same as at home, we try to support our local places as much as we can.

Oh, I agree that some of the responses on this thread are staggeringly cheeky - if I could buy something for DS3 in a cafe, I would actually prefer to, because I'm inherently lazy and I hate making up lunchboxes! As I said up thread, it pisses me off that because of the actions of a few, there are now hardly any cafés I can go into with my DS3. It's people that WILL take food into cafés without a genuine medical need to that fuck things up for those of us that do.

I don't know why I care, because none of the cafes we go to do, so it shouldn't matter - but do we pass the mumsnet test of 'cheeky and entitled' or 'obviously I your circumstances it's ok'?

Well, I will carry on bringing out lunchboxes in cafes, and those of you who object, I consider rude.

We don't eat out often. When we do, we try to pick somewhere that does safe gluten-free food (just saying that they do gf food isn't enough, we have to be certain that it there is minimal risk of cross-contamination)

Sometimes, there isn't anywhere that offers what we need - typically when we're on an full day outing to a kid-friendly place (zoo, museum, stately home type thing), and the weather isn't warm enough. Or it offers just one thing, like a piece of cake, which isn't enough for a child's meal.

In that case, we buy food for the non-coeliac adults and break out the lunchboxes for the coeliac kids. Usually we ask if it's okay first. Occasionally we just get on with it. I buy the kids drinks if there is something suitable, like milk or apple juic, although usually they just want water to drink anyway and the extra drink doesn't get drunk - but i see it as 'tax' for the seat so that's okay.

Ironically, one place we always break out lunch/snackboxes is the cafe at our local hospital - hospitals seem to be dreadful for gf food. I hope that the DC never need to be hospitalised in an emergency when they're older.

Ridiculous to say, as several posters have, that you should not go out over a mealtime if you have dietary requirements!

My DD doesn't have any specific dietry requirements - but if i want to take a pack lunch into a cafe then i will. They can then be grateful that i have given them my custom and bought coffee and drinks in there. I don't do this very often but if we are on a day out somewhere we may well take a picnic to help keep costs down, therefore leaving money left over for a nice cup of coffee as a treat. Would they rather i not go and buy the coffee then? I'll go, have my coffee,have my picnic and leave - i wont go in there with DC and a group of other mothers, buy a cup of coffee and sit there for three hours letting the children run riot ignore them while they piss everyone else off

I'm an adult coeliac. I go places to eat that stock gluten free food. There are an increasing number these days. It just sometimes requires a little thinking ahead, but not much. I wouldn't take a packed lunch, but organise myself so I can eat, without needing to do this.
Spending £2 on a drink is not doing a cafe a favour that they should be grateful for, not does it entitle you to behave in whatever way you want. Again, it is akin to going to a non smokers house and lighting up inside their home, without asking. Disrespectful.
It is your choice of course to behave in a disrespectful way. Recognise it as such though. If you don't care about showing respect, that's down to you.

buy the coffee to take away, LEM. Or take coffee in a flask to the picnic.

Would you take your own wine to a pub? Say a friend wanted to go for a couple of pints but you wanted to keep costs down so you nip into Tesco and get a £5 bottle of wine and take that into the pub, and expect them to be grateful that your mate is buying their drinks there and they can fuck off to expect you to fork out for their wine?

No difference at all.

Couthy - your situation is entirely different.

Errr, it absolutely IS different. I often go to the cafe and just have coffee, i wouldn't go to a restuarant and have just drinks, so would not expect to take a lunch box into a resturant. Now you are right, i could take a flask of coffee but i like nice coffee, a nice coffee in costa for instance (ok a bit of an oxymoron there) would be what? £3? dd might have a smoothie - another £2.50? maybe i would be with a friend or my DP, so thats another £3. So thats £8.50 spent - im sure the coffee shop will be happy with that. Flask of shite coffee = no money spent in coffee shop, no picnic = no lunch. I wouldn't go to the coffee shop for the sake of going to the coffee shop, so to meet friends and take a lunch-box, i would only do this on a day out. Also, if i have lunch for DD and myself that means i'll have my coffee, sit down, eat, piss off oooh, in about half an hour tops (i drink coffee slowly, it cant be too hot) , freeing up the table for the next customer to spend THEIR £8. So in that hour that table has earnt £16-£20 assuming that customer only has cofee (that is allowed isn't it). Had i have to wait for their manky panini, thats ten minutes (on a good day) and then waited for it not to be radioactive - (another 20 minutes!) bearing in mind that mark up on food is no-where near what it is on drinks, thats not so much profit for the cafe - so its economic sense to allow lunch boxes especially as i have no will-power and will probably end up buying cake as well I am donig the cafe a favour!

I have also done EXACTLY that with wine on holidays. We often go to haven type holidays. They serve SHIT beer and wine and charge through the nose for it - i do not want to pay £5 for a glass of vin-de-crap or £4 for a pint of gnats piss, i like decent beer so will often take a couple of bottles of newky brown in my bag when we go to enjoy tolerate the children's entertainment. (i suspect that probably IS taking the piss but they could always serve decent drinks at a reasonble price).

Mrs Oakenshield, good example. Weaning babies and complex dietary requirements aside, the taking of a lunchbox is exactly like your pub example.

There are things we all can't afford. They are luxuries. There is no crisis if we go without them sometimes. The attitude of we are all entitled to drink coffee in cafes, to have holidays abroad or to have other luxuries we cannot afford is a nonsense. I cannot always afford to have lunch in a cafe. So I simply have it at home or just have a coffee and drinks for the children instead. It is not the fault of the cafe owner, not his/her job to provide me with a picnic space.

Hence, the signs going up more and more, 'No food not bought on premises. 2 hour time limit.'

Lem why don't you ask the cafe owner then if it is ok for you all to eat your lunchboxes at the table because you are paying a few quid for a coffee and drinks?

It's clear why you wouldn't- because they would drop their mouths in incredulity at the cheekiness of adults buying the cheapest thing on the menu and sitting their with their pre-prepared lunch!

That is entirely different than asking if one child out of a whole family could eat his lunchbox as he has a life-threatening allergy, which I'm pretty sure most cafes in the land would be sympathetic to.

I also know, because I've seen my friend do it, that often the people who whip out the lunchboxes for their children then eat lots out of them themselves, thereby also making sure they don't have to pay out anything. It's so embarrassing to be around this type of behaviour.

If I wanted just a coffee I would have a coffee and then leave and eat the picnic in the park, on a bench or if rainy, in the car. Isn't this what other's do? Of course it takes much longer if you all trough your lunchbox filled with home-made food and leaves more to clean up than if you just had a coffee. The friend I used to go out with would leave the table in a disgusting state covered in her own food (half eaten veggies, yoghurt and crisps everywhere), I would be mortified and trying to clean it up. I just don't go out with them any more as their values are all about trying to get something for nothing, and ignore the signs (which were up) saying only eat things bought here.

Perhaps I am too obedient!

I did write a long response but I give up - some people will just never get it, will they?

Mrs Oakenshield, I agree that there are people who genuinely don't get it. However, I think that many without the complex dietary needs/baby weaning issue do get it, but just don't care.

I think many do understand the cafe is there to sell food and that their behaviour is disrespectful, although they wont admit it and will justifybtheir actions with spurious arguments until they are blue in the face. It is just that they don't care about other people. They are thinking about themselves and their children and what they want and what is convenient to them. What is right, simply doesn't come into it.

I suspect that Couthy is responding because although, like me, she has reasons that people broadly accept as valid it can be astonishingly to read a thread like this where it feels as though people are looking at you from the outside thinking 'cheapskate, cheeky cow'.

I used to try to explain because our kids are already different enough without another thing suddenly seeming like a big sign we are flashing every time we go out.
I am lucky now though that I don't give a shit

It's two different conversations being carried out on one thread which always gets fraught.