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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Is my dad or my dh? And am I for even asking?

256 replies

inabitofadilemma · 03/02/2014 00:28

I'm in a bit of a dilemma.

Me and DH have been together for 14 years, two kids and one on the the way. We jointly own our house. Originally, we both put in savings of about 30,000 pounds as a down payment. We did well from selling and buying at the right time and renovating a run down house and took advantage of low interest rates and paid down the mortgage. My Dad gave us 40,000 pounds a few years ago to help with mortgage and renovations. Currently our house is worth about 400,000 and we have equity of 200,000.

My Dad is now wrapping up and selling his business so he can retire properly. He's done very very well out of the super high prime London prices because his business had some real estate there. As a result, he's offered to help us pay off the mortgage and upgrade our house because it'll be tight with the third child. Altogether he's offered to give us 350,000 pounds. This is, of course, a huge amount of money and will allow us to buy a bigger house mortgage free. I'm fully aware that this is very generous and we're incredibly lucky to be in this position.

However, he's stipulated a condition. Only my name on the house. He's willing to sign an agreement that DH can have 'his' share plus whatever it's appreciated in the event that we divorce (and if I die that it's in the name of the children as a trust) BUT the house MUST be in my name.

My Dad says that this is to protect me. He does actually really like DH, it's not like they've ever had any issues. They get on really well. But he says that things can change. His biggest fear is that we divorce (or I die), DH gets remarried and half of the money he gave to me ends up with another woman and her children.

DH is incredibly insulted by this especially because he always got on with my Dad. He says he will feel uncomfortable living in a home that's not his and he's very upset. We've never thought on these terms, always had a joint account and apart from the money my Dad gave us a few years ago, it's always been kind of even. DH works less than me and earns less but he's with the kids more so neither of us think of our money other than as joint money. We had a joint account before we even got married.

DH is kind of angry with me for not fighting his corner more. But I feel bad fighting with my Dad when he's about to help us out so much, I feel ungrateful doing so like some kind of spoilt brat. I totally get where DH is coming from but I also understand my Dad's reasoning. It's just how he is (he's lived with his partner for 20 years and in his will, he's very very clear about what she's entitled to and what she's not - and it's not much - in fact, I had to tell him to change it to leave her more!). My Dad is also helping my brother out in a similar way with a similar condition but they don't seem bothered by it.

So who is being unreasonable here? My Dad who is insisting that only my name is on the house? Or DH who feels hurt and insulted and thinks i should be fighting his corner more?

We could, of course, turn down my Dad's offer. We're also happy as we are, can make mortgage repayments and pay our bills just fine and carry on in our house, we'd just be a bit cramped. So it's not like we NEED this to just survive. But then i think that might be unfair to the DC because this is really THEIR money at the end of the day. And it's very hard to turn down the tempatation of a bigger house and being mortgage free.

OP posts:
kungfupannda · 04/02/2014 07:51

This is difficult. I understand your DH's feelings, but I also understand what your dad is trying to do.

My FIL holds similar views about "keeping it in the family." He doesn't have massive assets, and may actually leave very little in terms of inheritance, but he's comfortable and wants to make sure that his children and grandchildren are also comfortable.

He wants to work out a way by which his children can enjoy anything he leaves them, but preserve it for his grandchildren, without the risk of it passing out of the family by way of an in-law remarrying. I've been through this with him with my lawyer hat on, with no rancour or resentment, because I understand his motivation, and the particular reasons why he is so concerned about this. He has now accepted that there are limited options, and that he either leaves anything to his children and lets them make their own decisions, or he skips his children and leaves anything to his grandchildren.

DP and I are comfortable with whatever option he chooses, but another family member is very unhappy with the idea of being "cut out."

Could you all sit down and thrash it out?

VikingLady · 04/02/2014 07:55

Can he put it into your kids' names, in a trust with him/you as trustees?

MyNameIsKenAdams · 04/02/2014 07:58

The double standards on this site amaze me. Imagine...

"I get on with my MIL, but dont know what to do. She has offered DH and I 350k to take a step up the property ladder. However, she wants the house in DHs name only. I really thought we were close, yet she insists on this. DH says its incase I divorce him, or he dies and I remarry then otherpeople bwnefit from it. What do I do?"

Thered be an uproar. Family money, given without conditions blah blah.

Lifeisaboxofchocs · 04/02/2014 07:59

Your father is being insulting to your DH.

More importantly, your father is being ignorant.

In the event of a divorce, it will be considered in proceedings. Either shared equal, or relented in the settlement. Your DH will not lose out because in your name.

perfectstorm · 04/02/2014 08:02

I don't think there are tax implications on money gifts unless the parent dies within 7 years of making it, in which case inheritance tax kicks in, and the limits on cash value gifts per year kicks in, which is in the low thousands unless to a spouse iirc. One very good reason for parents to gift this sort of money while still alive, hale and hearty, if they are so inclined.

I don't think you have to pay income tax on money gifts made personally, though. It's not classed as a source of income by HMRC - or wasn't a decade ago, when I last had reason to check, at least.

Retrofairy · 04/02/2014 08:05

OP dont take the money. You already have a nice house you can afford. Why would you bring this disparity in to your relationship? Money is not everything. Ask your dad to create a trust for your children, that way his aim is achieved, his generous gift accepted and protected and your relationship is not soured.

Lifeisaboxofchocs · 04/02/2014 08:09

Relented should read, form part of the settlement

JustSpeakSense · 04/02/2014 08:12

I think your Dad is being very generous and practical. I think your DH is BU (although I completely understand how he would feel hurt) your DH needs to 'suck it up' for the sake of your family (and try not take it personally).

bumbumsmummy · 04/02/2014 08:12

This is a toughie and a lovely gesture from your father

I'd speak to your brother and see how he's dealing with it

Your DH on the other hand must be feeling hurt he thought he was friends with you father

It wouldn't be good for your marriage to accept the money as you would allow your father to drive a wedge of resentment between you

So the question is which do you value more money or your DH

diddl · 04/02/2014 08:12

I know nothing about it, but find it incredible that you can just hand over £350,000 tbh!

ExcuseTypos · 04/02/2014 08:12

I think your dad is being very unreasonable. You are married, have been for 14 years and have dc together. If he wants to give a gift then he should give it without any interference or conditions.

Anyway, as someone said upthread, if you divorced, I'm sure all assets would be split 50:50. (After a primary residence had been provided for the dc) I wonder if your Dad has actually had any legal advice himself, if he's suggesting what he is.

I think it's very sad that this has probably affected your DH's and Dad's relationship forever. Sad

following · 04/02/2014 08:14

i would not accept any money with conditions , how would you feel if it was the other way round and your name was not on the house , would you feel it was your home , i think your husband has every right to feel insulted ,you are married you share your life ,you have children together , but the house is only yours , does not sit right with me .

SolomanDaisy · 04/02/2014 08:20

I think your dad is being very sensible.

dollius · 04/02/2014 08:24

I'd be really upset if my PIL did this and I am pretty certain my DH would refuse the money. I actually think it is very controlling to give money yet try to retain control over what is done with it - recipe for a very toxic situation frankly. Also, to suggest the DH should not have his name on the deeds of a house that he has already payed a lot into is completely unreasonable. Another vote for refuse the money here.

Alanna1 · 04/02/2014 08:24

I'd suggest you sign a deed of trust, giving eg 80% to you and 20% to your DH. Or, could you and your DH buy a flat and share that w a mortgage, and you have the house?

dollius · 04/02/2014 08:26

Actually, the more I think about this, I would be bloody livid if my PIL suggested I should have my name removed from MY house. How interfering and controlling. It's the sort of think my parents would do, which is why we don't accept money from them, or even have much to do with them anymore. Poisonous.

Oriunda · 04/02/2014 08:30

I think your DH is being unreasonable here. Your DC's financial welfare is the most important thing and this protects them. Surely as a father that's what he should want? Sadly people do divorce, people do die. Totally within realms of possibility (obviously hope it doesn't) that you and DH divorce, or something happens to you and he remarries. New wife demands will in her name, your children get nothing. Happens all the time.

In Italy, when you marry you choose a type of treatment of assets in advance, and in DH's family all 3 brothers have opted for 'separation of assets'. This protects the family business from being potentially split with ex wives etc. Do I mind? Not at all. It protects the inheritance of our son.

Icansingarainbow · 04/02/2014 08:31

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

Bluegrass · 04/02/2014 08:37

I would be fucking furious if my in laws, or my own parents, tried to pull some "blood is thicker than water" shit and suggest something that would clearly drive a wedge between me and DP.

It is hugely manipulative to use wealth in this way, but unfortunately people with money seem to love using it in this way. If they want money to go directly to their own grandchildren there are ways of doing that, but not by dividing and conquering you and your DH, it's just horribly disrespectful to him.

Quinteszilla · 04/02/2014 08:39

Your dad is sensible.

He has been providing you with a lot of money. 14/20 years means that your dh could literally shaft you out of your home should he have an affair, or just have a midlife crisis, with no regards to your dads help and contributions. He would most likely be entitled to half, and be the one swanning away with a new woman (or buy you out) leaving you to care for your kids and paying minimum maintenance.

Your dad wants to protect you.

In your shoes I would be insulted by YOUR DH. If he really had no plans to walk, he would just have thought "fair enough" and acknowledged all the assets coming from your dad. He sounds greedy. Your dad must be so disappointed that he wont acknowledge his concerns, and acknowledge his vast and generous contributions.

WHY should your dh insist on owning half, if in reality it means nothing as you are solid?

Can you ask that the money is put into a rental property just for you, rather than blended with your marital home?

The rent could be counted as extra income, which will be counted in a mortgage on your new home?

CerealMom · 04/02/2014 08:44

Apologies if this has been mentioned up thread.

You can change the ownership of your house to tenants in common. This would mean both of you still own the house (and names on deeds) but each of you would own a different proportion of the house.

So you would need to work out the % of money each of you have brought to the house and go from there.

This protects you and your DH with regards to assets.

Don't forget to adjust your will re. staying on in the house until death (you or your DH) or until DC age when you can sell house and divide assets.

Quinteszilla · 04/02/2014 08:44

£350k can buy you one or two rental flats in your name that can provide income for you, and become homes for your dc in future, or sold at a profit.

Your dad has contributed 40k, you 30k and your dh 30 k, to your marital home, but you and your dh have £100k each in equity...
He has done very well out of you and your wealthy family.

He should be as keen as you to protect the financial interest of his children.

Oriunda · 04/02/2014 08:49

I agree that perhaps buying a £350k property (or 2 flats) as buy to let's, written in trust in your childrens's names, with you as trustee, is perhaps the way to go here.

Alternatively, a life policy for a similar amount, again written in trust in favour of your children. That's what I'm doing for DS. It takes it out of inheritance tax too but again you need to take advice.

NotNewButNameChanged · 04/02/2014 08:50

Agreeing with the others who mention double standards. I do not believe for one moment so many of you would be happy with this if the roles and genders were reversed.

While I can understand a DF wanting to support and help his daughter, I think it is divisive and damaging to family relationships and I quite understand why your DH is so upset. I would be in his shoes.

Never, ever accept money with strings. Ever. It can cause so many problems. It already is before it has been accepted.

Your father would be better off investing the money in a trust fund that, on his death, could be split how he wants it to who he wants it, or, should the worst happen and you and your DH did split up, he can simply cash it in, buy you and the kids a property.

kawaii · 04/02/2014 08:51

Your dad is completely in the right. If I was in his position I would lay down the same conditions. You DH should think about it from a parent's point of view and then be grateful he will get to live above his income level! Maybe even say thank you to your father for such a generous offer.

I'd be very annoyed with my DP for reacting like this actually, it seems very macho and ungrateful.