AIBU to carry on evangalising about electronic cigarettes? (Part 3).

[magimedi]

This is now our third thread.

Thread 2 is here - with lots of useful information:

www.mumsnet.com/Talk/am_i_being_unreasonable/1912752-AIBU-to-STILL-feel-positively-evangelical-about-electronic-cigarettes-thread-2?pg=1

But... will our web-based suppliers stop selling? I mean, you can get all sorts on the internet.

Or will I have to sidle up to the local weed dealer in the alley in order to score peach-flavoured "gear"?

I have suffered for that - read every one of those 111 pages in 2 sittings (though I did only skim the bits that were specifically to do with other stuff like herbals).

Pretty rank crap much of it, appalling quality & unfit for publication, spouting a mix of urban myths & fears that there's a chance that maybe one day something may be found to be possibly very slightly detrimental if they legislate & study the subject (at the expense of the manufacturers & importers) enough. All the controls type legislation biased towards the big players (read existing tobacco companies in the main part).

Total drivel most of it, e-cigs will be controlled tighter than real cigs at this rate - e.g. no limit to how many fags I can buy at the supermarket, but limits on how much e-liquid I can get (sigh)

Not that I buy weed on the internet or even know where to get it elsewhere

Ledare they will be breaking EU law if they sell anything that doesn't comply with the regulations. So the bigger web based suppliers, those who import ready made and labelled/tested/approved stuff should be OK. Those who can't afford to comply with all the very strict labelling, reporting & compliance measures will just have to stop.

The way I read it countries will have 30 months to enact the legislation, but I think the uk will introduce it much sooner, given the anti e-cig mps we have.

Can someone write a kind of basic letter which we can c&p and personalise? I'm really sorry to ask but I've got a horribly busy week, and shouldn't be on here at all at the moment, let alone doing the reading necessary.

2 weeks, no fags! Spent yesterday with my smoking pals and not even tempted......Laughed, when I was asked for a lighter.

Currentl using eGo clearomisers. What's the advantage of going for rebuildy/twiddly other types?

And, am using 18ml atm, is it too soon to lower my nicotine levels?

Oh I see. I would like a basic letter as well if possible.

Peri that's marvellous - well done!

You might like a twist / spinner battery and GS-H2 clearos for a better vape.

The nicotine level is entirely up to you.

Well done Peri . I'm coming up for 2 weeks now too though I was doing the slow reduction thing over a month or so before that.

It might be worth getting some 12mg liquid & alternating it throughout the day or mixing it with the 18mg you have, to reduce slowly & see how you get on with lower levels? In agreement with Ledare, a decent variable voltage like a spinner or twist is nice, and I'm much preferring the vape I get from the GS-H2s compared to the CE4s/CE5s.

Well done, Peri I am nearly 18 months in without a fag - it took me a couple of months to go from 18 to 12.

Of course the real reason for all this ridiculous e cig legislation is that governments are crapping themselves about how much £SD they are going to lose when people stop smoking & their tax revenuse from fags vanishes. Two faced wank twats!

Right, so we will still be able to order from say, fasttech if these laws were enacted?

May stockpile a few necessities over the coming months. This stuff is outrageous. Also going to get in touch with local mps.

As far as stockpiling goes, I'm thinking;

A couple of spinners/ego twists OR itaste vv v3s as they don't cost much more on their own.

Iclear 16clearos from fast tech and the ingrediants to make my own liquid and coils (and learn to fix one up).

I fucking hate the government more than usual right now.

Fuck, just looked up the taxes paid on a packet of fags....£6.17......
£12 billion annually to the Treasury WTF?

Am not buying new batteries as I've just got these, but will try the GS-H2s next. Am I right in thinking that the CE4's need replacing after 2/3 weeks????

I would guess that there will still be a reasonable choice of batteries & clearos around, just not as much variety & probably cost a fair bit more as they would all have to be "approved" as safe which will be a long winded and expensive procedure for the manufacturers/importers. I can see the majority of small suppliers going under. It will seriously damage the "mods" industry too, the same way type approval laws did for certain types of car accessories.

Liquid is the real biggie here. The restrictions on the strengths that can be sold, the packaging sizes, other aspects of packaging e.g. safety (well beyond that of some much more dangerous products), labelling, the option for our GB government to restrict flavourings, and again the approvals process are the main ones.

Peri depends very much on the individual CE4 - I have a couple that have been in use about a month, including the ones that have my most vaped flavours in (about 70% & 20% respectively). But I had another from the same batch that I started to get that sort of burnt taste with after a couple of weeks. Heavy vaper, as I was a heavy smoker before.

Oh and re taxes - every time it has been calculated, the tax take on tobacco products has been significantly higher than the worst case estimates of the cost of smoking to the NHS. And this included fiddles like classing ANY smoker who had lung cancer as a smoking related death even if it was proved to be e.g. mesothelioma which is a form of asbestosis and NOT caused by smoking. Just about any heart or lung disease related death of a smoker is blamed on smoking.

The government has a real dilemma here - they have to be seen to try to do the right thing & reduce smoking, but the hole it would leave in the treasury would near enough bankrupt the country.

here's what I sent (please nobody do a straight c&p):

Dear Mr Schulz,

I am writing to you to request that you allow split / separate votes on article 18 of the Tobacco Products Directive at the European Parliament's first reading this week.

The text of article 18 has changed substantially and has grown substantially in length since it was last democratically debated. It is in effect new legislation which has not been arrived at by a democratic process and which threatens the health, wellbeing and life expectancy of around 9 million european citizens who currently use personal vapourisers, as well as the 141.6 million european citizens who are still smoking and whose lives could be saved by making a successful switch to vaping. These people have not been consulted. Neither have the thousands of SMEs that have sprung up across Europe from the grass roots vaping community.

If the legislation goes through as it is:

Around 1 in 5 vapers (1.8 million people in Europe) will not be able to get the level of nicotine that keeps them away from cigarettes. Some will turn to the black market, some will start smoking again and almost definitely die earlier and suffer poorer health.

A similar proportion of current smokers who try vaping will find it doesn't meet their needs. They won't know the black market exists so they will stay smokers and most will die.

The majority of vapers will find that almost all of their vaping equipment is illegal. The only thing currently on the market that is 'spill proof' is the disposable cartomiser. Most vapers find disposable cartomisers inadequate to meet their needs. Again, they will either turn to the black market or they will return to smoking and die.

Innovation in Europe will cease. Ecig technology is evolving at a very rapid pace. It is usual to see several new versions of a product released within 6 months. If every new European product has to wait six months before being brought to market, we will simply fail to compete with markets outside the EU.

A black market will flourish and will likely cause additional harm, for example people will buy nicotine at levels which are not safe to handle.

Article 18 is poorly researched and poorly written. It contains contradictions and factual errors. It is not ready to be used. For the sake of 143.4 million EU citizens, please allow this legislation to be given the time and attention it deserves. Please allow split / separate votes.

Plenty that is magnificent! I will certainly borrow a few bits from it but rephrase them in my own style, re-order stuff etc.

Can you remind us where we send this correspondence to please?

I'm delighted ye're using Bargain Vapour! I should get a finders fee.

There's a link in this post to email the president and the political group leaders.

Ok I need advice on clearomisers. I currently have 1 which I think is an iClear 16? It has long wicks. Can anyone recommend replacements and should I get rebuildable?

I'm still on the E-Lites and haven't had a cig since Friday afternoon!

My new toy has arrived, but the liquids from Joose Juice need to steep until the weekend. To whoever asked, I got 18mg, 70/30 PG/VG.

Cannot WAIT to start vaping properly!

Got one for the current vapenominations - with the account manager of a recruitment consultancy, after an initial sifting interview for a job .

To contact MPs, MEPs, Councillors etc, try here:

www.writetothem.com/

Put in your postcode, and you'll get the lot, including Lords.

Excellent letter, Plenty.

MsInga, iclear 16's are pretty good clearomisers. You can get more here. They also sell replacement coil heads.

If you want to try something a bit different, that's rebuildable, look for a bottom coil clearomiser. GS-H2's are cheap and cheerful. Beware of fakes, I know the ones on this link are genuine.

There's all sorts of new clearos on the myepack site, I'm quite tempted to try one of these

Yay, well done Fluz! What flavours did you get?

Allergic, that sounds exciting, good luck!

Meh chances are the client won't even ask me in for interview - market for my skills at the mo is overloaded with candidates & they can be as fussy as they want.

At least my last item for my FastTech order is in! I'd got to the stage of putting in a support ticket asking them if they had any idea when it would be back in stock, with the thought that I'd cancel that one item & re-order it at a later date and get the rest of the order delivered. Then suddenly overnight the status changed to ready to ship waiting to be packaged! Now just the looong wait checking the Singapore Post tracking site for it to arrive.