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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

to think this teacher is a bit of a cowbag?

242 replies

SaintLauren · 24/01/2014 21:39

My DD is 5 is they started to learn how to sing "Alouette" in school. My DH is french and does not like this song because of what it's about and my DD can understand the song too.

Today she told her teacher that her dad doesn't like her singing that song because of what it means.

And the teacher replied that - yes that was absolutely fine, do you like the song Ring Around The Rosie.

My DD said yes she loved that song and the teacher replied that it's a song about people dying from the plague.

Aibu to think this makes her a cowbag?

OP posts:
ProphetOfDoom · 24/01/2014 22:08

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

Roseland · 24/01/2014 22:08

YANBU - It seems a bit harsh of the teacher. I thought that Ring a ring a roses was not about the plague anyway, and that it was just a myth.

DavidHarewoodsFloozy · 24/01/2014 22:08

Ooh I love all these dark underlying meanings, rape,pox ,murder. It,s fascinating.

5OBalesofHay · 24/01/2014 22:10

Cowbag probably equals you up on terms of inappropriateness.. YABU to use foul language about the teacher. Are you planning to micro-manage every aspect if your child's education?

MidniteScribbler · 24/01/2014 22:11

Why not just use it as a lesson about where food really comes from?

SarahAndFuckTheResolutions · 24/01/2014 22:13

Lots of songs and nursery rhymes have some pretty grim meanings behind them, so I don't think pointing that out makes the teacher a cow bag.

But if it happened exactly the way you describe it there is a feeling that she set up your DD a bit by asking that question and that seems a bit mean.

There's a difference between saying "Well lots of other songs have similar meanings SaintLauren DD, did you know that Ring a Ring a Roses is about the plague?" and "Do you like Ring a Ring a Roses? Well more fool you, it's all about violent death."

JodieGarberJacob · 24/01/2014 22:13

Goosey goosey gander and sing a song of sixpence are pretty violent as well.

bamboostalks · 24/01/2014 22:17

It's a myth that Ring a ring was based on the plague, that's been proved as untrue quite categorically so your dd could volley that back to her next week and annoy the teacher even more. I'm sure it was not meant in a cowbag way.

breatheslowly · 24/01/2014 22:18

I think you should take this up with the teacher or head teacher. The comparison between the two is poor as an English speaking child still has no idea about the possible meaning of Ring a Ring a Roses without being told, and the interpretation of it being about plague is disputed.

The teacher has shown significant cultural insensitivity and they are really meant to give more thought to cultural variations within their pupils.

innisglas · 24/01/2014 22:18

Maybe it would have been more tactful to talk to the teacher without other people present.

She has a hard job to do and she might have felt undermined

Chippednailvarnish · 24/01/2014 22:20

You sound really precious OP.

giggle78 · 24/01/2014 22:21

Ummmm ring a ring a roses isn't about the plague. Its an urban myth that has been told so many times its cited in books and all sorts as the message behind the song. Its a myth. A professor (Oxford I think) released it as 'fact' to demonstrate how quickly misinformation could spread. Unfortunately it did spread and its become the meaning behind the song. But it isn't.

ouryve · 24/01/2014 22:24

I get your point, OP. The meaning of Ring-a-roses is gruesome, but what Alouette is describing is downright cruel.

Alisvolatpropiis · 24/01/2014 22:24

So, giggle - whilst it isn't what the meaning of the song was originally, that is the meaning as it is understood today.

So for all intents and purposes...

edwinbear · 24/01/2014 22:25

Ethnomusicologist Conrad LaForte points out that, in song, the lark (l'alouette) is the bird of the morning, and that it is the first bird to sing in the morning, hence waking up lovers and causing them to part, and waking up others as well, something which is not always appreciated.

Not necessarily about preparing it for the pot though, according to the font of all knowledge wiki.......

gordyslovesheep · 24/01/2014 22:25

OP what do YOU think it's about? I thought it was about a birds beautiful plumage

Kemmo · 24/01/2014 22:26

The teacher is wrong.

It is an myth that It is about the plague

HTH

makemineapinot · 24/01/2014 22:26

And are you 100% sure that the teacher did actually speak to your dd exactly like that, do you know for certain that she did not explain it in a calm and reasonable way? Are you just taking your 5year old dd's word for it? As a teacher and a parent I would think carefully about judging a teacher solely on the memory and retelling of a conversation from such a small child. 5 year olds often proudly come in and soak proudly going to China/Florida/Peppa Pig's house for tea one night, and have a tiger over another! They don't have the maturity, memory, vocabulary etc etc to retell a conversation completely accurately so I would be wary of going in to complain. Have a friendly word with the teacher and see it from the adult's perspective - she may have explained to the class about certain rhymes having quite grim origins and your dd has remembered the ring a ring o roses one.

nailslikeknives · 24/01/2014 22:28

Isn't Alouette considered a children's song in France?

MoominIsGoingToBeAMumWaitWHAT · 24/01/2014 22:28

Ring-a-ring-of-roses isn't about the plague, and regardless, someone would have to actually explain it to any English speaking child of that age for them to understand.

Alouette doesn't need to be explained to any French-speaking person because it's bluntly graphic.

The teacher is being a bit unreasonable here.

Roseland · 24/01/2014 22:29

Glad other people have said it was a myth - thought I was making things up for a bit.

If the teacher said it the way they did then I think they were wrong (particularly given that they were actually wrong about the plague). Your DD is only 5 and it should not be a case of showing the teacher up - she is only little and telling the truth as she sees it.

Original poster
SaintLauren · 24/01/2014 22:30

Lots of songs and nursery rhymes have some pretty grim meanings behind them

Well yes I understand that, but alloutte describes it in graphic details. There's a difference between a hidden meaning and laying out the exact meaning.

You sound really precious OP.

Really how so? DD understands the song and didn't like it. Most of the children in her class would not know what it is about as it's just meaningless words. If she didn't understand then I wouldn't care.

OP posts:
soverylucky · 24/01/2014 22:35

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

Janorisa · 24/01/2014 22:36

I wouldn't be happy either OP. I think the graphic detail is a bit much for a 5 yo.

Original poster
SaintLauren · 24/01/2014 22:36

Are you just taking your 5year old dd's word for it? As a teacher and a parent I would think carefully about judging a teacher solely on the memory and retelling of a conversation from such a small child

Well no I don't believe my DD is an angel who is incapable of lying and I haven't spoken to the teacher (don't know if I will but because it's a Friday and I was working until 6 obviously nothing can be done about it for the moment anyway)

I don't know if the conversation was recited exactly as it was in the OP (as I only have DD's word for that) but she had no idea about the plague before, so it seems fairly obvious that she is not telling lies.

OP posts: