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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

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Original poster

to think MIL is talking crap?

136 replies

Danann · 28/12/2013 23:22

I've had yet another disagreement with MIL, I have tried so hard to get on with her but whatever I do is wrong and she has told DH many times that he could do better.

Anyway todays disagreement was that she wants DD(5) to go over to her house for new years eve, MIL is having a party and DD will be the only child there, neither me or DH will be there, she hasn't invited DS (because DS isn't DH's biological son) and both DC have been invited to a sleepover with 4 other children which I think DD will enjoy more. I've told MIL all this and said DD is not going to hers, she's called me a load of names and hung up.

MIL has just text me saying 'You know I've checked with a solicitor and I have rights to see my granddaughter, I will take this to court.'

I hadn't said I was completely stopping her seeing DD anyway, I'm just not letting DD go to this one party!

Grandparents don't have contact rights do they?

OP posts:

CMP69 · 29/12/2013 13:45

These threads make me so glad my PiL live 300 miles away (not helpful sorry)

sashh · 29/12/2013 14:59

Why would she think a young child would prefer to spend NYE with a bunch of drunk adults?

You are assuming she wants what is in the interests of the child. Don't you know that some grand parents only want grand children so they can show off to their friends.

You are never going to win with this. But dh can. He can tell her that unless she bucks her ideas up the only way she will see them is via the court.

rabbitlady · 29/12/2013 15:09

she's bonkers. don't leave your child/ren alone with her, ever. she doesn't have 'rights' to use your child.

maddening · 29/12/2013 15:20

I'd text back "do you really want to take a happy relationship with your son's family down the route of court? Do you not think that would destroy what is an amicable situation where you have plenty of time with your gc - how on earth do you think things would progress. If you want to apologise for your behaviour then we can forget it but what you have just said to me followed by your email is unacceptable. "

perfectstorm · 29/12/2013 15:41

It's also worth remembering that courts don't give a tinker's cuss about adult rights and interests. If contact with a grandparent is going to distress and anger and unsettle the parents, then it's unlikely to be in the best interests of the child unless the gp is the sole or primary link to an absent or dead parent, or the gp had a huge role in the child's life before the disagreement that led to contact ending. A stroppy gp with serious boundary issues, an inability to put the child's interests first, and a poor relationship with the parents hasn't a hope in hell. It's rare for a bitterly contested case to result in contact because the levels of conflict involved are so harmful to the child(ren) the benefits need to be huge to outweigh that.

I'd keep all texts and make a note of these incidents, OP. If you ever do decide contact is harming your child and end it, then this evidence on why you reached that conclusion would be, um, helpful.

Original poster

Danann · 29/12/2013 15:42

CMP69 I wish MIL was 300 miles away, she'd probably still manage to be a pain though.

Friday it's easy for affluent, articulate middle-class parents to laugh at pathetic threats of lawfare It probably is but I'm not affluent or middle class, I grew up in a council house and now live in a council flat, I have very little money and my parents are very much working class (admittedly DD is at Private school but that's because FIL, who is divorced from MIL, offered to pay for both DC when DD didn't get a suitable state school place and I jumped at the chance for her to have opportunities I never had.)

DS can't stand MIL so I doubt he'd want to go on any visits anyway and frankly his Dad's lack of interest has made his life hard enough without MIL adding to it, it just pisses me off that she pretends he doesn't exist.

OP posts:

Original poster

Danann · 29/12/2013 15:45

Thanks perfectstorm that's very reassuring and I am keeping all messages

OP posts:

Meerka · 29/12/2013 15:59

danann clearly she's being unreasonable and your text reply sounded great.

At a slight tangent, given she's trying now and then to split you and your DH (telling him he could do better than you), I think that you and he have to be very sure to communicate absolutely openly between you about any contact you have with her. When a close and influential relative is trying to split two people up, they have to present a very united front and make it clear that to the would-be-splitter that dissing one person in the partnership is not acceptable.

He needs to be completely on your side.

Good luck, something of a piece of work isnt she!

friday16 · 29/12/2013 17:36

OP, have you heard any more from you MIL?

Original poster

Danann · 30/12/2013 02:25

I had a text back this morning saying 'I don't think you are taking me seriously' I haven't bothered to reply. DH says he's told her that she needs to start thinking about other people and to stop causing unnecessary issues and that she hung up on him in a strop so I'm waiting for the messages from SIL about how hurt her poor mum is.

OP posts:

DoYouLikeMyBaubles · 30/12/2013 02:27

I'd reply saying 'no I'm not, you're clearly confused if you think you have any rights to my child'.

Feel right sorry for you, I'm glad mine aren't like this. Her 'poor mum' should think before she throws threats around that concern children!

Caitlin17 · 30/12/2013 04:36

This is from a gransnet forum.

The applicant's permission to make an Application for contact to x and y is refused'

I have changed the names to x and y although the grandmother was happily using the names of her gcs,d, s, former sil,new sil and other family members.

The process would seem to be she needed the court's permission even to apply for the contact order and then the merits of allowing contact would be determined. She was refused permission to apply.

I couldn't work out the whole story as it was all very garbled but her court application and appearances seem to have been on a hiding to nothing from day one.

TobyLerone · 30/12/2013 05:37

Don't reply. You're doing the best thing by not engaging with her.

friday16 · 30/12/2013 08:07

And Caitlin, from what one can tell from the flowery and bizarre accounts on GN, the cases that are being written about all involve acrimonious divorces, and the grandmothers are trying to get access to grandchildren who are wholly resident with their former daughter- or son-in-laws.

Even in those cases, it's quite clear that courts are extremely reluctant to get involved, mostly because such contact orders would be essentially unenforceable: any penalty against the resident parent would massively impact the child more than any possible benefit that could accrue from contact. The line appears to be that if it's not fixable in mediation, then the benefit to the child (who is all the court is concerned about) of seeing their grandparent will not outweigh the harm caused by angering the resident parent. Grandparents don't like that.

The courts seem slightly more willing to force the issue over contact with the non-resident parent, and the grandparents who are talking about "winning" in court mostly appear (as you say, it's hard to follow) to be celebrating contact orders with the NRP, which allow them to see their grandchildren during that contact.

As you said upthread, the chances of a grandparent getting permission to bring an action to secure contact over the heads of both natural parents, absent some very unusual backstory appear to be zero. If the dispute were "I see my grandchild weekly, but sometimes it clashes with choir" then it would be laughed out of court.

So "not taking her seriously" would appear to be the sensible line.

Rumplestiltskinismyname · 30/12/2013 08:26

Please respond and tell her only to communicate with your dh. He'll tolerate about 2 minutes of this ridiculousness. Block her number- and let him sort her out. She's got it in for you, so just remove yourself from the equation. If she wants to see dd then she'll have to get DH to run her, not you...

This is her being spiteful. Distance yourself- you do not need her in your life.

friday16 · 30/12/2013 08:28

Actually, the "yogagirl" saga might be a grandmother attempting to get access over the heads of the natural parents, and getting to (but losing) a court hearing. It's very hard to tell, and it's unsurprising that as a litigant in person she got nowhere.

HermioneWeasley · 30/12/2013 08:39

Yes, do not engage.

DH can speak to her when he's feeling better and tell her that if she pulls this threat again then there will be trouble

And keep the texts

pumpkinsweetie · 30/12/2013 09:12

Do not reply, do not engage!
In all honesty i would be completely re-thinking her contact with my children if i were you!
To leave your other child out is fucked up & to behave like this over one night, she is truly unhinged, i wouldn't want such a vile woman near my dc.

Bloodyteenagers · 30/12/2013 09:46

I would reply back by text.
I don't think you are taking us seriously. DD is not coming to your NYE party, where she will be the only child, where her sibling is excluded from, and instead she is going to a sleep over which has been arranged for several weeks. We will not be blackmailed with legal action for you to dictate my child's social life.

DontmindifIdo · 30/12/2013 09:52

Don't reply, however tempting it is. Talk to your DH. Radio silence will drive her insane.

YouTheCat · 30/12/2013 09:55

You've already said no. If she thinks being abusive will change your mind she is very sadly mistaken.

Just say nothing, at all.

RomulanBattleBagel · 30/12/2013 09:55

She's so deluded it's almost funny

friday16 · 30/12/2013 09:56

If she's still at it today, OP, then your husband could tell her calmly that she needs to fill in the forms and start the process. Until the matter is resolved, there will be no further contact other than provided for by the court. You don't need to do anything until you receive notice of the hearing to seek permission to bring a full action, and as you have evidence of full and regular contact until the threats over a NYE party, you would simply then get the application struck out as vexatious and/or being an abuse of process.

But of course, loons seeking drama are after the drama. So just laughing at her will make her less and less rational, and it might become quite unpleasant. An alternative might be for your husband to drive over and tell her, face to face (texts are a disaster, phones little better) that her behaviour is completely unacceptable and that although he recognises that she is disappointed that her opportunity to show off to her friends plans have been disrupted, she needs to apologise and stop behaving badly. But without drama, threats, etc.

If, however, other family members pile in then it's going to get fairly unpleasant, and you'll need to decide whether the relationship is worth salvaging.

HissymasJumper · 30/12/2013 10:00

This is designed to provoke a reaction from you.

Don't fall for it.

Expect her to ramp things up, but don't bite, don't reply directly to her. Do not reward her outrageous behaviour with any reaction.

What. So. Ever.

ohfourfoxache · 30/12/2013 10:14

Fuck a duck! What a toxic old bag!

If that's her reaction today then I think it's entirely reasonable to tell her that all contact should now be via a solicitor and contact should be in a centre as a pp suggested. Who the chuffing hell does she think she is?

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