To think that working full time when you have a toddler must be heartbreaking

[MillyStar]

I've been a secretary for the same company for over ten years and i've worked two days a week since January when my maternity leave ended, dd is now 19 months old

She goes to nursery one day a week and her nanas the other day.

My company are relocating too far away for me and i've struggled for about 4 months to find anything part time, even supermarkets etc - all the part time stuff seems to be different shifts every week or just a few hours each day

I've just had an email from a solicitors asking if i would be interested in a full time legal secretary job, i'm going in for an initial chat with them at 5pm

It's a job i've looked into numerous times but always been knocked back as you need experience, these guys have my CV and know i don't have legal experience so i feel that i have to grab this chance. I'm single now so i need to get the best job i can for DD and if i end up working in a Starbucks or somewhere until she's a bit older i may find it difficult to get back into office work

It may all amount to nothing but I just feel sick about working full time already, I hate the fact that i only get about 2 hours with dd on the two days that i do work so for that to happen 5 times a week would be heartbreaking for me ;(

Please tell me it's not as bad as it feels it would be at the moment?

While I don't work FT, I wouldn't have a problem with it. My DD is cared for by qualified professionals who have far more patience than I do. She runs into nursery each day, without looking back or even saying goodbye, unless she is reminded to. She loves it and it is genuinely a better place for her to be than at home with me.

If you are lucky enough to have the choice about whether to work FT, PT or at all, there are differences between parents in what they would be happy with. I would hate not to see my DD every day - so long hours/long commute wouldn't suit me. DH is the same, but doesn't mind the odd, week-long business trip. It is just down to individual preferences.

Threads like this always remind me that I am very lucky to be in a position to choose how much I work. It must be horrible to read this if you are a parent who doesn't have the choice and has to work FT, but would prefer not to.

'Children may not get to see their parents but they ARE looking for them, even when if they cannot see them. Is huge deal for them to know that someone is there. Seriously, 'they won't even notice' is a reason? Of course they will. You may not, but they WILL angry angry'

What's the alternative, if you are a lone parent? It's no longer an option to claim income support and stay home for years and years, the government can and will keep lowering the age for this.

Everyone saying, 'Go part-time,' and what? Claim working tax credits? That puts you at a big disadvantage when you go to do a lot of things, not to mention if they cock it up and then say, 'Oops, we overpaid you, no more money for you.'

Did some of you not read the op? She is a lone parent. No-one is bringing the bacon if she doesn't work. This is about her not your kids.

Her child will have a lovely time with nan 2 days a week and then nursery. She'll be fine and so will the op. Better taking a job now if she can in a desired location and sector and especially during a recession.

I used to be a FT Legal Secretary & gave it up to earn NMW in a PT job because I barely ever saw my DS awake!

14 years later, I have two more DC & am still in a job paying little more than NMW.

I made my choices so that I could spend as much time with my DCs as possible.

But that's not for everyone, DSis, for example, feels that she is a better parent for working FT & would never be happy as a SAHM.

Basically, do what's best for you.

expat

Some people are happy to go pt or sahp and receive tax credits.
You are no more at risk than redundancy.
If your award is cocked up by them or you so what? You pay a max of 40% of overpayment if you can afford to. If this means you can't pay essential bills then the percentage is lowered.
I do think that if you have dc it shouldn't be seen as a luxury to be able to care for them yourself.

"Children may not get to see their parents but they ARE looking for them, even when if they cannot see them. Is huge deal for them to know that someone is there. Seriously, 'they won't even notice' is a reason? Of course they will. You may not, but they WILL"

Lairy

Hugely overdramatic. I agree with a previous poster that its much more important when they're older and you're there at the football/rugby/whatever - but every single school play/harvest festival/sports day/weekly 'achievement' fecking assembly - they really, really don't remember when they're 10 that you missed their nativity when they were 2.

It is (IME) the mums that are affected by childcare, not the children.

OP, I would take the opportunity you've been offered with both hands - give it a good shot and if it doesn't work out you can always go back to part time elsewhere.

Retro makes some good points. Our school has lots of open mornings and events and the infant age kids often do get upset if parents aren't there. They ask where their parents are. Older kids can understand more easily if parents cannot make it.

However it is very good that parents can sometimes get time off though for events. At DS nativity the majority of parents attended, even some of the parents who are primary teachers got time off. Also good if they video it for those who miss it.

Also it seems almost taboo on here but equal can mean different roles. 9 months pregnancy and birth and feeding could well mean a mother finds it harder to leave a baby than the father.

'Some people are happy to go pt or sahp and receive tax credits. '

And that is a real punt given this government is determined to ramrod it in that as many as possible work FT or get punished.

I think some of you are being unfairly hard on the OP. I think she is coming from the perspective of being a single parent. Many of you posting would appear to have partners to take up the slack. She will not; just the generosity of her mum for at most two days a week. And I don't think anyone can judge what another person finds heartbreaking (though perhaps heart-wrenching would be a better choice of terminology).

And as for the any kind person/they won't remember or care brigade...with respect that is utter bollocks. My parents both worked full time when I was growing up and I bitterly remember all my friends having their parents (though it was mostly mums back in the day tbf) at events, but I didn't. I hated that I was with the small group of children helping to clear up whilst others got to spend a few snatched moments with their parents and get a well done cuddle. As such I have made it my priority that either DH or I, but preferably both, attend every single event that our lot do. OK, they may not remember the actual event, but they will not forget the feeling of isolation from being one of the few without parental support there.

OP I was effectively a single parent with my DS1 (DH lived in a different city and visited once a fortnight) and to be brutally honest, I was devastated at the thought of going back to work FT (as I was meant to when he was 18 weeks old). I gave up work, sold my flat and moved back home to my parents to allow me to have a bit more time with him. I eventually went back part time 30 hours a week (though given the commute I was away from him from 8-6 every day) just before his 2nd birthday and it was heart-wrenching for me at that time. However...we adapted; he had a great nursery, I had a good job and could provide for us better. I even managed to manage my own time better as I needed to be better organised to cope. Yes I missed him like crazy, but it did get much easier as time wore on.

One thing I will say though is that it was much much easier when he was in FT nursery. The hard work starts when they start school, looking for wrap around care and summer holiday clubs etc. I would personally take the job so it FT whilst your DD is FT private, then negotiate more school friendly hours when the need arises

Oh, and though she will have carers and will bond with them; you will always be her mum

I can't help but congratulate you on your choice of username MrsSchadenfreude...who other than someone called "harm-joy" would lie to their DC like that and think it's OK?

My oldest is thirteen, youngest 17 months. I don't feel guilty, their dad doesn't feel guilty, adults work in our house. My older son finds it most odd when the two friends of his who have mums who don't work have no ambition, as there's a big push on ambition for girls at school at the mo in PSHE.

Fact is it is all heartbreaking! I am at home full time and really miss my other life and other me. A lot. I struggle with that every day. If I was out full time I would struggle with the reverse. Life gives and life takes. You will get used to it. She will get used to it. Somehow, it will work. I firmly believe that, a little heartbreak, fairly consistently is part and parcel of motherhood.

Absolutely bratingham.

Also any school that has lots of open mornings and events for parents duting working hours is being rather unrealistic.

I know its a long time ago, but when I was at infant school in the 70's although it was the norm for mothers to be non wage earning the school didn't expect to see parents in school hours except for sports day and the carol concert.

Expat, I think the idea is people work pt to get the unemployment figures down, but also don't get benefits.

Government policies don't have to make sense!

Heartbreaking is a stretch, but yes there are days when I simply don't want to go to work and would rather stay with the kids.

But needs must.

If you can support yourself you should, not out of any sort of morality judgement but because I don't think relying on help is a very good idea at the moment.

Way too dicey to be relied upon if you can at all avoid it.

It's very hard to decide what is the best for your family.

I have always worked. When the DC were born I took mat leave and then returned to work. Sometimes part time sometimes full time.

My DD is a primary teacher and has given up work until her DC are older. I realise she is lucky to be able to do this as her DH has a great job. She remembers me not being there for the little things as she was growing up.

My best friend has never worked outside the home since she had her DC. Her DD is a secondary teacher and has just had her first DC. When the baby is six months she will to back to work and her Mum will look after the baby.

I work full time but have been been to everything dd has ever been in or done. My husband has also and he works full time including every single share a story book with them which is weekly. Working full time doesnt mean not helping or attending the school with events etc.

It is always better for the child to be in a working household than not op going to work is absolutely the right thing for you to do, and once you both get started you will be fine.

I think the point about wraparound care becoming harder when they start school is very pertinent.
In many ways, the pre school bit is the easier. The most expensive by a long chalk, mind, but more straightforward in that you get a cm or nursery and don't have to worry about slotting together the before/ after school and holiday care parts. In the OPs shoes I would definitely go for the job. She also has the financial advantage of her mum picking up 2 days childcare. If it becomes too much, negotiate a job share or see if you can reduce a bit... Always easier to do those things once you're in a job and proving your worth at it. I have had a couple of people in my dept negotiate reduced hours this year, and the fact they have proved themselves invaluable has clinched it

Also don't 'glorify' the pre school years as though they are sacrosanct and you need to be there 24/7 and then will magically slide into the job you want when they start school. Like I say, it isn't like that in reality. Your children are only ever a particular age once, and their needs change as they grow, so being a good parent is about loving and supporting them and adapting to their needs as they grow. My children are teenagers now and I've actually adapted my working hours a bit to arrive home earlier as they have reached the stage where they don't need after school care, but I wouldn't be happy to leave them alone for too long. They relish the feeling of independence by having some time to themselves when they arrive home, but by rejigging my hours for earlier starts and earlier finishes, I can get home earlier. And the fact that I've established myself and reached a fairly senior position has enabled me to do this .

Ultimately it's your decision OP, and yours alone as you are a lone parent. But you've posted asking for views and I would definitely advise to try not to glorify the pre school years, because the fact is, every age is special and it's important to find a balance which works well for you long term. The pre school years are a fairly arbitrary period anyway in that if you were living in other countries they may well last until age 6 or 7 (as a bit of an aside personally I'm a big fan of starting school later and would have preferred my dc to have had an extra year or two in their fantastic nursery rather than start school at 4- but that's another thread)

You mention the only things around part time are shop jobs... Again, nothing wrong with that if it works for you. Some parents prefer to do supermarket work on fewer hours for the sake of more time at home. But you say that you don't think you'd find that fulfilling- and thats fine too. You don't need to feel guilty for acknowledging that you have needs too

GoodKing - so you don't have Santa Claus or the Tooth Fairy?

My two are now 13 and 15 and I can promise you that they have no idea whether I was there for every primary school nativity, carol service, harvest festival etc etc. Of course I wouldn't have missed a school play where one of them had a major role, but take a day's leave to watch one of them be one of 8 sheep or in the back row of the choir? No. My annual leave is precious and I'd much rather spend it having a proper day off with the DDs in the school holidays.

And at our school events, which almost always took place in the church, there was never a "snatched moment" with the parents afterwards. Parents came into the church, when they were all in, children arrived. Post performance, children left in a crocodile, walked back to school by the teachers and parents did not leave the church until the children had left the churchyard. So the only opportunity was a little wave. And as I've said, due to the size and layout of the church, the chances of your child actually seeing you weren't high.

The secondary schools my two attend seem to have realised that parents can't come to everything during the day, and quite sensibly ensure that events that require a parent's presence are scheduled for the evening.

Have been thinking a lot about this and can see both sides, but the crux is that your children will react to the situation in keeping with the way they have been brought up.

If your child has been in childcare from months old, then it is what they have grown up with, so is their normal - they are not disadvantaged, they do not "miss their parents" every waking moment of nursery etc, because it is all they have ever known

If your child has had a SAHP from the off, then that is their normal - of course they are going to find nursery harder to adjust to/cope with (initially), because they are used to being around a parent all the time.

I'll also make the point about forces parents - they occasionally go away for months at a time, often for weeks - their children manage just fine, because it's what they have grown up with, their normal.
My children don't bat an eyelid when me or their father go away - they miss us, obviously, but they are not distraught and they carry on perfectly happy with their lives. I also say this as a forces child myself - if I had been emotionally affected by my dad going away regularly, would I have joined myself and stayed in after having children? (No! of course I wouldn't).

In the OPs case, her daughter is already going to childcare part time, so the leap to full time for her daughter will more than likely be unremarkable - it is the mum that finds it hard and overthinks it all.

'My older son finds it most odd when the two friends of his who have mums who don't work have no ambition'

Could he have picked this up from you perhaps?

My older 4 DC wouldn't judge anyone like that. If they did (OK it happened once when DD made a comment re friend's mum who worked long hours and never attended events) I would (and did) set them straight about respect other people's choices, some people don't have any choice etc.

If you are too gung ho with only WOHMs have ambition or are doing the right thing then you may not be popular with future DIL if they choose to be a SAHM! (33% chance) In addition your son may choose to be a SAHP.

Lots of SAHP have ambition. they may aspire to be really good parents and see that as their 'job' rather than having career ambitions. They may volunteer etc.

Monica I was affected by being a forces child,many are.I hated it and I ended a relationship because I knew I could never put any future children through the same.

We're all different.Children differ as do adults.

Being different is good but we need to be allowed to embrace our differences and and the needs of our individual children.I will not be told my children would have been fine in childcare,I know them and they wouldn't have.

As parents we know what is best for our children and one size does not fit all.

My DC perform events in a huge crowded church and always manage to find us in the crowd!!! If DH or I cannot make it I would get grandparents to go or get a friend's mum to take pics. I think if you miss some events then they wouldn't get too upset but if you miss them all they may well do. Of course some people haven't a choice and I feel sorry for them. Workplaces should be more flexible and allow parents the time of or to work more flexibly. I bet more mums that are thinking of going back to work would do so if they could get time off for events etc.

And what Jelky said.

I have ambition.

I had it years ago.Worked my arse off and went without in order to be in the position to have a period at home.

Ambition means very different things to people.Working in an office is not ambition to me.Finding work I enjoy that will fund things we want to do,pay the bills and give us all a balanced life in the next stage of our lives is my ambition.

My kids know that working hard at school,getting qualifications in order to have choices is important- they're doing it.My being a sahp has given them ambition with bells on.

My dp and my dc's grandparents have never missed one of their performances and they all work.

It's priorities.

Showing kids that school is important and supporting school with events means more to us than an afternoon out somewhere.