Are we raising a generation of helpless kids?

[YouTheCat]

Interesting article in the Huffington Post about if we (generally) are doing too much for our kids, letting them get away with things and not letting them take the consequences.

I have to say I find a lot of it quite true, though obviously not about every parent but in a general way. I see a lot of this at school. Parents descending full of violent indignation that their child has been reprimanded or hasn't got a place in an after school club, where I had never seen this behaviour when I was at school (bloody ages ago).

My own dd (18) has some funny idea that she will waltz into a fantastic job after college when, in reality, she will probably have to work in Asda and gain some experience first.

Well I teach teenagers (16-19) and I have to say the vast majority of them are really nice, hard working determined people.

I have come across the odd 'princess' and one or two I think should have been slapped (even though I don't believe in hitting children).

On the whole you lot must be doing a fairly good job.

I sometimes teach adults as well, on the courses people are sent to by the job centre, so not courses people attend through choice.

And the same applies, one or two who think the world owes them a living, most just wanting to get back in to work.

Look at the very small proportion of applicants you see on campuses who are not being escorted by their parents. My daughter reckoned that she was often the only one on a particular tour or group session.

I went with DS1 to a uni open day, dropped off DS1 who was to call me when he had finished.

Can't he use public transport :-)

To be fair, the extreme helicopter parents you see on visits don't appear to be such a factor once term starts, anecdotally because their kids don't make their offers.

Sash - The issue is I think more with some middle class kids. You might not meet them on the courses you run.

There's an awful one on dd's course. 17, racist/homophobic/disablist and not shy with spreading their vile views either. Also totally spoilt, no additional needs but just awful.

Every time the college try and remove him from the course his parents step in and go ballistic. He never has to face up to his terrible behaviour, ever.

Oh my word, this drives me batty! I was brought up with an awful lot of independence from a young age and I seem to be this complete misfit around here with what I allow my children to do! As an example, DS(11) goes to school in a city 15 miles from our home. Once a week he has swim team after school and once practice is finished he walks 5-10 minutes to catch a public bus to his dad's office. He then phones his dad who pops down to meet him and they go home on the train together.

trying to persuade MIL that DS would be completely capable of doing this was absolutely impossible. This scenario horrifies her! The first week she insisted on driving through to his school to go through the route with him even though he'd been so excited to do it on his own. She's still not happy with it even though he's never had a problem and it's a little adventure to him. She'll sit in our living room and say, "Oh I know your mother thinks I'm a fusspot but it's just because I love you." I respond with, "Being a naive kid from the sticks won't do him any favours!"

I want my kids to be as independent as I was- no one ever rescued me if I messed things up. I was expected to sort things myself. I was given a great deal of independence and responsibility and I'll forever be grateful to my parents for that.

I think it's because people are so quick to blame when things go wrong. If I let my child (eg) walk to school, and he gets hit by a car, you can guarantee there will be the "what were you thinking, letting him WALK" brigade out.

The blame culture in the media I think makes us think twice before we let our child do a "risky" thing.

Mind you, mine are only 3 and 1 so I haven't had to deal with it too much but I let DS1 go and get things from the shelves in the supermarket while I am within sight but not hovering and often I get people looking around in a "where is this child's parent" way even though he is just calmly counting mushrooms into a bag or choosing a cucumber.

To be fair to young people though, they are potentially taking on thousands of pounds worth of debt when deciding upon a university course.

You can't blame them for feeling apprehensive!

Plus there are far more choices in terms of institutions and courses, than there were when I applied. It's a much more complex decision for an average 17 year old.

I tried very hard to raise independent children, from age 8 they had to make their own lunches or each others and washing only got done if they brought it downstairs to the washer etc etc, I have now got a very independent 19 year old girl and a complete 21 year old mummys boy, didnt do anything diffrent, it is just that they are diffrent. My son used to get my daughter to do his jobs etc for him. ( he gets that from his dads side, not mine!!)

If your DH is like that, then he will have been a role model for your son.

Plus there are far more choices in terms of institutions and courses

Up to a point. If you're looking seriously at, say, Bristol, then it's unlikely that you're looking much wider in either courses or institutions than your parents did in the 1980s. Probably less so, actually, because in the 1980s your parents could apply to five universities on a UCCA form, some polytechnics on a PCAS form and even teacher training colleges (for a Cert.Ed) on separate forms. Whereas today someone who's applying to an RG university is mostly applying to RG universities, and has no more choice than their parents did.

Where there's been the massive expansion in choice is in the post-92 universities, but it's rare to apply to a wide range of those throughout the country, and often people only apply to their local ones. So again, not a massive increase in choice for any individual applicant.

Arabesque totally agree with you. the kids being driven to secondary, mine take a tube. where I used to work massive 4 by 4s doing u turns whilst holding everyone else up to drop their y11 dc off by school.

But Mrs DeVere, I know from your other posts that you had a terrible loss in your family. That could easily have been what pushed your boy off the rails. If he has had a good grounding, then I am sure he will come through his horrible phase.

The university thing is different, as Wordfactory says. In my day it was free, plus grant, plus dole in holidays plus I had offers of EE at top universities. If I/ds is to be saddled with horrendous costs then you bet I'm involved!

I agree with the "you're worth it" ethos which has pervaded the mindset of a generation. Why are you worth it, pray? And no, no amount of "I've never wanted anything more in my life" is a springboard into an exciting job.

I heard a bit of Oprah on Woman's Hour who sponsors many girls through college. She said an important part of her coaching is to convince girls that hard work and self worth is more important that self image and instant gratification X Factor-type ambitions.

My children are young but I still get them to do chores and I hope to raise them to be independent, kind and decent adults.
I also hope to be close to them. I am interested in what they do and want to be supportive too. I would accompany them to Uni open days if they wanted me to. I went by myself or with friends but my parents weren't really very interested in what I wanted to do so I don't think that's an indicator.
It is hard to get the balance right though.

Mrs DV, I do agree with that. I know it isn't all down to nurture. But I do think that it's time these particular parents let their ds take the consequences of his behaviour instead of stepping in every time and making out like he is some kind of victim.

Half of the class are too frightened of him to say anything. My dd isn't but she is frightened of how he reacts. The rest of the class shouldn't have to go through their course fearing his behaviour. He won't be allowed to behave as he does in a work situation and I think his parents are doing him a disservice.

happycrimble, there is only one way he can be a mummy's boy & that is if his mummy is still doing things for him aged 21!

My eldest boy is 19. He's been brought up to do his share of the chores, made encouraged to hold down a part time job etc. He is still bone idle and entitled though and does as little as he can get away with. I must admit he is slowly improving now he is at university but I think that is due to the influence of his very sensible girlfriend rather than us. If we suggest something, it is rubbish, if she suggests exactly the same, it is rather a good idea. I am only grateful he at least had the good sense to go out with a nice girl.

I think it is a bit odd that the article puts people who are 29 in the category of "kids". I know people that age with four kids of their own!

I'm tired of the ragging on the Millennial generation: lazy, want everything instantly, too obsessed with technology, too pampered. Even recognizing that this type of complaints have been recorded back to ancient Babylon (of a father complaining his son), the issues are pretty much all in the hands of the older generations. The status markers of before are no longer reachable to us now, the minimum wage which was originally created to allow a person to support a family and own a home when working full time on it is now viewed as something that only people otherwise supported would take for experience and only for lazy people. I think a lot more young people and children are going through rough times and still doing their best and the 'gets everything and owns the school' type of children aren't the standard that the media likes to portray them as and if education included more social and emotional education and less tests, young people would have those skills that so many people complain they're missing. Young people now have anxiety and mental health problems at record highs and still being ignored and blamed. The older generation in power purposefully makes their life harder for younger people then complains when they can't meet those targets as easily as they did. It's just an unhealthy system.

My children likely do a lot, particularly as young carers, and all the bullying they've faced was started by adults they were in the care aof nd sustained more by the adults than the other children and outside help we've sought thinks that the children just need to 'power through to toughen them up'. They're aren't helpless because we're pampering or overprotecting, they become helpless because they're expected to do everything and handle everything with very little direct help into how to do so and support when it fails. Bringing in PE kits is a very drop in the ocean compared to the massive challenges a lot of young people face.

I must seem like a meanie!
Mine ( now 14 and 16) can cook full proper meals from scratch, and clean, have been doing their own laundry since they were 8 or 9. By ten they were babysitting. They are responsible for meal planing and shopping one day per week.
They navigate their way around the city on their own, but I do come get them if it is late, not because they can't find their way, but as a safety thing as were are in a rough area.
They also make their own Dr appointments if they need one.
DD has a part time job, DS does odd jobs.
They have their own bank accounts, which they monitor and balance.
I do bring things to school if they forget, but they have to do an extra chore to make up for it if it happens!