To NOT want my husband to have a makeover and dress as a woman?

[Katie4u]

I have known about my husband's need to dress as a woman for almost 20 years. I came home unexpectedly one day to find him wearing my clothes. I was shocked and quite frightened. He explained that this was something he had been doing in secret since he was a little boy. Me being me, I felt sorry for him. We spoke about it for quite a while - I couldn't shut him up - I tried to understand him, but it became clear to me that this wasn't something that was going to go away. I told him that I didn't want to be part of it, that our children mustn't ever see him or know about it and he has been true to his word. There have been times when he has asked if he could dress and be with me and I must confess that, in bed, he was a lot more passionate making love to me dressed in my undies than he was when he was naked ... he's not gay! Now that our kids have flown the nest, he has had more opportunity and is taking more risks. He wants to know how good he would look with a professional makeover and he has found a place where he can go to do this. I have said no. I'm frightened where tis might lead? Am I being unreasonable?!

If explained properly, a child is perfectly capable of understanding such issues There was an interesting programme where children talked about a dad who was a crossdresser Children are very understanding - but the natural (and understandable) reaction is not in front of the children

So something that is a part of him is supressed for many years and that is hard.

paxtecum, it's not the OP I'm being harsh to, I accept that she is just a product of the society in which she lives. Indeed, she has read the responses on here and realised that she should probably do a spot of self-examination on the issue.

The people I intending to be harsh to are those who seem to think it's the OP who is the one being treated unfairly in this situation.

Like I said - it's not going to go away. He may tell you it has but it won't. And he wants to explore this side more - but paxtecum is right that it can take over your life which may be an issue.

It is unfair on him to ask him to stop. It's unfair on you for him to want to be dressed up around the house if it makes you uncomfortable.

So a middle ground needs to be found. But he may want to keep pushing the boundaries on what is acceptable to both of you.

I wouldn't be happy with it, but it's harmless. I feel bad about my lack of sympathy.
And I liked Grayson Perry a lot.

It's a big step though.

From private cross-dressing to using an agency. And then (I'm betting) they'll be pressure on the wife to head out to the Rubber Ball.

Once the ball is rolling...

And this stuff is expensive. The agencies aren't cheap, nor are the outings, nor the ball tickets, and the hotel stays and the specialist clothing and make-up, and then the treatments to retard hair growth so that the make-up looks more realistic.

I get that the op feels a bit like Alice In Wonderland tumbling down, down, down.

He's still the same bloke though.

Have you contacted the Beaumont Society yet?

(I am wondering if I've been hiding under a rock, btw. Who the actual feck is Grayson Perry?)

The thrill is totally about passing btw - nothing sexual, future. Which suggests absolutely certainly that this dude is ready to test the water and put himself out there. And that's a really brave thing to do, because it doesn't always go well. No one seriously wants to run the gauntlet of getting beaten up in bars.

I know a guy who used to go out and drive at night, dressed, as a half way house, before he went to an agency.

Grayson Perry is an artist. He designs the most boring scarfs in the world for Liberty and makes pottery that is equally as boring.
He dresses up in the style of a 1950s little girl, ankle socks, frilly dresses and bonnets.

His dress style is disturbing.
He seems to be embraced by the BBC.

Madwoman; I agree with you.

Even if the money isn't a problem, it's a bit like there being another woman in the marriage and the other woman comes first, always.

Annie unconditional love? Really? Unless you view women as supportive handmaidens to their husbands, you must be kidding. The love between a woman and a man is based on honesty and trust, it is not unconditional. If this is an intrinsic part of himself, he should have been honest about it before she committed to him but he wasn't. The OP discovered this and only when she was pregnant and didn't want to be alone. I would hazard a guess that the reason he didn't tell her before they were married is because he knew she would not accept it. He should have given her this choice and an ability to find another life with someone else before she was pregnant with his child. The OP did not get the chance to cut him loose at the offset because of his dishonesty.

You are shaming her into accepting something she does not want by saying this is about her prejudices but hey, it's the woman's role to support the husband, right? To make sure his needs are met, right? To put her own needs / desires / boundaries second, right? No. All women have a right to define the life and relationship they want and to define their own boundaries without being shamed into putting their husband's needs first.

This is an emotive subject for me because my ex-stepdad has been living as a woman for the last 10 years after having started out "just" cross-dressing from time to time. My mum couldn't cope with it and their marriage broke down, not necessarily because of him wanting to live as a woman, but because his personality changed enormously and (s)he became a very self-centred and unpleasant person.

The thing is, if your husband is feeling more and more that he wants to dress as a woman full time, it's not something he can just keep private. I think for all your sakes, it's worth seeking professional counselling to establish where on the spectrum between occasional cross-dressing and full on transgender he is. This isn't going to go away.

florafox As usual, you are displaying a total lack of understanding about trans issues and why people surpress them and hide them.

I lived with a cross dresser for 30 years and totally agree with FloraFox.

I can have all the understanding in the world, but may not want to give unconditional love to someone whose own needs totally outweigh my own.

A wife does not have to give unconditional love. Full Stop.
I gave unconditional love for 30 bloody years and nothing got ever better.
My needs were always bottom of his list and they stayed at the bottom of his list.

Life on my own is lovely.

Flora has articulated this far better than me.

Having read your latest post I don't think Yabtoou. I was going to say you were before fully understanding how confused you are and how hard you are trying to embrace his lifestyle.
I don't think it's something that should be hidden or made to feel like a dirty or wrong thing, but I can understand why in our current society where everyone is so keen to put labels on everything that you would feel that way. I think we are very much in a transitional period on the this issue as a whole. We know it's wrong to judge someone for something like this yet we can't help but do it. This is what progress is supposed to be for, a hundred years ago a woman getting a divorce or a man being fat would've been met with the same
Just try and keep talking about it, keeping it all in the open and accept that it's something I can't help/change as its part of the package of him and what makes him happy. Good for him I say, we should all be tolerant of people displaying 'deviant' sexual indentites, the more we are the better for all of us in the long run.

Not fat!! * gay! Ffs

orlando I don't recognise you (maybe you've name changed) but this is not about "trans issues" . That would be about the husband's issues in dealing with his life and the causes and consequences of his behaviour. I have not been talking about that. I have been talking about a woman's response and the pressure put on a woman to accommodate whatever her husband might expect her to deal with.

Full disclosure: I am a feminist and I care about women - their role in society and their role in relationships. I want women to be comfortable in their relationships and not feel like they need to accommodate any old thing their partner desires in the name of unconditional love or inclusiveness.

Mewmeow: There is a big difference between being extremely tolerant of all trans issues and finding out that your DH is a cross dresser and would love to be chatted up by a bloke.

He is not the person she thought she had married.

OP doesn't want to see her husband dressed like a woman.
She doesn't want to chat about makeup with him.

And men need to be comfortable in their relationships and not feel they have to repress an important side of themselves.

Relationships and people change over 20 years. Just because the couple felt they were compatible 20 years ago doesn't mean they are still compatible. Sometimes there is nobody to blame when a relationship breaks down.

Depends why he would love to be chatted up.

How many women on here would love it if they were in a bar and Huge Jackman/Peter Andre/Gerrard Butler/Barry Chuckle tried chatting them up? He may have meant it would be a massive compliment and he would be flattered.

florafox

Is it a feminist issue or a relationship issue? If there was a situation where a wife had kept something hidden, but then wanted to express it - would you have an issue?

It's a relationship issue - not a feminist issue as a man could be asked to accommodate his wife's needs.

Re the selfishness: After decades of keeping something bottled up, there is the tendency to froth everywhere when your bottle is open. A Transvestite who decides they don't want to pretend to be 'normal' any more may bang on and on about it for a year. It passes as the novelty of freedom grows old. Many become a right pain in the arse for a bit.

And men can be selfish about anything if they're that sort of person. An obsessive transvestite comes from the same sort of place as an obsessive videogame player, or obsessive train enthusiast, or obsessive bagpipe player. It's the obsessive bit that needs addressing.

pax I'm sorry I x-posted with you several times. You have been at the coal-face of this issue and I have not. Your experience far outweighs my vies and I entirely respect your experience. Please keep posting, your posts are much more important than mine.

orlando I think it's a feminist issue because of the expectation of support from women to men. Can you give me an example of where this might occur for a wife hiding something from her husband?

Well put, flora.

I dont think I am an out and out feminist, my relationship is probably quite traditional, by today's standards. But I feel decidedly uneasy about many things
(a) how katie discovered her DHs preference, not through full disclosure, but when they were fully into their relationship and committed with a child
(b) the fact she is making a big compromise now on what she feels comfortable about and what she has believed her marriage has been all about, to date
(c) her growing concern that this is the thin end of the wedge, and she doesn't know where it will lead in the future
(d) her DHs admission that he would enjoy being approached by a man

Katie, please follow your instincts and take time to get support from one of the groups who can help you work through your concerns.

I would say expectation of support isn't normally it. Hope of support maybe.

Wife hiding things? How about affairs? Applicable to both sexes of course.