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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

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AIBU ... to STILL feel positively evangelical about electronic cigarettes? [thread 2]

997 replies

magimedi · 15/11/2013 22:02

Here we go with thread two.

There is a great deal of information on Thread One about vaping :

www.mumsnet.com/Talk/am_i_being_unreasonable/1865547-to-feel-positively-evangelical-about-electronic-cigarettes?pg=1

I think that many of us have been able to give up smoking thanks to e-cigs & vaping & are all feeling the positive results & want to spread the message.

OP posts:
Hopasholic · 23/01/2014 19:39

'The rise of the E-cig is on ITV at the mo if anyone is tuning in Smile

QueenStromba · 23/01/2014 23:11

Well that was a load of cobblers. I like how they messed up their little graphic and got the labelling for battery and cartridge the wrong way round. The story about the man who died was just scare mongering - unless he was vaping some very strange e liquid the oil in his lungs didn't come from vaping.

DizzyZebra · 23/01/2014 23:57

I have missed the rise of the e cig thing because i use my internet connection and the wankers internet providers have messed my account up so i'm stuck on my mobile connection.

What was it like?

I was expecting some battery scaremongering about them blowing up.

My mate messaged me the other day saying a guy at works battery had blown up - He'd left it on charge for god knows how long, it started leaking fluid, my friend says to him 'Don't use that its fucked'... so he used it.. a leaking battery... twat. I said i hope it took his sodding eyebrows off for being so stupid.

(Apparently he is the resident nobhead, someone left him a cup that says 'I'm a twat' as a present, never found out who though!)

QueenStromba · 24/01/2014 13:20

Nothing about blowing up batteries. They went on a bit about how it's not regulated and how there hasn't been much in the way of scientific research.

They gave some guy who owns a vaping shop a hard time because he was saying that, based on what his hundreds of customers have been telling him, they have the same benefits as giving up smoking. It felt a bit like they were blaming him personally for the lack of scientific research - he's a shop owner not a scientist!

Then they dug up one death where the doctor thought e-cigs might have been involved because the man had a rare type of pneumonia caused by oil in the lungs - completely neglecting to mention that e liquid doesn't have oil in it. They did admit though that they couldn't find a single other death that had been even tenuously linked to e-cigs.

Then they had some woman having a daily mail style hissy fit because there was an ad for e-cigs on the radio while she was driving her kids to school. They went on for a bit after that about them being advertised as if it's the exact same as normal cigarettes being advertised and had a go at some guy from E-lites because their tagline is "smoking reinvented" therefore it must be smoking blah blah blah.

They had some vapers on for a short while including a guy with terminal lung cancer who said he'd never have been able to give up smoking without ecigs.

They had a doctor on who said not to use ecigs because they haven't been studied enough and a scientist who's been in smoking research for 30 years who's really excited about them and thinks for the first time that smoking might be eradicated in his lifetime.

They also talked briefly about the EU regs and made them out to be a really good idea.

QueenStromba · 24/01/2014 15:35

I forgot that they also gave a guy from British American Tobacco a hard time because they'd brought out an ecig and were therefore profiting from a possible solution to a problem that they helped cause.

Funny that they came out pro EU regs that will only help the likes of British American Tobacco - they obviously hadn't looked into the whole thing enough to realise that.

The whole thing was poorly researched and thought out.

DizzyZebra · 24/01/2014 18:08

What a flock of twats!

Well, despite the fact that they're almost definitely going to give me some random disease or whatever Grin i have returned with goodies today. Our shop has some new dekang flavours they didn't have before, So i have candyfloss, amaretto and coconut.

Also bought another iclear 16 so i can just have my stronger flavours that i dont like sharing attys with the milder ones, and a 'mini pro takn' which ive just tried and i think i might actually be dying or something - It doesn't half give off some vape. Have turned it down to 6.5 watts and it still kicks loads of vape up.

Ordered from joosejuice today too so yay, absolutely fell in love with their bubblegum so have ordered 30 ml of it :)

groovejet · 24/01/2014 19:12

Right I am really interested i starting up with e cigs, however I am utterly bemused by all the different products and liquids and it is putting me off slightly I don't want to waste money by ordering the wrong bits.

For a starter kit I was looking at either this www.ltecigs.larsentilbrook.co.uk/index.php?route=product/product&path=59_62&product_id=95 or from the same site this one www.ltecigs.larsentilbrook.co.uk/index.php?route=product/product&path=59_62&product_id=1243

Is there any difference between the two and would these be an easy starter kit to use, have seen both names mentioned here so was hoping they would be good?

For these kits would the only extra bits I would need to replace be the cartomizer things and e liquid?

With the juice is it difficult to keep on top of steeping, I have seen it can take 1 to 2 weeks to steep, just thinking of the practicalities of running low on liquids but not able to use any ordered because they have to steep, not as easy as popping to the corner shop for a pack of cigs.

Please someone provide me with a very basic idiots guide.

magimedi · 24/01/2014 19:35

I was actually quite heartened by that programme last night, despite the unproven death report.

I thought the scientist who was pro ecigs was great & it was good that they showed him - twice.

I do think that there should be some standards & regulations about the juice - otherwise anyone can just jump on the band wagon & produce any old sort of stuff & flog it, possibly a bit cheaper.

I may get a flaming & I may be being prejudiced, but I won't buy Chinese juice & therefore pay a little more for mine.

My reasoning is that the UK companies that make & sell the juice have got a hell of a lot more to lose with the EU regs being imminent & want to be approved etc. Therefore they are taking more care over what goes into their juice & using better supplies.

OP posts:
Cantabile · 24/01/2014 19:37

Why oh why is itv player so useless? I have never seen a programme on it that I actually wanted to see (so I have never watched anything on it!). I wanted to see the Rise of ecigs, but it is not there Sad

Planet of the Vapes have a long thread in their forum about it. i read the first 8 pages or so. They say much the same as you guys. Factual errors; typical. Cheap (and bad) programme making, with inadequate research, perpetuating myths and scare mongering (oil??!!!! as you say, Queen).

magimedi · 24/01/2014 19:48

You may be able to download it from this site:

kickass.to/tonight-s16e03-the-rise-of-the-e-cigarette-720p-hdtv-x264-c4tv-t8646367.html

OP posts:
Weelady77 · 24/01/2014 19:52

My best friends mum has a chest infection she's a fag smoker and her doctor has wrote to her and advised her to vape!! That's came from a doctorSmile

Cantabile · 24/01/2014 19:55

Groovejet, those two kits look very similar. The clearomisers are different, and you get some extra bits with one of them (a mains charger I think? Worth having if you haven't got one imo, and a carry case - also worth having imo.)

One has MT3 clearos and the other has CE4s. You can replace the coil head with the MT3 I think, and you can't with the CE4. CE4s are very cheap so when they stop working you just chuck them, whereas with the MT3 you just put in a new head.

Price difference is minimal.

Choice of black or steel in one, whereas the other just black I think.

You will need liquid. How much do you smoke (lights/smooth or standard?). I use 18mg nicotine strength which is lower than recommended for my erstwhile consumption, but I'm OK with it. My brother uses 24mg. He smoked more than I did and I used smooth fags too. I read a study which said that people tend to start with a tobacco flavour but move swiftly on to other flavours. That has certainly been my experience.

I didn't steep at first, didn't know I was supposed to Grin. Now, most of my liquids get steeped as I have a fair few - got a bit excited about flavours in the early days! Now, I have a couple of favourite flavours of which I get 30ml, 50ml or 100ml at a time so that just sits steeping, and I fill 10ml bottles from them once in a while.

It took me a week, I think, to get through my first 10ml. Most places can get a bottle to you in a few days, so just keep an eye on your level, and when you find a flavour you like just order a larger amount.

Cantabile · 24/01/2014 19:59

magimedi thanks, seems it's blocked there.

Bother!

Cantabile · 24/01/2014 20:01

Weelady, my heart doctor was pleased when I told him I was vaping. Said it would make me more likely to be fit for surgery when I need it! Oh joy Hmm

groovejet · 24/01/2014 20:20

Thank you Cantabile, I probably smoke about 10 a day atm, maybe a few more on a weekend so would guess 18mg would be about right for me.

How long do the clearomisers last on average? I did read it is possible clean them out to make them last a bit longer.

Am interested in trying out the variety of flavors, can't believe how many there are to chose from.

QueenStromba · 24/01/2014 20:36

How strange - I watched it on ITV player last night. They must have had some complaints about the factual inaccuracies!

SumBex · 24/01/2014 20:37

I have a citrus punch taster from Joose juice and it's disgusting. It's been steeping for two weeks so hoping it improves given more time but it's very soapy tasting.

How strong should the flavours be? I've got a few now, hangsen and Joose juice but I would like them to be stronger tasting if possible. Does the flavour vary between suppliers or is it worth making my own to get a stronger flavour?

Are there any flavours anyone can recommend I try? I like fruit and sweet flavours - probably the sweet ones more (have loved both toffee and vanilla).

Still getting used to it but going well so far Smile.

Inthebeginning · 24/01/2014 21:42

hi,
I wondered if anyone Could help me.
My dad has been using e-cigs for two weeks now. I'm so proud of him.
Unfortunately he says they are costing more than his cigarettes. He worries he is using them more than he would originally smoke (he'd smoke a cigarette to its end at that would be it but with e cigs he doesn't have an 'end' iyswim.
Also he says that sometimes the new top end (filter?) doesn't always last as long as others.

is there anything anyone would reccomend? anything that might help him? I am so so proud of his determination.

MaggieMcGill · 24/01/2014 21:58

Queen I noticed there little gaff too with their graphic Smile They were talking about the programme on daybreak yesterday morning and Dr Hilary was on sounding very pro vaping but he'd like to see more regulating.

Sumbex I get most of my stuff from jj and yes sometimes I find that they could be doing with a little bit more flavour but I have bought more expensive liquids and thought the same. Tonight I've tried jj banana nut bread for the first time and I'm really enjoying it whereas I hated their banana? I have few bottles of Tjuice which is more expensive than jj and I can't really tell the difference, for example the tjuice strawberry is not much different to jj strawberries n cream although their raspberry ripple is nicer than jj raspberry but triple the price. I also bought 3 bottles from my local shop for £12.99 and wasn't that impressed. I think mixing your own May be the answer once you know what flavours you like. I'm still experimenting. Orange Cream is next Smile

MaggieMcGill · 24/01/2014 22:09

Inthebeginning is it the ones that look like cigs he is using? You can refill them with liquid rather than buying new ones. If he is serious then he should think about upgrading. It can be expensive when you first start out but no more than smoking 20 a day. Maybe get an ego starter kit and some liquid, he'd enjoy it more than the disposable one too. Sorry I'm still not good with the proper lingo but someone else can give you better ideas. Good on him though for going two weeks!

Cantabile · 24/01/2014 23:11

Inthebeginning, have a look at the links posted by Groovejet just upthread a bit. If your dad were to use something like those kits and just had to replenish his liquid then he'd save a lot of money. Cigalikes are more expensive and not so satisfying. My brother started on Sky cigs (they're cigalikes) and he wasn't too impressed - too unreliable, too expensive. He moved on to a JAK ego-type thing and liquids and hasn't looked back. He smoked about 60 a day and has just told me that he's had 6 today!

Sumbex, my favourite flavour is apple. No matter where I get it from or how long it steeps for, it is quite weak. I have some apple flavour concentrate and add a few drops of that to my clearo whenever I fill it up. It does help but is not ideal. It is one reason why I'm flirting with the idea of mixing my own.

Some flavours are stronger than others. Gingerbread is strong and really nice (Plenty's favourite?). As you liked the vanilla and the toffee, you may like RY4. It's a mix of vanilla and caramel. Loads of people love it. Bit like candyfloss!

QueenStromba · 24/01/2014 23:14

Sumbex my favourite flavours are Cookie and Forest Fruit by Flavour Art - you can get them both from Liberty Flights or direct from Flavour Art but that will take a couple of weeks at least to turn up (although they are cheaper if you are buying a few flavourings). They're just flavourings so you'd also need to buy the nicotine, PG and VG to mix with them. Since you aren't liking the strength of the flavours in the liquids you've tried then mixing your own is probably for you. It's also a hell of a lot cheaper than buying premixed.

Bargain Vapour is the cheapest I've seen for nicotine. VG is just glycerine that you can get in Boots. PG (propylene glycol) can be bought cheaply on ebay. The flavourings are actually the most expensive part of the e liquid if you mix yourself. I can do 30ml of 12mg for about £2.

DizzyZebra · 24/01/2014 23:51

inthebeginning The first e cig i ever used was a cig look alike with replacable tips and i found the exact same as your dad - They were so hit and miss, some would last a day, some three puffs and it was definitely getting more expensive than smoking.

Maggie Orange cream is like vaping the quality street/roses orange creams, its one of my favourite. Doesnt seem to take that long to steep, although ive found at about the two week mark the flavour disappears for a few days for some reason! Then comes back lol. Strange.

Allergictoironing · 25/01/2014 08:34

Post aimed mainly at groovejet and Inthebeginning, but is also a very simple guide for those who have been a bit overwhelmed by all the variety discussed on this thread. Experienced vapers either ignore, or check for errors please!

There can be a trade off to be considered around cost, variety, overall experience and hassle.

The cigalike ones are the simplest to deal with in that you just unscrew one cart & screw in another. These tend to be the type that you can buy at the local market or shopping centre for a comparatively cheap initial purchase, but the carts they use can be very expensive and tend to be limited in flavours/strengths depending on brand. They can be useful in that they are small, look the most like "real" cigs, and are the most hassle-free, but the experience really isn't as good as other methods and the cost is higher.

The next step is to have a battery and disposable tank type system (CE4 in my case) where you buy the different liquids and fill the tank yourself. The batteries last a few months to a year (about the same or a little longer than the cigalikes) and the tanks (clearomisers) last anything from a couple of weeks to a couple of months - this can be extended by cleaning, but the coils inside do eventually pack in. This method is much cheaper and gives a much more satisfying experience, but has the added faff of unscrewing and topping up the tank rather than just chucking the

You can then go further and use tanks that have replaceable wicks & coils, can be stripped down & "serviced" etc. There's also a lot of variety and complexity available in the overall set-up e.g. variable voltage batteries. All these add to the hassle factor but allow the overall experience to be much better fine tuned to suit the vaper. Cost is a moot point here - you will save money using serviceable tanks, but people that get really into this can spend a fair bit on shiney new toys!

When it comes to the "juice" or liquid there's a hell of a lot of different things to consider - nicotine strength, flavour, the balance of "throat hit" vs vapour etc. But basically there are 3 ways to get the right juice which are buy ready made from a big importer (limited options), buy made to order from a smaller supplier (needs to steep for a few days), or buy the makings & mix your own (hassle, mess & steeping). These have been ordered from minimum hassle/maximum price to maximum hassle/minimum cost.

I'm a naturally lazy person and comparatively new to vaping, so I have a battery & disposable tank system, and am currently buying imported juice (Hangsen pineapple and Smartjuice Red tobacco flavour) which I know has steeped plenty while being shipped over and both brands have very good quality control. I will probably go directly to mostly mixing my own once I get a bit more money at the end of the month to buy all the bits & base liquids, though will probably continue buying the Smartjuice tobacco flavour because I like it so much! I doubt I will go down the road of serviceable tanks unless I get a nice glass one eventually.

Allergictoironing · 25/01/2014 09:04

Oh forgot to say. Those who like the look & feel of the cigalike (size, shape etc) I do know a place who does mini-tanks that fit on their cigalike batteries Smile

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