to think BIL is a cheeky bugger and a chip off the old block?

[JackSparrow]

There is a lot of back story here, so this could be long, sorry.

My PIL are toxic. Pretty hideous stuff, and I have no contact with them. The dc haven't seen them for about 4 years, i think, apart from the odd brief chat on Skype (has maybe happened 3 times in total), following a huge row at their golden wedding celebration (when I say at, I mean around the time, not brawling at the actual party!)

So, earlier this year, PIL started making noises about MIL's 80th birthday next Easter. Apparently she has never had a big birthday bash (FIL has had several), and FIL thought it would be nice for her to have a party. So far so good.

Of course, it isn't that easy, and to cut a long story short, FIL wanted dh and his brothers to pay for the party. It is their duty apparently . Not just any party, mind you, but she wanted a long weekend in London, at a private club, with relatives/friends flown over from Europe (at dh's/BIL's expense ), put up at the club, formal dinner, plus sightseeing tours and experiences (and other meals obviously). Stupid amount of money that we don't have to spare. To top it all off, when dh and I mentioned that this didn't really suit our family (we have 5 dc between us, 2 learning disabled, the other 3 too young to enjoy this kind of weekend, so not suitable for any of them - they make up a third of the grandchildren), and suggested a couple of alterations to make it bearable (theatre instead of one activity, afternoon tea at the Ritz/other posh hotel instead of one of the formal meals), FIL threw his toys out of the pram, said it was his way or no way at all, and that it wasn't about our children (true, but who did he want to pay? ah yes, us.). Cue MIL phoning us up, crying lots about us spoiling it all, saying she would have to see 'our lot' another weekend (she has never met our youngest child, and is showing no inclination to want to do so), and still expecting dh to foot a third of the bill, despite only him being able to attend.

Anyway, another big-ish row followed, and the upshot was that the party was cancelled (or at least stopped being discussed openly).

This weekend we received an email from BIL (dh's older brother, not the closest of relationships, but cordial enough at the moment).

He is proposing the following:

At some point next summer (a date conveniently coinciding with a big birthday of his ), the family should:

have a Thursday/Friday in London - dinner, theatre for whoever wants to go (ostensibly to celebrate MIL's birthday 3 months earlier)
then everyone back to theirs (huge house) on the Friday, for a formal dinner for MIL's birthday (marquee in garden, for 20 max, apparently - this is odd, as with all brothers and grandchildren, numbers reach 18, so presumably just family - why the marquee?)

On Saturday a BBQ, and local circus for those who want to.

Then, andthis is the bit where I immediately thought 'cheeky sod' - Saturday night, a party for around 100, in the marquee, to celebrate BIL's birthday.

BIL wants the costs shared, as it is for MIL too.

AIBU to think that BIL has just tacked on the bits for MIL (considering family would be there anyway if he had a party on the Saturday), mentioned the circus etc to make it seem like a weekend of events, when in fact he wants everyone else to stump up for his birthday party? He is just as bad as PIL, isn't he? (well, to be fair, he hasn't actively banned young children, and has considered them in his plan, so not quite as bad). He has been upfront and said he can't afford a party by himself, so won;t have one if we don't agree to share costs, but I am still left with thinking 'why would we pay for this?'

Not only would I not pay for it, but I would bin the lot of them. They sound awful. Why would anyone even want people like that in their lives? You aren't losing anything by telling such horrible people to sod off.

I think that if you can't afford to pay for your own party, you don't have one. If someone else who wants you to have one offers to pay, then great. But you shouldn't expect or ask others to pay.

Thanks.

Revels - well, I have binned them. I haven't spoken to PIL in 4 years (apart from answering MIL calls when dh had to have a serious operation earlier this year). We don't see BILs regularly either, but get on ok when we do infrequently (think once every couple of years) meet.

Hercy - quite. I asked dh what his brothers or parents would have said if we had asked them to stump up for his 50th a couple of years ago.

dh is wavering, however. I know he will end up paying something. He is not ready to bin them all, and clings to the idea of a happy family (which only happens at big parties, there is not 'family' otherwise - no popping in and out, or regular contact at all). And it is going to piss me off no end when he pays out fro us to attend a party which is only going to be difficult for us, and incur further expense (suitable accomodation as BIL's place won't be suitable, babysitters (have to be specialised) etc. And then, tbh, it won't even be fun for me.

Absolutely no fucking way would I be footing the bill for a celebration that has nothing to do with my family, is being arranged by people who don't give a crap about my family and is for people who are so totally unable to compromise. They sound like absolute shits of the highest order.

NOOOOOOO! Not a bloody PENNY from you and your family. They sound a ghastly lot and you're right to keep well away.

If your DH is feeling guilty, suggest he arranges a day out for MIL with the DCs or just him. He can set his own budget for it that you can afford, and be in control of what happens. If MIL rejects this, then if she wants to plan her own event, then she can pay for it. If BIL would like to arrange his own event, he can pay for it.

dh knows all this already (paying for stuff not changing things, the control aspect, no point to any of it as his parents will still be self centred arseholes), but he won't change either.

he does feel guilty, and sad too that he has such a dysfunctional family. he said when we were talking about it i was saying over my dead body do we pay a penny that he would like to go to this one, as DNiece has been saying for ages that she would like to visit more often etc (she is mid twenties), see her young cousins etc, and by going we might spark this off. she is lovely, but she has been saying this for about 8 years now, and never come to see us (we are not far from london, and she is constantly passign through London) - why on earth would she change now?

We have offered MIL similar (see suggestions for altered plans for ehr original party) - her response is that her birthday is about her, and she doesn't want to have to think about children on that day. Fine - her birthday, do it her way, pay for it herself.

Are we really so unreasonable to think that if we are expected to foot the bill (or a large part thereof) the party/events/weekend should be accessible to our family? We are not demanding that it be so - if she doesn't want that, then we are vary happy to wish her well, hope she has a lovely time etc, but to still expect us to pay? Beggars belief, imo.

I feel we are being railroaded by BIL. MIL's original party plans got shelved because we were so unreasonable , ie wouldn't pay for a shedload of others to enjoy a no-expenses spared weekend which we couldn't go to ourselves. Now he has this alternative plan, and has said upfront to say now if not interested/able/willing to pay as he cannot afford it. If dh says no, then he scuppers MIL's reorganised birthday, as well as BIL's party too.

I guess most of all he doesn't want to be the one continually saying no, and being made out to be the unreasonable one. much as I don't want ot be the one constantly pointing out that his family are taking the piss, tbh.

BUt I also don't want to be forking out thousands for an event that will not be particularly enjoyable for, or welcoming to, half my family.

her birthday is about her and she doesn't want to have to think about children on the day

and these are her grandchildren she is talking about?!

would i fuck pay for any of it. if they want a posh "family" do but are happy to ignore a third of the children in the family then let them get on with it.

if your DH desperately feels he needs to go then let him, but don't foot the bill for the rest of the family.

yes, her grandchildren.

for the original plans, it was deemed that no one under 18 could attend the formal dinner - this knocked out 6 of her 10 grandchildren (3 of ours, 3 of younger BIL's). I would assume that the rules for the dinner party BIL is proposing for MIL are similar (BIL's children are both in their 20s, so it wouldn't occur to him to do anything different).

part of the original falling out, years ago, was over a similar issue, so this is not news to us. She has sent dc2 a birthday card probably 3 times (dc2 will be 7 next year). dc1 gets to share a card with dh, as their birthdays are only 3 weeks apart , so has never had one from her. dc3 has never had one either (only 2, so hasn't noticed yet!)

they manage to make it sound as though we are trying to get everything to revolve around our children, but I honestly don't think we are. Accessible to children (eg posh afternoon tea and then theatre) is not the same as child-centred, is it? Or am I delusional?

Mindy - to be clear, dh and I have half the grandchildren between us, but 2 are adult, so 'only' a third of her grandchildren would be particularly unwelcome, although another third are also pre-teens, so not 'allowed' at formal dinners (although they are unlikely to attend as live overseas)

If you don't see them & the kids haven't seen them for about 4yrs, it beggars belief to me that they're even talking to you about this tbh.

Let alone expecting you to contribute financially & them still getting it all their owm way.

What a shame that your husband can't see them for what they are.

If you & the kids aren't going to go, can he be trusted to go to something & just pay his own way?

Can he afford counselling?

That would probably cost a lot less than the events being planned!

I would be tempted to e-mail them with your big expensive plans for dh's 55th birthday party in a couple of years time. Tell them you are giving them plenty of warning so that they will have plenty of time to save and send you a third of the cost each. I think your dh will be spending his birthday weekend in a very expensive hotel with all the family.

It would be interesting to see what their response is.

oh, and I have no problem with dh going (apart from the fact that the usual airbrushing out of me as dh's second wife will carry on unchecked if he does). in fact, it is the preferred solution for me. I would far rather my children have absolutely nothing to do with the lot of them, but dh is desperate to cling on to any idea of family.

dc2 had a Grandparents day at school last term. My uncle went as at least the same generation, being her great-uncle (and she has no grandparents on my side). She came home from school and asked 'mum, who is my Grandma?' which said it all to me.

I don't need any of my dc to have a dysfunctional relationship with these people. I don't want them to go, have a good time (which thye well might), and get to know people who are going to snub them at most other points of the year.

Just don't pay anything what a bunch of horrible bastards.

On the whole I don't care too much what people want to do as long as they pay themselves & don't moan if it doesn't suit others-financially or otherwise!

diddl, dh is talking about contributing on a scaled down basis (ie only towards the bits we can all go to). I still think it a bloody cheek, tbh.

they are asking dh because they think he has pots of excess cash. We are far from badly off, but have extra expenses due to dc's disabilities (I can't work, for eg). dh had a huge 50th bash a couple of years ago. I saw them then, but the dc didn't (the dc didn't come to the evening do, and the PIL weren't invited to our house (my stipulation) for the rest of the weekend's events). I think they want similar, and think dh can afford to shell out for their party too (I guess we could find the money, but why the hell shoudl we?!)

coppertop - I think we both know that the resounding silence woudl speak volumes

I'd tell them to fuck off.

But if your dh wants to contribute a suitable compromise might be that you will share the cost of the catering for Friday night (mil party for 18) but not the marquee since this is not needed for mil party, and not bil party costs since this should be paid for by him if he wants a party

Do not pay. Do not go. Offer MiL a celebration with YOUR family that suits you, if you must. Why can't she enjoy several birthday parties?

My sisters and I tried to book a holiday together one year. One sister (who always gets her own way) did not work with the rest of us for a compromise (date / location / cost) but just booked a massive expensive house without checking first. I felt guilted into going but my DH said, No. We only pay what we can afford, for dates we can manage, in a location that suits us. The venue was miles away, dates were wrong, the cost was that of a foreign holiday in 5* accommodation (and it was in NORFOLK). We didn't go. The thing folded. She lost her deposit. Her fault for not listening.

You need that kind of back up. Find a strong friend and practice saying NO.

On the whole I don't care too much what people want to do as long as they pay themselves & don't moan if it doesn't suit others-financially or otherwise!

this is exactly what I think. when dh & I said that we wished MIL well with her original plans, and that she had a fab time, we genuinely meant it. If she doesn't want to do things which our family can attend, then fine (really, truly). Young childrne and disabilities are restrictive. and that's fine.

but to guilt trip us with tears and cancellations because we won't pay for things we can't attend, when she keeps banging on about a family party being important yet won't compromise at all (just to be clear, there is no reason why our dc can't attend formal dinners - they behave well, and we recently had a 2 1/2 hour lunch on holiday (dc are 8, 6 and 2!)) i just beyond the pale, surely?

As has been said before - if you want a big party surely you pay for it or your family decide they will treat you to it and check with you if that is okay or they surprise you. The person celebrating does not decide what the budget will be and tell you how much you are going to pay in order that they might have a fabulous celebration of their very own birth day!

How many of us have family just like this? It is so infuriating! I really feel sorry for you and your DH dilemma and the problem is that this kind of family just keep doing this kind of thing. If they were friends you would drop them the problem is them being family. I would say change your phone number, move house move country cut all ties but unfortunately that is a lot easier said than done.

YA so NBU!

And everyone should pay for their own theatre tickets / circus tickets and bring contributions for the bbq. Like it is for most family events.

Just no.

If they want you to attend a party, they can invite you & pay for it themselves

How much money do they want from you?

Frankly, they all sound horrible!