To think its not ok to call people mental

[LEMisafucker]

It would appear that mental health is one of those areas where it is still OK to be prejudiced. To the extent where people do it without any real malice and would probably realise they are causing upset.

But the thing is, it DOES upset me and i am pretty sure it upsets others.

It upsets me because i a have fairly minor mental health issues, they often quite a negative impact on my life but its ok, im on medication, it helps. Other people aren't quite so lucky and their illnesses have a huge impact.

Over and over i see this on threads - Well, shes mental or she needs her meds The connotation being that a person is derranged or barking mad.

In tesco they have a halloween costume called "mental patient"

I suppose i am technically a mental patient - but im not likely to go running down the street murdering people and social services have not seen fit to remove my children.

I don't want to upset anyone but mental illness has enough taboo, people don't seek help because they are ashamed as it is still so misunderstood - something that isn't spoken about, but still joked about.

I know this may seem trivial to some people but I have had people treat me differently because i have had some mh problems - nothing major really, PND and anxiety, but you can see people sort of taking a step back say if you tell them you are on ADs. I have learnt its better not to tell anyone, but if i were a diabetic i wouldn't feel the need to keep that a secret.

I just wanted to challenge the taboo a bit (apologies if it was comments on another thread that made me want to post this but didn't want to "kick off" on the thread anymore than i did and hijack, it just really gets me down)

The definitions thing is a distraction.

Dictionaries are written in order to do several things. They record the etymology of a word, ie., where it comes from. They record its historical usage. And they record its current usage.

They don't often comment on whether or not something is offensive - if you look at the OED, it very rarely labels a word 'derogatory', and only when it is very well-established as derogatory.

Dictionaries are not written by people whose primary concern is being polite in society.

Of course, people make mistakes and use words in innocence. No-one, I think, seriously feels an innocent mistake is as bad as a deliberate slur. But justifying something because others are ignorant is a particularly nasty activity, I think.

Lots of words change their meaning over time.

I could probably think of a better example, but the 'modern' use of the word awesome is wildest accepted to just mean something is great or cool, not actually awe inspiring, as it once meant.

But if you apply a word that means mentally ill to describe someone who isn't mentally ill but is acting odd or in a manner you don't like (which, let's face it, is the main way "mental" gets used) then you are using mental illness in a derogatory way.

Put it like this, if someone says, "eurgh that's gay" when talking about something or someone who isn't homosexual, is that less offensive?

alexa, have you patended a diagnostic system unknown to modern science?!

Or how do you know that somene acting 'oddly' or 'bizarrely' or 'mental' (as you choose to put it) doesn't have a mental illness, or other diagnosis?

No-one is disputing that words change meaning over time. Is this relevant in some way?

But that's where you are missing my point.

I am not justifying it, or suggesting its use is in ignorance. I am suggesting that the modern definition of the word mental is used to mean something different to your definition of pertaining to a mental health issue.

I am saying that where i am, and the circles I socialise in, it is widely used as a term to describe a particularly unusual or wild situation.

And I think that definition is perfectly acceptable.

Like I say, it is possibly a colloquialism as I am not experienced in all regions and dialects of the UK, and the word isn't really in common usage in the states.

I didn't definte the world, alexa.

And I fully understand that you socialize with people who're happy to use this term as you describe. That doesn't make it ok.

Once upon a time, as a colloquialism, 'n**r' was acceptable, too. And for a long time, people insisted that 'well, in my circle, it is fine! We're perfectly lovely! Why, we consider those people almost like family when they work for us.'

lrd - because I'm referring to its use to describe a situation, not a person.

Alexa, you're contradicting yourself. You used the word " mental" to describe the behavior of the mother in the other thread. You were not meaning it in the sense of having a wild/great time. It was used in a derogatory way.

The mother's conduct could have been described as being an overreaction, odd, bizarre, OTT, peculiar, strange or any number of ways without calling her "mental"

Riiiight.

No, sorry, that doesn't make it ok.

I don't quite understand where this is confusing you, but it's late, so I shall bow out.

One of my friends is a MH specialist, and used the word to describe situations.

I really find it quite offensive that you'd liken her use of a word, which I am willing to accept is a colloquialism, as akin to the use of nigger.

(Apologies, obviously - I hope! - that was to alexa not caitlin, who makes perfect sense.)

"One of my friends is a MH specialist, and used the word to describe situations."

Oh well that's ok then, because specialists never say or do stupid things.

Ah, but alexa, you're probably just finding it offensive cos we're in a different 'circle', innit.

Leaving aside the fact that I don't think I did 'liken' those two situations, did I?

What you say to people you know privately Alexa (like SP and her mum) is different to saying it on a public forum where you don't know how it's going to be taken.

I say things to DH that wouldn't be appropriate to say on here, but that's nobody's business but our own.

Saying something to everyone just needs a bit of care, and as you seem able to communicate very effectively in your posts there's no reason not to is there?

Amen to that, agent.

And now I really am going. Night all.

Oh hang on, just reread your first post on this thread Alexa

"but using the word 'mental' to describe someone who is behaving in a bizarre and irrational manner (as per the thread you are referring to) isn't offensive. It's descriptive - as in pertaining to disorders of the mind."

So your "circle" only uses "mental" when describing wild situations right? Definitely not to refer to people or disorders of the mind?

People do use mental to describe situations. I stated at the start that I did and as did some others. I think context is the key thing tbh.

I have said I've had a mental night but I haven't said she's mental. I see that the second can be offensive as its applied to a person.

SP That's it really, context is key.

Well, I have to say, when I hear the word 'mental' used as a derogatory term, I'm less worried about the word than I am about whether or not it's being used by someone who is merely thoughtless (lot of that about, life's too short, possibly a small verb. sap. to be delivered, nothing more) or bigoted (and I can get ... tetchy with such people.)

I say mad, and crazy, and idiotic, and foolish. Which I think all have a similar root.

I don't say mental, and it makes me wince. Not sure why there's a difference. I suspect because it so clearly references mental health, whereas the others have a much wider use.

I'm not over keen on the word "bastard" being used offensively, and that's another one that seems to have lost its sting for most.

When I'm talking about my last episode with my CPN I describe it as me being "proper nut job crazy" and "completely mental". I am bipolar type I, manic - I don't know how else to describe it. I wouldn't call anyone else those words, but joking about it almost makes me feel better.

as opposed to "a bit down" or "feeling depressed" "feeling anxious" "wound up" - "proper nut job crazy" is me attacking psychiatric nurses, believing my child is Stalin reincarnated, believing there is a conspiracy to hide my bowls and spoons to make me look crazy.

Artemisia, it's a convenient shorthand, isn't it? There's really no other word for the state of mind you're in when you screw the front door shut and try and remain perfectly quiet to hear EVERYTHING.

Changed my mind slightly after a parking thread, it's not okay to attack someone using the words 'crazy' or 'loon'