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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

To think its not ok to call people mental

145 replies

LEMisafucker · 27/10/2013 21:59

It would appear that mental health is one of those areas where it is still OK to be prejudiced. To the extent where people do it without any real malice and would probably realise they are causing upset.

But the thing is, it DOES upset me and i am pretty sure it upsets others.

It upsets me because i a have fairly minor mental health issues, they often quite a negative impact on my life but its ok, im on medication, it helps. Other people aren't quite so lucky and their illnesses have a huge impact.

Over and over i see this on threads - Well, shes mental or she needs her meds The connotation being that a person is derranged or barking mad.

In tesco they have a halloween costume called "mental patient" Hmm

I suppose i am technically a mental patient - but im not likely to go running down the street murdering people and social services have not seen fit to remove my children.

I don't want to upset anyone but mental illness has enough taboo, people don't seek help because they are ashamed as it is still so misunderstood - something that isn't spoken about, but still joked about.

I know this may seem trivial to some people but I have had people treat me differently because i have had some mh problems - nothing major really, PND and anxiety, but you can see people sort of taking a step back say if you tell them you are on ADs. I have learnt its better not to tell anyone, but if i were a diabetic i wouldn't feel the need to keep that a secret.

I just wanted to challenge the taboo a bit (apologies if it was comments on another thread that made me want to post this but didn't want to "kick off" on the thread anymore than i did and hijack, it just really gets me down)

OP posts:
Blu · 27/10/2013 22:26

Tesco (and the other big supermarkets) no longer have the horrendous 'mental patient' costume.

Due to widespread outrage they withdrew it and at leas one of the big supermarkets made a sizable donation to Mind.

So there is a strong feeling within society that they are not prepared to see mental health patients stereotyped.

It isn't acceptable.

But sometimes language habits die hard, and may people probably don' make the obvious connection between 'mental' and 'mental health illness'

TwerkingNineToFive · 27/10/2013 22:27

I actually posted something today saying that lack of sleep can drive you 'mental' I suppose I did mean you can genuinely end up mentally ill with extreme sleep deprivation but in hind sight it was said very flippantly.
I know this isn't exactly what you mean but it's still the same thing really. I am going to make sure I no longer use the term.
In the north east where I'm from it's said a lot so is never really thought about it. So thanks for bringing it to my attention Smile

LEMisafucker · 27/10/2013 22:29

Backonlybriefly "don't be stupid" thats another one of those context things, if someone is being a dick you might say that - its crap but not as crap as "you ARE stupid" if that makes sense. It is like the word cretin - which is what you might call someone who you felt was the lowest of the low, but this is actually a term for a physical disability :(

I think that mental health issues need to be less taboo, people should feel like they can speak more openly about them, they wont all the while they are seen as something slightly comical!

OP posts:
AlexaChelsea · 27/10/2013 22:29

YANBU, in part, but using the word 'mental' to describe someone who is behaving in a bizarre and irrational manner (as per the thread you are referring to) isn't offensive. It's descriptive - as in pertaining to disorders of the mind.

Saying someone needs to take their meds, in that context, is offensive and presumptuous.

Really, using the word crazy would probably be the most offensive descriptor, yet it is a perfectly accepted commonly used word.

LEMisafucker · 27/10/2013 22:32

Blu, i think you are probably right about the language/semantics of it.

I am going to go and do a double check up at tesco tomorrow though as i am pretty sure i saw this costume on display yesterday in their sale section.

OP posts:
WorraLiberty · 27/10/2013 22:34

I suppose it's like the word lame

To call someone lame is imo quite disablist.

But to say, "That's a lame excuse" seems perfectly fine to me.

I'm unsure why though?

KissesBreakingWave · 27/10/2013 22:34

TwerkingNineToFive, that's actually true. Sleep deprivation psychosis is a real thing. And no fucking fun at all, take it from me. It can also trigger manic states.

LEMisafucker · 27/10/2013 22:37

Alexa - i disagree, mental actually pertains to the mind full stop, whether that is order or disorder. Mental health for instance can be describing someone's mental well being. "Time to talk" have a good banner thingy that i used to have on my facebook "We all have mental health".

I would have said that the women in that thread was "barking" myself, but if i am being pedantic about the use of the word "mental" then im not sure "barking" is ok either.

Crazy? no, i think crazy isn't as offensive - crazy = crazed; erratic, manic behaviour. So no, I wouldn't be offended by crazy because i am not crazy, I have mental health issues, general anxiety disorder, i am not crazy (or at least i hope not Grin)

OP posts:
Strumpetron · 27/10/2013 22:37

Not really sure to be honest. I have no qualms with people saying 'thats mental' or 'thats crazy'. Telling someone to take their meds though is deserving of a mouthful - horrible thing to say.

I really dislike the idea of people feeling they can't say those words for fearing of offending - probably because I know it's not being done maliciously and those words have taken a context of their own now.

I also think that if we want people to understand mental health more, censoring things isn't going to help it just makes it more taboo to speak about.

I've suffered with mental illness since I was 17ish, depression, anxiety etc. Finally got diagnosed with bi-polar type 2 a couple of years ago and what annoys me more is people's misconception of bi-polar - manic depressive- disorder. Like people on my facebook saying 'omg so bi-polar today, mood swings to death' Hmm

AlexaChelsea · 27/10/2013 22:37

worra

Lame has two definitions - one for someone who is physically unable to walk due to injury, and one for something that is a poor or flimsy excuse.

One word, two meanings.

killpeppa · 27/10/2013 22:37

I'm sorry if I caused offence.

I also have suffered mental health issues but I wouldn't think twice about calling someone mental, where I live you'd say it like 'your silly' ' your an idiot'(like in a funny way)

so again I apologise, as I can see my words have obviously upset you, I previously issued an apology in the other thread prior to seeing this.
I was meaning to sound sarcastic but it didn't come across that way & sounded dick-ish (if that's a word)

hope you accept my apology for my thoughtlessness with words Thanks

LEMisafucker · 27/10/2013 22:41

killpeppa - apology was accepted on other thread with offer of Cake Grin

I'm not upset, now im thinking maybe im a bit over sensitive about it.

OP posts:
AgentZigzag · 27/10/2013 22:43

'I also think that if we want people to understand mental health more, censoring things isn't going to help it just makes it more taboo to speak about.'

Even with all the words that aren't acceptable around racism/sexism/disablism now Strumpetron?

This isn't jumping on a bandwagon, and I sometimes have trouble in saying what I want to in case I use the wrong phrase or word, but it's about not defining people with MH problems as 'other'.

I don't want to be even more 'other' than I am already.

LRDtheFeministDragon · 27/10/2013 22:43

alexa, sorry, but that's a truly terrible apology for an excuse.

AlexaChelsea · 27/10/2013 22:44

I genuinely don't find mental an offensive word. I think it's taking it too far to be honest.

As long as it's not used in a genuine way. Calling someone with MH issues mental, would be offensive. Calling someone mental because they are acting crazy and aloof, well it's just a descriptor. Not offensive, IMO.

A bit like 'are you blind?' If someone doesn't see something. Not offensive, I doubt many blind people would take offense at this, but would be if directed in an offensive tone at someone with sight problems (not a great example!).

I guess what I mean is it's not an something to take offense at. Having MH issues isn't something to be ashamed of, therefore being described as 'mental' isn't offensive.

I do object to the use of 'psychotic', 'manic', 'bi-polar', 'depressed' etc when used by ignorant idiots who think a bad day pertains to a serious medical condition.

WorraLiberty · 27/10/2013 22:45

Oh I've just looked up the definition AlexaChelsea and you're right.

It does give two different meanings for the same word.

killpeppa · 27/10/2013 22:45

well maybe I should choose my words a but more wisely next time :)

LRDtheFeministDragon · 27/10/2013 22:47

But, alexa, think about why 'mental' is used to describe someone acting 'crazy and aloof'.

It's because we associate those qualities with someone with mental difficulties.

You can't dictate what people are upset by. If you continue to name-call people by calling them 'mental', it'll keep being offensive. If you stopped, it'd probably stop being upsetting.

Same with other terms. A teacher I had used to say 'are you "special"?', meaning, do you have 'special needs'. It's exactly the same thing, and I promise you, having seen my little brother who did have special needs in tears over it many times, it is not fun to be the butt of a joke even when it's not directed at you.

Strumpetron · 27/10/2013 22:52

agent I can't articulate myself properly at the minute but I do think that words end up having different meanings and used in different contexts, and I accept that. I don't for one second find anything offensive in someone going 'wow that's mental!'. I can't really think of any racist ones? That's just me though, people are open to feeling differently.

I do not however believe they should be used in a derogatory manner, ie 'youre mental you'.

Like 'murder'. It's original meaning is an horrific act, whereas now we all say 'ooo I could murder a roast'.

Personally I just think we have so much more to tackle in regards to mental illness understanding, that our time could go to.

HaroldLloyd · 27/10/2013 22:52

Funny you should start this thread I was thinking of this type of stuff today.

I guess a lot of it is in the context and way used. "Take your meds" is something I'd never say but like a few others I do say things like that's mental about a strange situation.

Or something like that was bonkers.

I'd hate to think I was offending anyone.

I think using MN can make you a lot more aware of the language you use and how it could affect someone.

Strumpetron · 27/10/2013 22:54

Although I'm being a hypocrite here because if I heard someone using the 'retard' word I'd be furious.

maddening · 27/10/2013 22:55

In the vein of calling someone "Mental" being offensive why is "crazy" less offensive just as you aren't impacted in that way where others might be - surely if you imply "mental" is offensive then the same applies to other such illnesses/symptoms etc?

Not disagreeing with your op just felt the comment that crazy was fine as you aren't "crazy" in the clinical definition was hypocritical.

AlexaChelsea · 27/10/2013 22:57

In that case, you shouldn't call people crazy or aloof either then!

When someone is acting in a manner considered by most to be bizarre, then a word will be used to describe them. Something bland and generic such as mental/crazy/aloof/odd isn't offensive. Something like psychotic/manic etc, is very specific and because it is incorrectly identifying behaviour with a serious condition, it's misleading and breeds ignorance.

Mental is in reference to the mind. If you perceive someone to be acing in manner that isn't, in your opinion, acceptable or regular behavior, then using a word that pertains to the mind is acceptable. It's descriptive and generic, not to mention vague.

Special is offensive. Because it's specific and derogatory.

Believe me , these aren't just my wild opinions. It's how I feel, whether or not it's a mainstream opinion I don't know. But I often think the people who get offended are the ones who are offended on behalf of the the 'sufferers'. In psychiatric hospitals, the way patients refer to themselves is often as mental, and it's all a bit tongue in cheek. In fact, it's more often as 'a mental'. So I am not offended when others use it in a similarly lighthearted way. It's non specific.

But when my sister, who has severe SN is upset because someone who is NT but behaving badly is described as special/handicapped/retarded.. That's offensive.

Strumpetron · 27/10/2013 22:58

But I often think the people who get offended are the ones who are offended on behalf of the the 'sufferers'

Agree with this 100%.

LRDtheFeministDragon · 27/10/2013 23:04

I don't call people 'crazy', alexa. And I'd say 'aloof' is quite rude if you're saying 'you're aloof'.

And I wouldn't describe your sister using any of those disablist terms either. Nor would any other decent person.

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