to be concerned about my friend giving birth in the USA?

[YoniGetAnOohWithTyphoo]

My friend 'P' got pregnant by an american citizen (unplanned, on holiday kind of thing...) anyway, cut a long story short: he has said that whilst he isn't interested in her (and much less in coming over to the UK to play happy families), he, and moreover his mother, seem very keen for P to come over and give birth in the US, all expenses paid.

Whilst this seems like a nice gesture on the face of it, i'm a bit worried. Notwithstanding the fact that P seems to honestly think she's gonna fly to the USA alone at about 35 weeks pregnant (don't they have rules about this sort of thing?) with all the suitcases in tow, if a baby is born in the USA i'm worried it will be an 'american citizen' and as such, won't just be allowed to fly back to the UK. Do any mumsnetters know about this?

I'm haven't said much yet because I don't want to hurt her feelings or scare her, I know at the end of the day it's her choice... but I can't help thinking she hasn't thought this through. What do you guys think?

Or OP, just call the US immigration services and let them know the day she will be arriving and what her plan is. They will send her back and it will be the best thing you ever do for this woman.

Also she should ask for her mum/friend to go out with her to be birth partner and carer/etc. She needs to have a friendly face there to support her in a foreign land with virtual strangers controlling things.

And she should ask them to stump up for all their costs too - maybe not for a full 90 days but for at least a couple of weeks beyond her 42nd week so she has a couple of weeks support immediately after birth. (even just to ensure she isn't bullied into signing away the baby!)

Oh yes and also let us immigration know, and the airline and the airport and anyone else you can think of that could introduce complications to travel bribe the doc to say she's not fit to travel...

Caitlin - that's what I meant (though maybe didn't express it clearly enough). If she has the baby in the UK and he's not there, and they're not married, he won't be named on the birth certificate. I'd be tempted in her situation.

I doubt that an agreement such as that would hold any water and how is a friend with her going to help when they won't let mum leave the country with baby?

Even if the agreement is enforceable, she still has to get it into a court which takes time and money. She certainly doesn't have time (90 day stay and after that she's in the country illegally - what a nice and convenient bullet for dad's/grandma's legal arsenal) and seeing as she's considering taking the money that's being offered and flying I'm guessing she doesn't have much money either.

I can't believe any airline would allow her on the plane(?) Subterfuge & deviance all the way.

BA allows up to 36 weeks....

I'm not sure that the US would let her in anyway if she is obviously pregnant when she arrives. They would expect her to show that she has adequate medical insurance and that she intends to leave before giving birth (i.e. before 36 weeks).

my thoughts exactly.

IF she gets let on the plane this end at all, she is a high risk of being deported straight back. IF by a miracle she gets in, any travel insurance that she may get will be invalid as pregnancy is a pre-existing condition. So even IF the sperm donor pays the baby's costs, someone will need to pay hers. IF the birth goes wrong she will be in the USA racking up massive medical bills. IF she needs repatriation home the only way to pay will be by bankrupting her entire family.

please, please, show her this and explain why it is such a stupid idea.

Actually no, travel insurance is available to travelling pregnant mothers....but I do sincerely hope that immigration turns her away.

Zipzap, your post about some sort of agreement. Even if it were possible under UK and US law to have such an agreement where one party unequivocally gives up rights (and bear in mind there are rights you can't just "give up")you'd need a team of lawyers in both jurisdictions working on it and for it to go through the proper process.

As for the US side not agreeing, if I were them what have they to lose? It'd be barely worth the paper it's written on.

Wibbly, noted sorry, I was a bit terse in my reply.

I really think you and her family need to deter her from such a decision.

There is obviously an agenda here. If the father was sincere, why doesn't he fly over from the US? He wouldn't have to pay anything towards the birth so all he'll save on that could be used for accommodation, with no doubt plenty to spare - he could even bring his mother with him.

I think taking a woman out of her home country is not on anyway to be honest and it's not like America has better health care or cheaper health care, as neither is true.

just call the US immigration services and let them know the day she will be arriving and what her plan is. They will send her back and it will be the best thing you ever do for this woman.

I think this is one of the best suggestions on the whole thread.

The US immigration would not care if she was pregnant and coming to the USA. She is not breaking any laws. Her child will be considered an American citizen by birth (as long as she fills the paperwork out before the child turns 18) because its father is an American citizen so she would not be considered to be trying to get something she is not entitled to by giving birth in the USA. The only difference will be that if she gives birth in the UK, she will have to apply for a US Citizen birth abroad birth certificate at the US embassy. Unless her child turns out to be some sort of superstar who is earning significant amounts of money as a child, he/she will not be required to file tax returns. You are not required to file a tax return if you have no income.

It's also worth noting that it's much easier to get child support payment enforced in the USA than in the UK. So if the father is acknowledging his paternity, he will have to help support the child until it is 18. And if he isn't, it's not difficult in the USA to get a court to order a paternity test to make a determination and get the support anyway. Also, although fathers have much more equal rights in the USA to parenthood than in the UK, there would normally have to be pretty serious extenuating circumstances for a court to take away a newborn from its mother (especially if bfing).
However, having said all of that, your friend really should be aware of the risks involved. And of how isolating having a child in a foreign country away from your friends and family can be.

You have ALWAYS had to file taxes. But as of next July the law changes and all your banks internationally have to start reporting back to America and you can be fined,

I wish people would watch the news or at least google something if they think someone is incorrect before stating something as wrong.

www.bbc.co.uk/news/magazine-24135021

www.economist.com/news/united-states/21587815-loopy-tax-rules-spur-expats-renounce-their-american-citizenship-overtaxed-and-over-there

I very much disagree also that Us Immigration would have no issue with a woman with no insurance coming to America because she says the baby's father is American.

She will have no way to pay for the birth, likely have to overstay her 90 day visa... and unless she has a DNA test prenatally can not prove an American is the father anyway! But the child regardless of parentage WILL then be eligible to citizenship by virtue of birth.

child support I agree with you though, don't know how it works internationally but if the father is a soldier I think they will actually garnish wages directly

I also strongly disagree that the US would not care about a heavily pregnant woman arriving in the US. They have no way of knowing that the father is American do they? She isn't married, engaged or even in a long term relationship with him. I very much doubt that they would just take her (or his) word for it.

Although you can get travel insurance when pregnant it won't cover giving birth around the time of your due date. It is hardly be an "unforeseen circumstance".

You don't have to file taxes if you have little or no income.

Courts will readily garnish wages of any type (you don't have to be a soldier) and take away drivers licenses as well. It's not so straightforward if the father is self-employed, but even that works better in the USA than in the UK.

It's not against the rules to come to the USA pregnant specifically to give birth in the USA. In fact from the Center of Immigration Studies: "Presently there is no prohibition, nor concerted U.S. government effort to stop, individuals from taking advantage of our liberal citizenship policies in order to make their children instant U.S. citizens."

Well the us government disagrees with yiu.

Wow, this is totally bonkers! I really hope you manage to persuade her not to do this!!!

"I would have loved someone to shove an epidural down my back! I couldn't get one when I desperately needed it (for an emergency cs because baby's heart was in distress), because there was a shortage of anesthetists."

Wow, SofiaAmes so did you have a caesarean with no anaesthetic then?! What on earth happened?

Colder is absolutely correct about US taxes: all citizens have to file no matter where you live, even if you left the US as a baby or even if you have dual citizenship. This has nothing to do with PAYING actual money to the IRS. You have to file even if you owe nothing. Most people don't believe this because they're US citizens and have never filed and nobody ever chased up after them so they innocently think that this is proof that they are under no legal obligation to file. Admittedly, chances of being chased up by the IRS are slim to vanishing if you're not a millionaire, but this will change from next July.

sorry, that was a x-post. I of course agree that the mother should not be worrying about the (unborn) baby's future tax obligations at this time.