AIBU to hate charity Christmas shoe boxes?

[unlucky83]

We get asked to one from the school and from Sunday school ...2 Dcs that is 4 of them...last year I cut it down to 2 - doing the same this year
I really really really hate doing them...but DDs are upset if we don't ...
(at school they have an assembly where the people organising it talk to the DCs about them)...
We wander round the shops/supermarket making sure we get all the essentials on the list - buying the cheapest stuff there is ...kind of think hats/gloves/underwear are probably made by the people we send them back to..
I know I'm not on my own - everyone I know who does one says they do the same ...
Even then each box costs at least £30 ...could the money not be better spent directly by the charity buying good quality stuff that is going to last?
On the lists they say extras - like PJs - how the hell do you fit a pair of PJs for a teenager in a shoe box with all the other stuff...I find I can never fit much 'extra' in...usually just sweets as treats - good job they get toothpaste and toothbrushes or they'd have rotten teeth to add to their misery..

Then you have to find a box...then wrap the bloody things...
I just find it really difficult to wrap the box and lid separately and not get an end result that looks like it has been chewed by the dog...just spent the best part of 30 mins wrapping one that looks like a 2 yr old did it...

So am I being unreasonable to hate them and dread the leaflets coming home?

It begs the question, are there any NON-religious/Christian organisations doing a similar scheme?

I'm not an atheist. I'm Christian. And it's nothing to do with 'begrudging' - did you not actually read any of the links?

What some of these organizations do is horrible. You are the one with no idea of the real world if you believe some sentimental nonsense about 'the highlight of their year' withough questioning it.

Do they actually get the boxes at all?

tombi we do actually donate, you know. More, in fact. And more effectively.

Read the thread before insulting others.

This atheist stands for a number of things that are not immediately apparent in your "christian" post.

£30 does seem excessive. Couldn't you just spend what you can afford? Pyjamas for instance are useless to a child in Africa. (if that's where your donation is going). They have no concept of European customs. Eg. of things that an African teen might appreciate: A set of pens & notepad, a t-shirt or shorts, flip flops, simple toy, a mug or water bottle with an English premiership team's emblem on. A combination of a few of those things is ample.

However, if you're really unhappy about giving, just don't!

Ok but putting that aside. It does seem as though a lot of people are unwilling to give.

Why are schools supporting this charity if they're so shocking? OP, can't you decline the schools request, telling them you'll be donating elsewhere?

No, tombi I dont see any evidence that people are unwilling to give.

If they were, I agree that this would be unacceptably mean and selfcentred. Though I would say that giving all year round, and giving things that really help, ought to be our first priority. I am sure you and I both already do that.

What people object to, is the these organisations are taking people's goodwill and abusing it to deliver their unpleasant ideology around gay love and other issues to a vulnerable population. It's unethical. Not all Christmas box charities do, but enough do that I wouldn't touch them.

I felt slightly sad about your suggestion of a mug with an English premiership team on. I am sure you are right, and I am not blaming you, rather, I am uneasy about our footie culture. I know it's only a bit of fun. But there is something- I don't know- creepy about the way that we have exported our football branding across the world, to kids with their own culture and serious immediate needs. Playing football- good, fine. Supporting a team in another country that you will probably never see play live, being persuaded as an adult that you ought to want to buy expensive (fake) replica kit etc with your very limited funds- hmmmmm.

macthecat - not Harrods - primark, the poundshop, home bargains!
Actually I think I do probably get too much - I do everything on the list that is appropriate...I have now worked it out properly and it is less than I thought -about £24.60 including a £3 windup torch -which I know wasn't necessary ...
I know about how much I spend in each shop but usually get a few bits for us at the same time - eg I knew I spent 20 odd quid in home bargains but I when I looked I spent £4 on us!
And I have now discovered what a difference getting supermarket home label even - or 'everyday value' makes to what things cost...
I always thought supermarkets were expensive for toiletries but not if you get the cheapest stuff! The Addidas shower gel I got in Home bargains was £1 - 15 p cheaper than the equivalent in Tescos - ...but the Tescos home label stuff is only 70p! And two value toothbrushes for 18p!!! (I paid £1.20 for a three pack of 'Wisdom')....
Problem I guess is I always buy the same things - eg Aquafresh toothpaste - and in Tesco's it is usually more expensive...and never get men's toiletries ...
You live and learn...
Still bloody hate doing them though - I think it might be wrapping the boxes I hate most...fiddly horrible job ...
(And I know I can buy wrapping paper in the shops now! - I have in the past - probably part of the reason I have enough in the attic to open a shop ...and the reason this year I forced myself to face the attic!!! - which then fills me with horror as we are supposedly moving soon and I think I might seal it up and leave for the next people living here - could be a selling point - if they are going to have a baby they have everything they need in there - if they can find it!)

After reading this thread and the ones linked to within I thought I would check with our c of e school which charity they do this for. Lo and behold it is OCC. so I asked them to google some further information and come back to me with an opinion.
I saw the headmistress this morning and she said that the only negative they could see on the Internet was on an Islamic website and "they would wouldn't they"
So I pointed out that they are also a homophobic organisation and that on the guy from SPs own admission they were going to change the information sent to schools as it is not clear enough.
Surely no one can read the thread with gooner/ Brian on it and not see this thing for what it is?

do you think the islamic website is necessarily impartial? I did look at Samaritans purse website quickly and they were involved in the syrian crisis etc.

Alemci, if the only criticism of OCC the school could find was on an Islamic website then they probably need remedial Googling lessons. If I type

criticism opera

into Google then criticism operation christmas child is the second suggested search, and I've gone through five pages of results from that search without coming across a single Islamic website.

I was referring to the one someone linked to earlier on the thread and looked at it. to me the greater good of what occ do is more important.

I'm not going to comment on the pros and cons of the various charities organising these...I've already done my boxes for this year, so they're damn well going somewhere!! - though having read about OCC on here I may give them a miss in future years...

Agree totally with those who say they don't need to cost that much. Mine are pretty full (I'm doing 3 shoeboxes) and contain:

Pack of 4 toothbrushes - Asda smart price, I think 35p for 4
Toothpaste - Asda, 39p
Pack of 3 soap - Asda about 30p for 3
Sponge/puff thing for bath/shower (4 for £1 from a cheapie shop)
Scarf with mitten ends (50p donation to my neighbour for charity - she knits them)
Knitted headband - ditto
2 Packs of wine gum type sweets (6 for £1, poundland)
Pack of pens (39p)
2 exercise books (6 for £1)
Various toys that came in party bags and were duplicates or not wanted, so brand new but free - things like spinning tops, pairs games, bouncy balls
Cuddly reindeer- most costly thing at 1.99

So each box cost about £4 or so.

So YA probably NBU about the shoebox idea in general, but if you're going to do them YABU about how much they need to cost.

"the greater good of what occ do is more important"

Which greater good, and more important than what?

Erm...greater good? .

We did get their Director of Communications to admit that:

no-one is suggesting that a shoebox packed with gifts to the value of £10 is going to HELP a child in need

on the other thread...

Also a poster who's been in this position (refugee from ethnic cleansing) who said:

So a goodly percentage of our country said what we believe is now punishable by torture, rape, arson, death, whilst another religion steps in and gives our children shoeboxes filled with things they mostly can't use, have nowhere to store or carry and are just too traumatised to appreciate. They are invited to find out about/join the religion behind these gifts

And (admittedly on a 2008 thread) a poster whose child had been given a shoebox, who said:

the nursery school is a private one, and knowing the parents that send their kids there, the families are far from needy, and are in fact quite well off. These kids definitely don't fit the criteria being described on the charity's website. The content was very thoughtful (pens, sweets, soap, craft stuff, a cuddly toy, even a roll of blank paper to draw on) but nothing that kids here, even those with less well-off families, couldn't get hold of cheaply... Kids here, rich or poor, are spoilt (in the nicest sense of the word) and don't really lack stuff like this

I used to do them till i found out about the religious material being added. After a bit of research I started donating to marys meals instead. They also have a backpack appeal which im planning to do this year, if i can find somewhere to take the backpack to that is local.

www.marysmeals.org.uk/what-you-can-do/backpack-project/

I think the things recommended on the list would be about £10, they also recommend buying value and using second hand items.

OP, if you've got £120 in your family budget to burn on this then go ahead but stop moaning about it. I don't have it, so I don't do them, and the letter goes straight in the bin every year. And that's without even considering the appallingly questionable ethics behind the likes of OCC...

There are other ways to make a charitable difference at Christmas, which would be in the Christmas spirit of generosity, whether someone's Christian or not.

Quite right tavv as I said up thread, one of the most offensive frauds is the way these charities pretend that only Christians have donated. By stuffing their propaganda into every box regardless.

We are atheists who give at Christmas but we use respectable non faith based charities to do it.

This is a difficult topic. A mums' group I belong to helps to check the OCC boxes and seal them and no religious material is added. I also know people who have travelled to the shoeboxes' destination and saw how they were distributed and to whom. At no point were children bribed or coerced etc. I understand that not all the boxes end up with exactly the right people but if most do, then that's a good thing, as far as I can see. People have a right to share their beliefs with others so long as they aren't forcing them to adopt them. There are also much easier ways of indoctrinating children then this if that was your main objective.
I am not claiming these are the best thing ever to have happened to charitable giving but I don't think that means they should be outright condemned.
From my point of view it helps my children understand that they are very privileged in relation to pretty much the rest of the world and gets them to think about giving something to others. And yes, I know this is not the only way of doing this and I know that can be read as a selfish POV but it's one of the reasons we do them.

I have given out shoe boxes in Romania so have seen the reaction from the children receiving them.The first year I did it I was naive and inexperienced at about age 17. The children would grab hold of their boxes and scurry away quicksmart with them to give to their parents so the contents could be shared out with their family. I tried to open one box for a little boy who was so small it seemed heavy for him to carry. I wanted to show him what was inside and see his excitement. I took off the elastic band and in haste dropped it in the surrounding grass The little boy would not leave with his box until the rubber band was found. That insignificant detail spoke volumes to me.
A few years later the same boy was taken by the mafia and trafficked to Italy, came back a sullen, dejected teenager with empty eyes. The actuality of lives lived by people a short plane ride away is mind blowing. Giving out the boxes I saw the happiness it gave.Noone was lined up and forced to be baptized to receive them, it was more of a mêlée of 100+ pairs of hands grabbing indiscriminately.I make dozens of boxes up each year, it costs very little, nowhere near £30 and I am really sad people would refrain from passing on a bit of joy because of the thought it is a Christian based project.It seems to imply that impoverished people are likely to be brainwashed by a faith being shared with them which is odd to me because the poverty I have seen has never seemed to take away people's ability to make their own informed choices on what they believe.

Lots of people seem to be assuming that this is OCC or Samaritan's Purse or whoever. But that is not necessarily the case. Where I work we do shoe boxes every year but they go to children and teenagers in hostels for the homeless in the UK and there is definitely no religious connection.

And I have always managed a well stocked shoebox without getting anywhere near £30. Poundland anyone?