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Original poster

was i right to tell my ds not to apologise to this woman??

578 replies

mummyjs · 09/09/2013 21:22

my ds (4) and i were in the chemist waiting for a prescription.
my ds was stood by the door pressing the button to open it for people to come in and out and smiling at them and chatting away, people were saying than you and he was smiling and saying your welcome ect.
Anyway this older lady came in and he opened the door for him and she gave him a horrible look and barged past him. He said to her 'its nice to say thank you', which is something i drill into him so i suppose its my fault in a way. anyway she shouted at him 'how dare you speak to a adult that way' and then told me that i should control him and make him say sorry to her.
I have to admit my back was put up by the nasty tone in her voice and told her that i would not tell him to apologise, he was right, its rude not to say thank you and that a woman of her age should not need a lesson in manners from a 4 year old.
anyway she barged back out saying something along the lines of parents who dont control their kids ect.
was i being unreasonable? if he had of said anything rude to her then of course i would have made him say sorry, but i honestly dont think he was the rude one in this??

OP posts:
Lampshadeofdoom · 11/09/2013 09:38

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

xkittyx · 11/09/2013 09:46

I don't find other people's children cute. I like to be able to go about my day in privacy without being harassed. If a small child had seen fit to remind me of my "manners" I would have been offended. I would probably have just snapped at them directly though.

Jollyb · 11/09/2013 09:54

I probably wouldn't have said thank you as I wouldn't want to encourage an inappropriate game.

LurcioLovesFrankie · 11/09/2013 09:56

OP, while it is rude not to say thank you to someone who opens a door, it is equally rude to comment publically on other people's lack of manners.

Bonsoir · 11/09/2013 09:57

Your son was rude. You should have apologized.

Floggingmolly · 11/09/2013 10:00

no matter how rude or unpleasant that adult might be?
The lady simply walked through a door which opened in front of her; doubtless having no idea there was a pint sized doorman hanging about waiting to receive her effusive thanks. Then she gets upbraided by the little upstart for not engaging with his "game".

Then his bloody mother joins in!
I'd have uttered a few choice words myself in that situation; and none of them would have been thank you.

TheOriginalSteamingNit · 11/09/2013 10:49

I think one of my favourite comments on this thread was that he was pressing a button, not laying his cloak on a puddle (flogging?)

He was just knacking about with a button for fun, basically - not something I'd've encouraged.

chocoluvva · 11/09/2013 11:10

Wasn't there a button on the outside of the door to open it for people going in? I'm confused as to why it was helpful for someone on the inside to press it.

Could the lady have thought the little boy was being a mischief by making the door open even though she hadn't pressed the button or pushed the door, like playing a trick on her to deliberately confuse her?

Couldn't he amuse himself for "two minutes"?

Therealamandaclarke · 11/09/2013 11:15

The intolerance of healthy childhood behaviour demonstrated here is ridiculous.

"couldn't he amuse himself for two minutes"
FFS.
Cats bum mouths all over the place.

Sirzy · 11/09/2013 11:18

I don't class playing with doors as "healthy childhood behaviour"

Therealamandaclarke · 11/09/2013 11:24

And I don't consider amusing oneself by politely opening a door for approaching patrons "playing with doors"

Because I'm not bitter and I don't want to be cats - bum - mouthed going about my day.
Plenty of real shit to get grumpy about.

Therealamandaclarke · 11/09/2013 11:27

Maybe he was playing. But he was playing at being a nice polite boy.
He wasn't doing anything wrong.
He wasn't kicking the door, or stopping ppl from coming in or hanging off the door frame.
Yes. It's inappropriate to correct strangers' "manners" but the op has already ackowledged this and he's only four years old.

needaholidaynow · 11/09/2013 11:31

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

kali110 · 11/09/2013 11:43

I think he was rude, his fault?no hes only 4 and is learning. I think the way op handled it was the problem.

Sirzy · 11/09/2013 12:24

Sometimes people aren't in the mood to humour random children and their games and you can't expect everyone to want to.

kali110 · 11/09/2013 12:41

Sirzy, completely agree with you.
Dont know why everyone assumes this woman saw him opening the door. I would expect it or be looking for a small child opening the door.
Everyone thinks their child is adorable but may not feel the same about other peoples.
I think its funny how people are saying how can people call the little one so many bad names yet the names this woman has been called are revolting.

Lilacroses · 11/09/2013 12:41

Flogging, when I made this comment I was responding to one by president where she said that under no circumstances should a child correct or speak out of turn to an adult. I disagree with her in this instance but I also disagree that children in general should never correct adults. My friend's Dd, who was 6, spoke out when a lunchtime supervisor called her friend a "chinky". My Dd who is really very shy spoke out when her very domineering, scarey teacher described gay families as "a bit weird" Dd who has gay parents said bravely, " that's prejudiced,my family are not weird, we are just like everyone else". Does President think the children in both these situations were wrong to speak out?!

Whether the woman in this instance was being rude or not (and I do understand people's veiws about the electric doors and her not noticing him) I disagree that children in general should stay silent if someone is rude or insulting just because they are an adult. I might add that I am a very experienced teacher and I treat my young class with respect, likewise I expect them to treat me and each other with respect.

I have held this veiw for my entire time in teaching and I have never ended up with unruly, rude children. I've ended up with respectful, polite children who know how they like to be treated and try to treat others in the same way.

Lilacroses · 11/09/2013 12:44

Agree that the negative comments relating to the lady who walked through the door are awful and prejudiced.

Therealamandaclarke · 11/09/2013 12:44

He "held" the door open. Whether or not this was a game that someone didn't want to participate in (by staying outside maybe? Confused) doesn't matter. It wasn't intrinsically a naughty thing to do. Even if it was a game, it was still a nice thing to do.

Ideally she should have said thank you. For some reason she didn't. Not a massive deal.
Ideally the boy shouldn't have "corrected" her. But he's only four, he's learning.
The "older woman" was unreasonable in her over reaction; telling him off and demanding an apology.
The OP was probably a bit unreasonable in her over reaction to the woman. But has acknowledged that.
No one should be losing any sleep over this. It was a non issue.
But the child wins overall for politeness and good intention.

Therealamandaclarke · 11/09/2013 12:45

And I don't defence the "name calling" on either side btw. Towards the child or the woman.

PresidentServalan · 11/09/2013 13:03

Lila Actually yes, I stand by my original point. In your two examples, the adults involved obviously were wrong - however it is not up to a child to correct them. When they grow up, they are welcome to challenge people in that sort of situation. Until then, ticking off adults (particularly strangers) is just plain rude. And it may well elicit a very rude response.

needaholidaynow · 11/09/2013 13:04

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

chocoluvva · 11/09/2013 13:05

*Therealamanda" "it gave me two minutes to discuss medication".

What would the wider unintended consequences of this lady not coming in have been? Not that I'm defending her over-the-top behaviour - surely there was no need to shout and barge. In the next shop/restaurant etc OP's little boy plays with the door/another 'magic' button because it's fine to do that; his mum and the nice lady in the shop let him. But it won't always be fine.

Why did the lady in the shop encourage him to play with the door? To get him out of her and his mum's hair for two minutes - to stop him interrupting for two mins. He was probably wittering on incessantly ( if he's anything like my DC were when they were 4)Nothing wrong with teaching a 4YO that sometimes good manners means waiting for someone else for two minutes. He'll be at school next year.

Now he's confused - his mum and the nice lady in the shop let him open the doors, but a horrid lady shouted at him and made his mum very cross. He wasn't doing anything wrong but still he was shouted at by a scary lady. (who was probably confused by the door scenario and unaware that another adult had encouraged him to open the door.)The 'wrong doing' IMO was not telling him to be quiet for two mins while mummy talked to the chemist.

chocoluvva · 11/09/2013 13:10

If a child in the classroom won't stop interrupting for two minutes it's fine to ask them to be quiet/pay attention/whatever instead of finding a distraction for them though.

springydafty · 11/09/2013 13:32

re rank ageism on this thread: if in doubt, change 'old' for 'black' and see how it sounds.

the jokes about shawls, blue rinses etc don't tone the ageism down. We don't 'joke' about characteristics of other races because we recognise it as racism. I have reported one of your posts for ageism, bottle

The boy naively trotted out the phrase he'd been taught by his mum, unaware of the social implications. It was a naive comment, perfectly acceptable for a 4yo. The woman was a grouch. There are a lot of grouchy people about, don't worry about it. If you snapped at her then so be it. Whatever.