to hate it when women suggest their menflok are like an extra child?

[ChaosTrulyReigns]

If he doesn't step up to the plate, get them to improve and stop enabling the behaviuor.

It's not rocket surgery.

Yes, my DH does "step up to the plate" and I am grateful for that.

I'm sorry that you found my post offensive, that was certainly not my intention.

I have just spent time with someone who enjoys the "Oh, he won't even pop a teaspoon in the dihswasher, it;s like having an extra child." It irks me, I'm afraid, and I did decide to start a facile thread about it --will not mark threads as lighthearted.

I think you'll find there have been other posters on here who have been more vociferous than I on the situation, so I was surprised to be singeld out.

Again, apologies, offence was not intended.

I don't think YAB entirely reasonable. If DW is running ragged and DH does fuck all, with no hope of change then yes, YANBU.

My scenario is that DP is much less lazy than me, but hasn't a fucking clue about priorities. Thus we'll have a gleaming kitchen an polished hob when the spare room is still full of clothes we need to put away.

He's not a wean. He organises tradesmen, cook regularly, does DIY etc. He just seems to have a mental block when we come to generic clearing up. I plan to get a cleaner within the next couple of months (we have a bit of DIY to do first) to help.

Well, I'm sorry too for my outburst

I'm happy with my lot, my standards are too high and I suffered a lot when I had to houseshare.

I'm glad I have to clean 'our own shit' and not flatmates anymore.

And. I'll add, I saw your name on Active Cinversations, and gave a small smile - yours is the first name that I recognised on here (always linked it to HMRC) and then to find your post was negative and personal was quite jarring.

Sorry, crossed posted.

No worties.

ffs

worries

Sorry Chaos - you struck a nerve

Unintentionally struck a nerve (falls all over herself to make things right again)

The trouble is, what can you do when you're married/cohabiting with someone and have children with them and they refuse to do their share (or any) household chores

How did you not know this about him before you married/moved in together?

When we met we were teenagers and I just thought I was more adult and more independent than him because my parents had died and he was still growing up. When we were students sharing he used to say he didn't want to do his share as he didn't like the other students in the house and he said he'd do his share if it were just us, and I believed him. I also knew that he sometimes lived in disgustingly dirty houses as a student but that was the norm then and now for students! We lived together for a year before we got married and had our ds and I was aware that he had different cleaning standards to me but didn't see it as important. It was only when I came out of hospital with our newborn son that I realised I needed support and any reasonable adult would do and my h didn't fit the bill. He shared washing up, cooking and childcare with me but the cleaning always fell to me and he also created lots of mess. I know now that how he was when we first met is exactly how he's been ever since, always an excuse for not doing things, but I didn't understand that then.

Living together before marriage irons out kinks like this. If you discover you've moved in with a pathetic, lazy git you can get rid fairly easily.

I understand that there are religious/cultural/personal reasons why some people don't do this. In which case you've made a choice to go into the relationship blind, so you can't complain if a partner turns out to be not exactly as you'd hoped. It's a bit of a lucky dip then, and you'll just have to hope you got lucky with your choice and deal with the consequences if not.

I thought the right to complain was automatic and not contingent on all sorts of qualifying criteria

Well I guess you can complain into the void all you want but don't expect anything to change!

Living together before marriage and before dc doesn't teach you that when the baby cries he won't wake up and you will, or that when you go on maternity leave he'll suddenly think it's your job to pick up his dirty socks.

It depends on whether it's endless complaining but not doing anything about it hmc, or telling people with the view to asking their advice to find a solution.

People can endlessly complain about a situation they've no intention of changing, but they can't expect other people to not to tell them STFU get the thousand yard stare when they're talking about it.

The worst thing in what you've described Jan, is that you can't even go on 'strike', because they just won't give a monkeys.

Leaving you to live in the shit hole.

You're right jan it doesn't, and none of us have a crystal ball. That considerate, fully functioning adult could turn into a petulant toddler 'unable' to clean or do their fair share after their baby is born.

It's unlikely though, in my experience. Someone who behaves that way likely behaved that way or similar before babies. It was just less noticable and so many people ignore it or don't notice it because they think it doesn't matter.

Someone who pulls their weight and does their fair share before babies is likely to continue to do so afterwards.

Stuntgirl - you have an interesting and dare I say, unrealistic perpective on marriage, where cohabitation prior to marriage appears to be some sort of probationary road test where both parties rationally evaluate whether they want to 'cement' the relationship. Whilst this might well be a thoroughly sensible way to go on it ignores that most people get engaged in the context of heady, romantic love where each partner tends to be blind to the limitations of the other - hence even those who lived together prior to engagement may have failed to notice warning signs. That realisation that your patner is flawed only comes later. I'm glad for you if you got it right by pure chance

The best probationary road test is to ensure that before you marry or live together, your prospective mate has:

• had a functioning, adult relationship of more than 6 months duration;
• has a functioning, adult relationship with his or her parents, friends and workmates;
• has no criminal history;
• has run his or her own home, outside of the parental home. This can be a flatshare but ideally would be his or her own place;
• is kind to animals and children (this includes having a good exemplary relationship with his own children)
• does not own a Playstation or other gaming device.

Anything else can be ironed out.

I'd actually put the ban on gaming devices at the top of the probationary road test list, come to think of it.

Great test Kiwi, although I think there'd be a drop in the birth rate if relationships were always set up along such sensible lines.

And they also put anyone who struggles socially out of the running.

Agree on the gaming though, and also owning a guitar, obsessive collecting/sport (playing or watching)/car tinkering, being a workaholic or who loves their bed too much.

Not a chance kiwi, I'd go spare without my playstation, xbox, 3ds... Couldn't do the same to him!

Hmc - you're probably right in how I view it. I'm pretty mercenary when it comes to relationships though, it's either working or it ain't and I'm not willing to 'put up' with sub standard behaviour. I also take things v. slow. Problems do rear their ugly head after a while, so if you haven't careered head first into this relationship you have time to see the problems coming and deal with them/ditch them.

It's not entirely luck though. Believe me, I had some shitheads before my current partner. I got less willing to deal with crap and more vocal about what was acceptable over time. I would be willing to do the same if this one turned out to be a useless lump.

Agree on the gaming though, and also owning a guitar, obsessive collecting/sport (playing or watching)/car tinkering, being a workaholic or who loves their bed too much.

Oh god agent, you essentially just described my partner haha!

Owning a Guitar?

What's wrong with that?

You know I might be keeping that checklist and showing it to my children when they grow up and find partners!